Stadia Controllers Could Become E-Waste Unless Google Issues Bluetooth Update (arstechnica.com) 51
With Stadia coming to an abrupt halt, gamers want Google to issue a software update for the controllers that unlocks Bluetooth to allow them to work wirelessly with other game systems. It would also "avoid a lot of plastic and circuit board trash," adds Ars. From the report: Stadia's controllers were custom-made to connect directly to the Internet, reducing lag and allowing for instant firmware updates and (sometimes painful) connections to smart TVs. There's Bluetooth inside the Stadia controller, but it's only used when you're setting up Stadia, either with a TV, a computer with the Chrome browser, or a Chromecast Ultra. The Google Store's page for the Stadia controller states in a footnote: "Product contains Bluetooth Classic radio. No Bluetooth Classic functionality is enabled at this time. Bluetooth Classic may be implemented at a later date." (Bluetooth Classic is a more traditional version of Bluetooth than modern low-energy or mesh versions.) That potential later date can't get much later for fans of the Stadia controller. Many cite the controller's hand feel and claim it as their favorite. They'd like to see Google unlock Bluetooth to make their favorite something more than a USB-only controller and avoid a lot of plastic and circuit board trash.
"Now if you'd just enable Bluetooth on the controller, we could help the environment by not letting them become electronic waste," writes Roadrunner571 on one of many controller-related threads on the r/Stadia subreddit. "They created trash and they at least owe it to me to do their best within reason to prevent millions of otherwise perfectly good controllers from filling landfills," another wrote. Many have called for Google, if they're not going to push a firmware update themselves to unlock the functionality, to open up access to the devices themselves, so the community can do it for them. That's often a tricky scenario for large companies relying on a series of sub-contracted manufacturers to produce hardware. Some have suggested that the full refunds give Google more leeway to ignore the limited function of their devices post-shutdown. It's worth noting that you can still plug a Stadia controller into the USB port on a Smart TV, computer, or gaming console and use it as a controller through a standard HID (Human Interface Device) connection. But, currently, it's not possible to connect the controllers wirelessly, unless you go through a lot of effort.
"Now if you'd just enable Bluetooth on the controller, we could help the environment by not letting them become electronic waste," writes Roadrunner571 on one of many controller-related threads on the r/Stadia subreddit. "They created trash and they at least owe it to me to do their best within reason to prevent millions of otherwise perfectly good controllers from filling landfills," another wrote. Many have called for Google, if they're not going to push a firmware update themselves to unlock the functionality, to open up access to the devices themselves, so the community can do it for them. That's often a tricky scenario for large companies relying on a series of sub-contracted manufacturers to produce hardware. Some have suggested that the full refunds give Google more leeway to ignore the limited function of their devices post-shutdown. It's worth noting that you can still plug a Stadia controller into the USB port on a Smart TV, computer, or gaming console and use it as a controller through a standard HID (Human Interface Device) connection. But, currently, it's not possible to connect the controllers wirelessly, unless you go through a lot of effort.
Calling it now - Stadia Controllers new :CueCat (Score:3)
I remember back when the :CueCat devices dropped support that people wanted to use them for other things... but I think that died off quickly.
Are trees Stadia controllers good enough that people will actually use them even if unlocked? Or just a handful of people?
Seems like they were always destined to be e-Waste.
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^ This. CueCat is a great leading example here. The only tangible difference here is that Google is to blame.
Imnsho, this is no different than the metric tons of electronic goods shipped into the US that break within the first year of usage.
This is just rage against a tech company because it's fashionable. Get over it.
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Thing is, the CueCat still scans barcodes when plugged into USB. The Stadia controller is my favorite current-gen "console" controller due to ergonomics, and a lot of the things I'd want to use it with don't even HAVE a USB port to plug into these days
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CueCat was a bit different. In that case, nobody seemed to actually want one other than to hack and use it as an inexpensive barcode reader at a time when manufacturers charged a lot for barcode readers just because they could.
Support was dropped when they realized nobody actually used a CueCat as a CueCat anyway.
Even if it's just a handful of people, a simple release of internal documentation they already have would enable that handful to do what they want and keep some percentage of them out of the landfi
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The Stadia controllers are actually quite good. Decent buttons and d-pad, decent analogue sticks, fits well in the hand. They are a good choice for PC gaming, as long as you don't mind using them wired.
It should be possible to replace the firmware on them, but it will depend on either reverse engineering it or Google releasing the details. It may also have a secure bootloader that needs signed firmware, requiring Google to release they key or a bypass to be found. A bypass might be possible, if the security
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Are trees Stadia controllers good enough that people will actually use them even if unlocked? Or just a handful of people?
Seems like they were always destined to be e-Waste.
I have used some truly cheap and nasty controllers in my time, and they were well and truly "good enough". 99.9% of people who play games don't go out of their way to buy some magical high end controller promising some ultra low lag or extra tactile buttons to give you that competitive edge.
And Stadia controllers (which admittedly I've played with only once) seemed to be no worse than the standard xbox wireless controller, which itself is already higher end than a lot of the controllers on the market.
Craptastic analog drift will go to e-waste anyway (Score:3)
And Stadia controllers (which admittedly I've played with only once) seemed to be no worse than the standard xbox wireless controller,
Which means that in some (very close) near future, their analog stick will start drifting too much.
Because, like Xbox controller [ifixit.com], for the Stadia [ifixit.com] Google is also using potentiometers.
(Instead of going the SEGA Dreamcast. SEGA Satrun, and Tapwave Zodiac route and using solid-state hall effect sensors [ifixit.com]. But yeah. Let's save 0.01$ on each unit built~~)
Which means that you're only pushing back the console becoming e-waste by a year or so max.
Because by then, who is going to make easy replacement kits for a cloud c
This is going to get increasingly common (Score:4, Informative)
All the more reason to seek out open-source alternatives
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Which is the difference here. This isn't about a gadget that relies on a service, this is about a service that now leaves a gadget behind.
This really isn't completely true (Score:5, Informative)
Those Stadia controllers have a USB-C port on them, and when you plug them into a PC they'll work just like an Xbox controller without any special drivers.
Sure, it would be nice if they would work that way via Bluetooth as well, but asking Google to update their firmware for a dead product so it can work on competing gaming services is a bit of a stretch.
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Yes. Open sourcing the firmware and providing whatever documentation exists would be the best possible solution.
Asking Google to write all the Bluetooth firmware for this device that they have no further use for seems unreasonable.
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Don't Be Evil.
Re: This really isn't completely true (Score:2)
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enjoy your bricks... (Score:4, Interesting)
Google cut off the Nexus Android TV boxes at Android 7.something...and then forgot to ensure that those devices weren't given the 8.0 upgrade that wasn't going to work on them.
So EVERY Nexus Android TV owner got a wonderful brick, as 8.0 was forced on them and then the boxes refused to work, with no easy way to backtrack. Google refused to acknowledge that this was a problem, and continue to have that attitude years later. I still have my brick. I've refused to port my app to Android TV for this very reason and stuck to just Chromecast's protocol.
So I expect the same - they don't care, they won't care, you have a wonderful brick, just like the Glass owners now have a great looking piece of plastic.
Re: enjoy your bricks... (Score:2)
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I don't think Google Glass made it into actual public sale. And it was never "great looking". And you shouldn't forget that parts of Google Glass are still alive: The operating system and user interface. It's called "Wear" now and resettled onto watches. (which are way more comfortable to wear)
Stop buying google's crap (Score:5, Insightful)
How many times does G have to come up with a new device or service, gets a bunch of users but not enough to be #1 in a vertical then abandons the whole thing?
This happens every fucking time.
Stop it, just fucking stop, stop buying into G's shit.
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I got a stadia controler and the chrome cast that goes with it. They were free!
The chromecast is useful. Never plugged the controller though.
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Stop it, just fucking stop, stop buying into G's shit.
And yet Google gave refunds to people for both hardware and software in this case. If you're telling people to not work with Google due to e-waste then they don't care. If you're telling people to not work with Google because Google screws them then your comment fails to show how people were negatively affected by this drop given how simple they make it time and time again to migrate to something else.
Software / services don't exist in perpetuity. Google may have a worse track record of dropping them than o
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Truth modded down by Google employee, shareholder or other shill who can't debate with facts.
That's (+1, moral victory), thanks.
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You work for google, own stock or have friends who do?
No, no and yes one but she's not in any way related to any of these experimental services so that's irrelevant. But you think everyone who disagrees with you is on the take? I don't go around accusing you for working for Big Stupid, despite your posts.
They waste everyone's fucking time launching and killing products. Can they refund that?
The time taken to sign up for something or transfer to another service can be measured in single digit hours. The time available to be played on the platform in question here is years. They don't own you shit. Don't be an entitled whiny brat.
They have a terrible track record. They are not a tiny start up with a service that failed and then go out of business. Totally different situation. Who launches and kills more than they do? Anyone?
They also have an
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I'm going to ignore your standard Slashdot "ad hominem as debate technique and evidence" nonsense and go to the only thing you said worth a short reply.
Google does -not- have a great track record for innovation. They have a great track record for buying up startups with potentially interesting services and then ignoring or killing them.
Gmail was developed in house but web based email was not invented there. What a single google engineer did was make web based email faster than competitors who had web mail
If I were google (Score:4, Funny)
I would issue a firmware update that completely bricks the controllers.
A month later, release a new controller.
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For what purpose, exactly? The Stadia service is getting shut down completely on January 18th, 2023.
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What, do they need a _reason_ to do it? Do you want them to send you a personal letter, maybe?
This needs gov ewaste regulation (Score:4, Interesting)
If a manufacturer wants to brick a device, they should have to pay to have it disposed of correctly. There should be a law forcing Google to pay to send boxes and shipping labels to every stadia owner to have it sent back to Google or to an eWaste processing center. Either pay to dispose of the eWaste you created...or provide enough updates it can be reused for other purposes.
Your devices are unnecessarily disposable because we let manufacturers get by with that. They've colluded to remove replaceable batteries, upgradeable storage, and headphone jacks...things customers WANT, but hey, we need our phones. Take away a headphone jack or replaceable battery, but give us no alternative, the free market can't work and everyone suffers...especially this growing eWaste problem. This is an area where we can't trust industry to self-regulate. We need gov regulations to combat this, unfortunately.
If not that, do the soda can model...when you buy soda, beer, etc, you have to pre-pay the deposit. In my state, it's $0.05. A 12-pack has a $0.60 penalty automatically added at purchase. We should do the same with disposable electronics. If it costs $20 to process a laptop with a fixed battery, the customer should have to pay that money up front...give the manufacturers a good reason to both clearly label what is disposable and to actually make devices less disposable.
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Device manufacturers purposely make their devices ... disposable.
It costs money to make devices more robust. Most consumers are unwilling to pay those costs.
There should be a law forcing Google to pay to send boxes and shipping labels to every stadia owner to have it sent back to Google or to an eWaste processing center.
To be blunt, that is stupid. The emissions from all those shipments will be worse than just tossing the phone.
You should focus on far more important issues, like disposable diapers, which count for more waste in a day than phones do in a decade.
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In many cases, the cost of making the device repairable is pennies. Literally, less than 1 U.S. dollar. In other cases, not making the device harder to repair would actually save money, consider the cost (even qty. 100,000) of funky special new screws vs industry standard screws. Or the cost of applying glue to a million units vs. skip the glue. Or develop special snowflake update mechanism vs. use the one built in to the software toolkit that comes with the device.
There are a very few security applications
We pay the cost eventually (Score:2)
It costs money to make devices more robust. Most consumers are unwilling to pay those costs.
There should be a law forcing Google to pay to send boxes and shipping labels to every stadia owner to have it sent back to Google or to an eWaste processing center.
To be blunt, that is stupid. The emissions from all those shipments will be worse than just tossing the phone.
You should focus on far more important issues, like disposable diapers, which count for more waste in a day than phones do in a decade.
eWaste is typically filled with lots of toxic metals and chemicals that can leech into the water supply. Sure a diaper is disgusting and fecal matter is toxic for awhile, but once buried, it becomes fertilizer. I wouldn't eat tomatoes grown in a field of eWaste. Well-washed tomatoes grown in a field with composted diapers would probably be tastier and more nutritious than those you typically buy at the store.
However, regardless, disposable electronics cost us at purchase and cost us at disposal. Con
Bottle bills and state lines (Score:3)
If not that, do the soda can model...when you buy soda, beer, etc, you have to pre-pay the deposit. In my state, it's $0.05. A 12-pack has a $0.60 penalty automatically added at purchase.
How does this work when beverages are purchased in one state for consumption in another state, such as during a road trip?
We should do the same with disposable electronics.
How would this work for electronics purchased in one state for use in another state?
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A deposit/reverse collateral in the 5-10% range for bottles, glass and other temporary drinking vessels is a tried and proven method once paired with reverse vending machines. And state to state in the USA is significantly easier than country to country in the EU, but in both cases there are competing solutions with various success.
Electronics are a bit messier, but there are a lot of places where retailers are mandates by law to accept returns of what is essentially ewaste.
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Where I am (BC), they refuse to take out of Province bottles and cans and they're surprisingly good at spotting them, they're mostly American cans/bottles and the simple lack of French on the label is a give away though they do spot ones from the next Province over as well.. They do have bins to chuck them in so at least cans still get recycled.
They also charge for ewaste when you buy electronics, even a toaster. I think that money just finances the recycling centres, basically sorting. Probably mostly bala
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What difference is there between BC and Alberta bottles and cans? As much as they wouldn't want to put French on, I think they still have to.
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Not really sure, I did have some rejected due to being from Alberta IIRC, perhaps further east.
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If not that, do the soda can model...when you buy soda, beer, etc, you have to pre-pay the deposit. In my state, it's $0.05. A 12-pack has a $0.60 penalty automatically added at purchase.
How does this work when beverages are purchased in one state for consumption in another state, such as during a road trip?
At a nickel a can, we take the L...and we get the deposit back on the other 99% of bottles and cans that are purchased in-state and consumed in-state.
We should do the same with disposable electronics.
How would this work for electronics purchased in one state for use in another state?
Well, there are a few ways. First, you could enable big-box stores to use all of their locations as dropoff points; if a person in North Carolina bought something from a Best Buy in California on a vacation, it could still be returned locally. Alternatively, this could be solved even more easily if the distributor provided prepaid shipping labels and the devic
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Device manufacturers purposely make their devices, even expensive ones like phones, laptops and tablets, disposable.
This wasn't about making a device disposable. This was about making a device function. Stadia didn't function properly with standard bluetooth connections which is why they added WiFi to it in the first place. And if the bluetooth radio identified as a gamepad then the setup function wouldn't work correctly as the OS would consider it a standard gamepad.
This (specific case) isn't about a device being unnecessarily disposable.
FYI (Score:2)
I put a new connector in my 35 year old Nintendo and it's still up and running fine. There are a still a handful of games I haven't finished yet, so it still serves a purpose of entertaining me. I can't say the same for an Stadia or N-Gage 2.0, which belonged in the trash almost immediately after they were manufactured.
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It's pretty hard to break something that is basically just a printed board with a ttl logic chip enclosed in plastic.
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So what? (Score:4, Insightful)
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I guess you didn't read the part about some devices not having a USB port on them...
a lot of effort? (Score:2)
"A lot of effort" in this case means installing python (from an installer) and then installing a daemon (from an installer) and running it. If you think that's a lot of effort, you provably do not belong on Slashdot.
Probably non-trivial (Score:2)
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This is why we need right-to-repair legislation.