Apple's iPhone 13 Could Ditch the Lightning Port, Feature Next-Gen Vapor Chamber Cooling and In-Screen Fingerprint Sensor (appleinsider.com) 89
According to analyst Ming-Chi Kuo, Apple's upcoming iPhone 13 could feature vapor chamber cooling, as well as an in-screen fingerprint sensor. It may also completely ditch the Lightning port in favor of wireless charging. Apple Insider reports: Kuo believes Apple is highly likely to incorporate vapor chamber tech into an upcoming iPhone model, though it is not clear if the system will be ready in time for 2021. Generally speaking, vapor chamber (VC) technology involves evaporation of a liquid (typically water) within a specialized heat pipe or heat retention structure that snakes its way through a device chassis. Heat from processors and other high load electronic components causes the liquid to evaporate into a vapor that spreads thermal energy through the evaporation chamber as it travels to areas of lower pressure. Fins or other condenser bodies remove heat from the vapor, which returns to a liquid state and is carried back to areas of high pressure through capillary action.
"The iPhone's critical reason not to adopt VC is because of its reliability test results that cannot meet Apple's high requirements," Kuo writes. "Still, we are optimistic about the VC reliability improvement schedule and expect that at least high-end iPhone models would be equipped with VC in the near future." Kuo believes iPhone will need VC to keep up with rapid adoption of 5G and ever-increasing CPU thermal loads. In a separate report, Bloomberg reports that Apple is testing another key feature for its 2021 iPhone(s): an in-screen fingerprint reader. "This would add a new method for users to unlock their iPhone, going beyond a passcode and Face ID facial recognition," reports Bloomberg. "Apple won't remove its facial recognition scanner though as it's still useful for augmented reality and camera features."
The report also mentions that Apple is discussing removing the Lightning port on at least some of the 2021 iPhone models, instead relying entirely on wireless charging or USB-C.
"The iPhone's critical reason not to adopt VC is because of its reliability test results that cannot meet Apple's high requirements," Kuo writes. "Still, we are optimistic about the VC reliability improvement schedule and expect that at least high-end iPhone models would be equipped with VC in the near future." Kuo believes iPhone will need VC to keep up with rapid adoption of 5G and ever-increasing CPU thermal loads. In a separate report, Bloomberg reports that Apple is testing another key feature for its 2021 iPhone(s): an in-screen fingerprint reader. "This would add a new method for users to unlock their iPhone, going beyond a passcode and Face ID facial recognition," reports Bloomberg. "Apple won't remove its facial recognition scanner though as it's still useful for augmented reality and camera features."
The report also mentions that Apple is discussing removing the Lightning port on at least some of the 2021 iPhone models, instead relying entirely on wireless charging or USB-C.
Heh, real Vapor-wear (Score:3)
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Me, I'm looking forward to similar tech in the upcoming iRefrigerator.
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"news" (Score:3)
speculating a product might have this or that, maybe... what a waste, let's have real tech news.
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It's kind of a tradition... [misterbg.org]
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Generally speaking, vapor chamber (VC) technology involves evaporation of a liquid (typically water) within a specialized heat pipe or heat retention structure that snakes its way through a device chassis. Heat from processors and other high load electronic components causes the liquid to evaporate into a vapor that spreads thermal energy through the evaporation chamber as it travels to areas of lower pressure. Fins or other condenser bodies remove heat from the vapor, which returns to a liquid state and is carried back to areas of high pressure through capillary action.
Uhh... that's a heat pipe. That's exactly what a heat pipe does. So is "vapour chamber cooling" just "Apple (re-)invents the heat pipe and gives it a fancy name to make it sound like something new"?
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Everything in this article is speculation, not an official thing from Apple. So I guess the Vapor Chamber thingy was invented by someone else.
fingerprint again (Score:2)
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I'm looking forward for fingerprint authentication again. Face recognition is a total disaster, for example with low light or then with mask on.
I'm having a much better experience with face recognition than with my prior Touch ID phone, which kept spurning my worn fingerprints. Having to pull my mask down for a second at the checkout register is a really small problem. All those apps that use biometric ID are far easier to use with Face ID.
Apple's face recognition works well (Score:1)
I'm looking forward for fingerprint authentication again. Face recognition is a total disaster, for example with low light or then with mask on.
I wouldn't go back to fingerprint if I had any choice. Sure right now face recognition doesn't work with a mask, but then fingerprint scanners don't work with gloves, and the mask think is relatively temporary.
FaceID has been way more reliable for me than fingerprint scanning was.. and as someone else noted, if you are saying low light is an issue you have been us
Re:fingerprint again (Score:5, Informative)
Face recognition is a total disaster, for example with low light
That's actually not correct. FaceID uses the "TrueDepth Camera" which uses infrared and works in total darkness [apple.com].
Furthermore, it's designed to work indoors, outdoors, and even in total darkness.
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I've watched my coworker try to unlock his recently updated iPhone with his face, and without a mask on, and fail... in ordinary lighting conditions in which I could have taken a decent snapshot.
It doesn't work well in normal lighting conditions. Maybe it actually works in the dark?
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Mine works fine in any condition. It has always been. The only fail if with a mask on.
Fun fact: When my father in law bough his new iPhone, I saw him unlock it by typing the code over and over again. So I asked him why he didn't use Face id. He told me that he saw countless people in the doctors waiting room (he'd been spending quite a long time in hospitals and doctors by then) struggling and grimacing at their phones trying to unlock them, having to remove their glasses and so on. He didn't want any of th
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Why on earth would you want biometric authentication? I love codes. Only I know them, but I can give them to a trusted person (and change them) if I need to. And the government cannot force me to give them a code (legally).
Wired charging just works. I can have a wire going to a battery pack in my jacket and recharge on the go. Wireless charging is cute, but less convenient.
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Biometric is more convenient. Typing in a 6 digit PIN (or a passphrase, if you're really, really security conscious) requires significantly more fiddling with the phone than "look at the screen" or "put finger on sensor". Given that I unlock my phone probably 50 times a day, it adds up.
The simple reality is that 99.999% of users don't care about the minor security tradeoffs. How many people are realistically worried (for pragmatic, not philosophical reasons) about the government being able to get into th
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You unlock your phone 50 times a day? Why? Maybe my issue is just that I don't use my phone often enough to find the tradeoff positive.
I'm not realistically worried about the government getting into my device - although you had the warrant backwards. I believe a warrant is required to force your fingerprint (legally), but no warrant can force your password (in the US).
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I honestly couldn't tell you. I'm going by the numbers in the "screen time" stats that my phone collects. If I had to guess, a solid 10-15 unlocks per day are because I have an authenticator app on my phone for accessing systems I use at work (and as I think about it, the authenticator app itself also does a biometric authentication, which I'd otherwise have to enter a PIN for). Maybe I should switch to a dedicated 2FA fob, but meh. Another 10-15 are probably me biometrically authenticating to read a no
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My passcode is more than 15 characters long, which means that it would take someone actually trying to hack my phone several million years to do it given the throttled rate that you're allowed to make guesses to the secure enclave. While my phone is in my possession, I'm less worried about people trying to hack it, or indeed, even the police trying to unlock it (though there's a quick way to disable the face unlock—just squeeze the power and volume buttons simultaneously for a few seconds) while I'm p
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What about a phone with one part of the memory encrypted with plausible deniability like the Nitrokeys have in their 'storage' versions?
(https://www.nitrokey.com/#comparison)
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Wireless charging isn't convenient, and very much is not portable. It tosses the cable in exchange for a relatively fixed location for the phone.
Yes, it is also interestingly flexible, you could charge a phone, earpods, and a speaker, but portable? On and off in the car, though car use is being restricted more and more by law, and what do you do at a temporary location, tote a charging pad?
Not going to be wireless-only charging. More likely a USB-C port, but those seem bigger than Lightning, and well size d
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Wireless charging is great for things like your nightstand or desk while you're working on a computer (though, would be nicer if your phone mirrored onto your computer so you didn't have to pick it up to check things). It's also good for high-traffic area charging such as tables in fast food or coffee joints. No cables to break, lose, or steal. Great...but!
Wireless charging is really stupid for any use case where you're interacting with or even simply holding the device. Will the apple "solution" be wir
Hmm ... okay (Score:4, Funny)
Apple's upcoming iPhone 13 could feature vapor chamber cooling, ...
Will it be available in a variety of flavors or just menthol?
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I was intrigued at "It may also completely ditch the Lightning port..." thinking "finally USB-C on iPhone!", but alas, it was not to be. Wireless charging is a dumb idea, it is inefficient and wastes electricity.
Apple have been gagging for years to be able to remove all ports from the iPhone as they are a jailbreak opportunity, so closing that up is happy days for them. They also create a sales/licensing opportunity for Genuine or Certifed Apple Accessories.
Even more reasons t
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Wireless charging is a dumb idea, it is inefficient and wastes electricity.
Not if you line the iPhone up exactly with a compatible wireless charger, which the new MagSafe system does automatically.
I heard that... (Score:2)
If you put neodymium magnets between the iPhone and the charger it works even better.
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Nothing like some tiny, powerful magnets to mess up your credit cards, room keycard, and cassette tapes!
Even a perfectly aligned wireless charger is less efficient than a wired one though...and what does that really accomplish? My "wireless" charging now requires not only a wire, but now a magic apple hockey puck (yay something else to break) unless I want to leave it on my desk all day.
I know these companies all need to add/change things to keep selling units, but really...a charging wire works just fine.
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Is it just a fancy term for heat pipe?
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Should Apple's offering make it from vapourwear to product, I look forward to people telling me how revolutionary it is to have this brand new technology I've had in my desktop PC for over a decade.
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You jest but for all the wrong reasons. The technology is similar (even often called flat heatpipe) but the application wildly different. Heat pipes are good at moving heat over a small surface area but over a large distance. Vapour chambers are good at moving heat over a large surface area but a very small distance. This is important because heatpipes do not interface with chips very well due to their dimensions and are actively limited by poor contact with the heat source and lack of surface area. But vap
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Not quite, though they work on same principles they are quite different in construction and above all heatflux and effect. Heatpipes are great at moving heat over longer distance but really poor at interfacing with silicon, they are pipes and roundish, and have low surface area. Vapour chambers are flat 2D constructions with internal bracing that give a very large surface area, can directly contact and entire (or multiple) chips, and are very efficient at moving heat only a mm or two at the most, but their
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No, heatpipes are a phase change cooling device, vapor chambers use gas that stays in the same state.
Heat pipes are directional - the liquid evaporates and travels to the cooler end through natural diffusion where it condenses. The liquid then flows back to the hot side via gravity, meaning the heat source needs to be lower than the cool side. It can go up a small amount via capillary threads that are built into the pipe.
Vapor chambers don't rely on gravity and thus are
Whatever (Score:1, Insightful)
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And all the other companies will first laugh at Apple for doing these things, but then they will do the exact same things and their consumers will buy it because they won't have a choice either.
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So what you're saying is that the consumers of those other phones have already been buying them like they have been programmed to do... regardless of the features.
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So what you're saying is that the consumers of those other phones have already been buying them like they have been programmed to do... regardless of the features.
Consumers of other platforms have a choice. They can buy phone with it or they can buy phone without it.
heat pipes are not new (Score:2)
> Feature Next-Gen Vapor Chamber Cooling
Sigh, nothing new here.
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Vapour chambers in consumer tech very much are new. Outside of a the occasional pointless part they haven't actually featured in consumer electronics due to high cost and lack of use case (low power densities or low overall power dissipation requirements).
Comparing them like heatpipes is like comparing a tractor to a Lamborghini, they both have 4 wheels, an engine, and are even built by the same company. But there are some subtle differences relevant to where you may consider using one or the other.
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I can't help feeling that this would have worked a lot better with the addition of e.g. "Aventador".
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What? Every laptop I've had for the last decade (or more) has a heat pipe in it. You must have a narrow definition of consumer electronics.
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Yes they do. Basically none have vapour chambers in them. They are NOT the same thing just because they work on the same principle. Vapour chambers have featured in Intel Itaniums, Asus ROG mobile phones, and Sapphire Vapor-X GPUs (for marketing purposes, not because they were necessary). Very recently they have started becoming necessary and that has largely been the shift to 7nm concentrating power density. You will find an occasional laptop with a vapour chamber, but only high end ones due to their desig
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New form factor, sure - same principal, moving heat in a closed system using evaporative cooling and a capillary system to move fluid. Even most of the materials are the same, its just different construction.
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A tractor and a sports car are also based on the same principle, hell they are even made by the same company. Both have wheels internal combustion engines, complete with cylinders, most of the same components including differentials, cooling systems. You don't consider them the same thing do you?
Construction matters and makes differences that exceed orders of magnitude. Vapour chambers can move heat an order of magnitude more effectively than a heatpipe. They also can't move them very far as they rely on su
Stop calling it the iPhone 13! (Score:2)
Have any of these analysts bothered to notice that almost no buildings in the US have a 13th floor? It's considered a cursed number due to superstition. Do they seriously think Apple is going to introduce a flagship product and be like, "okay, you survived COVID, now treat yourself to a wonderful new iPhone THIRTEEN?!?"
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Haven't they been selling 13" laptops for over a decade?
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I thought they were all 13.3" laptops for that reason. No?
Re: Stop calling it the iPhone 13! (Score:3)
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Apple priced their first computer $666. I am pretty sure they could care less about superstition.
VC reliability? (Score:1)
It just has to be better than the battery, or the screen [apple.com]
Next gen vapor chamber? (Score:1)
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No, a vapour chamber which have been used in select specific phones for years. Vapour chamber and heatpipes are like tractors and Lamborghinis. Just because they both have engines and wheels doesn't mean there aren't other considerations as to when you may want to use one vs the other.
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Vapour chamber and heatpipes are like tractors and Lamborghinis.
I hope that was an in-joke there :)
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It was, mainly because the companies producing heatpipes are also the ones who produce vapour chambers ;-)
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then squishing the tubing flat. Presto insta "Vapor Chamber"
Instant fail. You've just produced something that isn't manufactured flat having a poor contact area, has an incorrect internal wicking design, and best of all would be instantly damaged when mounted or heated up due to the lack of internal supporting structure necessary to flatly apply 50 pounds of mounting force. It will also certainly be incorrect dimensions for a sensitive application like a chip cooler and perform very poorly as well. Please let designers do their work, armchair engineering has not pla
Was anyone crying out for this? (Score:1)
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As someone pointed out above, this is all about removing options for jailbreaking and locking the phone down even further.
Designing a cooler that could shunt the heat efficiently out and away from the induction charger and the battery would allow permanent removal of cables and ports.
As a bonus feature, it could be the first completely waterproof phone.
Also, practically unrepairable piece of junk and an energy waster which might not be importable in Europe. [zdnet.com]
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You forgot, REALLY EXPENSIVE practically unrepairable piece of junk and energy waster which might not be importable.
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Even removing the lightning port wouldn't remove all the holes. You still need a microphone and speakers and the power/volume/mute switches have stubbornly hung around.
I'd say the current level of waterproofing is sufficient - I went snorkling with my 1-2 generation old samsung a while back, got some great videos, and rinsed it off with my water bottle. No issues at all. The added complexity to turn it into a 10m dive camera would be impractical to say the least. I'll take a depth rated camera.
They could add back a 3,5mm jack (Score:5, Insightful)
now that would be a cool retro feature.
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When they started considering forcing CV19 apps on people I was glad I went back to my ancient BB10 phone. I'm going to use it till the carriers stop supporting 4G/LTE that it uses.
Vapo chamber is not "next-gen" (Score:2)
It has been present in android phones for at least 3 generations now.
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Technical vapour chambers were developed in the 80s, and heatpipes they are based on in the 60s.
12s (Score:2)
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Finally (Score:4, Funny)
Wireless and more space than a Nomad.
Hm (Score:2)
Looking forward to these features in the ultimate smartphone for this decade.
1. Front facing camera under-display. In the case of Apple, front facing LIDAR-under display.
2. Better rear LIDAR.
3. Folding phone that has no crease. Samsung Galaxy Fold 2's form factor would be great, if it didn't have a crease down the middle.
4. 16 hour battery life.
My guess is that these will happen by 2025. After that they should work on manufacturing so that phones with these features can be available for under $100 by 2035 (
Developing is going to be a party (Score:3)
If you're developing apps, then Xcode allows you to code and then debug/run your apps on your iPhone/iPad, over WiFi. However it's way less reliable and slower. If they remove all ports and rely on wireless charging, I really hope they come up with something different than WiFi to communicate with the devices.
Apple (Score:2)
Hi Apple,
Welcome to several years ago.
"in-screen fingerprint reader" is on several dozen models of phone already.
USB-C is on just about every other phone model in existence.
That water-cooling thing sounds like it's not gonna be ready and even if it is... I very much doubt that most phones are thermal-limited.
Why do Apple's press releases / "upcoming features" / iOS changelogs always read like something from three years prior to their release and their competitors already have everyone on that list?
The last
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It's only fucking retards such as yourself that pretend that Apple is claiming to have invented or developed any of these features from nothing. Only fucking retards such as yourself think it's a contest. Only fucking retards such as yourself think it's worth even noting.
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Well, I'm glad to see that you're so passionate because of a phone vendor. Maybe channel that energy into something more productive.
Because at no point do I say they claimed to have invented those things. I'm just telling you that they are YEARS behind their competitors. Years. Decades in the case of some basic OS / GUI features.
But this seems to have hit some kind of nerve with you. Why is that? Why are you so concerned about Apple's image? Why are you so attached to a brand of a device?
And, I'm sor
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On thermal limiting, I'm wondering if it has to do with how thin they're trying to make them? Lack of thermal mass?
MacRumors.com has been redesigned (Score:2)
When did slashdot become macrumors? Maybe wait until there is an actual product?
wireless charging (Score:1)
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Instead of carrying around a thin, inexpensive cable for charging on-the-go, I'll have to carry around an expensive hockey puck and replace all my cables with them?
I'm all for ditching lightning and switching to USB-C, but to have no port is crazy.
And over the millions of iPhones in the world, how much extra electricity will be wasted by making the charging far less efficient?
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But it'll be a stylish eggshell white hockey puck!
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But it'll be a stylish eggshell white hockey puck!
Which is so fragile you'll want to buy two upfront. Don't ask or complain about the cost! Don't you care compare the Apple puck with some lame, lowly, 3rd party wireless charger that merely conforms to published standards for 1/10th the price. It'll pop an unauthorized charger message every 23.5 seconds.
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"unauthorized charger message" ... funny you should mention that. I have a company issued macbook pro that apparently was damaged in some way by the most recent power outage. It now doesn't recognize the Apple charger and Apple cord that came with it. System Info shows the supply connected but not charging. Swapping it with the other Apple charger I use for traveling gives the same message.
If I shut down the mac and plug it in, it WILL charge, so I've been doing that -- using it until exhausted, then sh
Not just cooling (Score:2)
the phone will also incorporate a turbine and generator, to recover some of the energy from this cooling system. Finally we'll have a steam-powered iPhone.
CarPlay (Score:2)
My biggest issue with removing the port is CarPlay. My iPhone is a $1000 investment -- my cars are a $50k+ investment that lasts a lot longer (hopefully until about 2027). If they remove the port and don't offer some sort of wireless->wired adapter, I won't be upgrading. At this point I have 3 vehicles at my house totalling $130k in cost that all rely on CarPlay for navigation.
There are a couple of such adapters today made by third parties, but (a) you still lose the ability to charge your phone in
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Ahem...are you not signed up for the new iDrive from Apple? No guarantee they'll have 4 wheels on it, seats may be optional, and the fuel source costs extra if you want any usable capacity. What's not to love? Starting at only $199k and available in 3 colors, 2 sold out, delivery in whatever time frame we choose.
FWIW though, if you have that many very expensive cars there are other available options for navigation. I'm equally sure Apple's not going to abandon their role in car audio/navi/interface.
What about music creation on iOS? (Score:1)
regarding the fingerprint sensor (Score:2)
Samsung went to a on-screen fingerprint sensor on the Note 10 a couple years ago. It so happened that the Note was a company issued phone, and we used biometrics liberally to unlock access to company resources. I had been issued a Note 9, with the sensor on the back, and it worked surprisingly well.
An hilarious (as I look back at it now) series of bad decisions resulted in the Note 9 screen being broken, and rather than pay to have it fixed, the company issued me a Note 10.
The main difference was that the