Should Cellphone Chargers Be Sold Separately? (theverge.com) 214
The Verge writes:
Lei Jun, the CEO of Chinese phone maker Xiaomi, has confirmed that its upcoming Mi 11 phone will not come with a charger, citing environmental concerns. While that's a legitimate argument against providing yet another hunk of plastic that resembles all the other chargers people already have, Xiaomi joined other phone makers who poked fun at Apple a few short months ago for not including chargers with the iPhone 12.
Jun made the remarks on Chinese social media site Weibo, saying people have many chargers which creates an environmental burden, and therefore the company was canceling the charger for the Mi 11.
Apple's decision not to include chargers with the iPhone 12 was met with some derision, and competitors like Samsung reminded customers in an ad that charging bricks were "included with your Galaxy." That Galaxy ad has apparently been deleted, however, as rumors continue to build that Samsung won't include a charger with its upcoming Galaxy S21 phones.
Jun made the remarks on Chinese social media site Weibo, saying people have many chargers which creates an environmental burden, and therefore the company was canceling the charger for the Mi 11.
Apple's decision not to include chargers with the iPhone 12 was met with some derision, and competitors like Samsung reminded customers in an ad that charging bricks were "included with your Galaxy." That Galaxy ad has apparently been deleted, however, as rumors continue to build that Samsung won't include a charger with its upcoming Galaxy S21 phones.
Honestly... (Score:4, Insightful)
... the companies that make the chargers and the companies that make the batteries, and the companies that make the phones, should all be broken up and forbidden from collusion.
Re:Honestly... (Score:5, Insightful)
This is doubly true for cordless power tools... the bastards actually go out of their way to make the batteries incompatible with each other.
Re:Honestly... (Score:5, Insightful)
Power tools is an area where we need some legislation. Home electricals too, e.g. razors and electric toothbrushes. They seem to love non-servicable batters and proprietary chargers.
USB-C and a standard battery, mandated by law.
Hell no (Score:3, Insightful)
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Yeah it might be nice if Bosch Milwaukee and festool all shared the same charger but Iâ(TM)d rather they each had their own benefits and the ability to choose between heavier higher capacity batteries and lighter lower cap versions
That's not how that works at all.
What would be standardized is the connector and the form factor. Batteries could be LONGER or SHORTER to accommodate more cells for more (or less) capacity, but they would all still plug into the same interface. The interface would probably have at least four pins. +/-, temp, and a digital interface. Modern power tools are having communications with their batteries to determine maximum output. There's no reason this low-bandwidth communication needs more than one pin.
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No reason you couldn't limit yourself to buying same-brand batteries whose weight was optimally balanced for the tools - even today most brands offer interchangeable high-capacity batteries for their more power-hungry tools, which can also be used in less demanding tools at the expense of throwing off the balance.
What would change is that brands could no longer claim excess profits on the batteries just because nobody else could legally sell replacements because of patent-encumbered interfaces. If a DeWalt
Re: Hell no (Score:3)
That is not a problem at all. Literally all power tool batteries are basically identical now, albeit in one of two groups. There are those with two cells which go into the grip, and there are those which clip onto the bottom of the grip. So we would need only two standards.
Re:Honestly... (Score:5, Informative)
USB-C supports USB Power Delivery up to 100W. It's designed for, among other things, battery charging.
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As for including the charger, as long as it doesn't go to margin, and the costs are shifted into better components, more impressive metals and raw materials, or
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That's Apple, which has an established supply chain and retail outlets in every shopping centre for battery replacement.
Try that with any Android brand and YMMV. Your local ma and pa repair may only carry battery stock for certain models and for a limited time.
With my mother's Galaxy S4 I can purchase a battery cheap off eBay and replace it in a minute every 2nd Christmas.
Yes (Score:2)
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What about phone radios? Shouldnt you be plugging in a 3rd party 5G module?
They should come with a charger if the purchaser expects a charger in the box. Full stop.
Re:Yes (Score:4, Interesting)
I think it's pretty obvious why your analogy is bad, but just in case: you generally can't interchange phone radios and screens. You can interchange chargers generally. And chargers often interoperate with other phones and other non-phone devices in the same household, while the other components do not.
Also, some purchasers expect a charger in the box, some don't give a shit, so the "full stop" isn't the end of that sentence. Customers could expect a screen protector or a case to come with a phone, but they typically don't, whether or not those phones have form factors that are relatively standard.
Still, you could satisfy the purchaser who expects the cable by having the "phone & charger" bundle be a common option at point-of-sale for new purchases (as opposed to trade-in or replacement).
Flip side of all this is I personally find that my chargers don't last as long as my phones, so a free cable within is not an increase of waste, it's actually a net decrease since there's no packaging around my separate purchase of a replacement charging cable. So I'd like the cable to remain packed in. I just think you're making a poor argument for it.
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My most recent phone (Pixel 5) came with a charger. I'd rather it didn't. The charger is just an 18W USB C model, of which I have a few already.
18W is a bit awkward. I'd rather spend a few bucks more and get a 65W charger that can handle laptops as well. If I'm going to carry one it will be that, one charger for every device.
Most of the time I use a 2.5W charger or my computer's 2.5W USB port. Via wireless, so actual charge current is more like 400mA. I don't want to charge fast, that wears the battery out
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The real differentiator is how often you replace your phone.
I don't replace my phone often, so I only have one USB-C charger. There are only two or three places I can fast charge my phone. One is with the official charger, and the others are PCs. I only know for sure that one of them will fast charge my phone (the port on my desktop) and I haven't tried the type C port on my laptop yet.
So for my part, I want a phone to come with the charger, since I only have one and would like another one. And that's becau
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The ideal (and I mean this tongue-in-cheek) smartphone would be modular, but would also end up being much bigger by necessity.
1) The screen, digitizer, camera, microphone and speakers (basically what makes up the front) would be sold as one part
2) The battery, and usb-c port would either be part of the back, or removable from the back
3) The middle of the phone contains only the PCB and the rear camera unit. The PCB would have the NVMe storage mechanically removable from the base PCB. The radio PCB would be
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What about phone radios? Shouldnt you be plugging in a 3rd party 5G module?
Purism's Librem 5 has the modem and wifi/bt radios on m.2 cards. You can choose from a few different options when you order. As 5G isn't offered by Purism, I assume many Librem5 users will indeed be plugging in a 3rd-party 5G module when it becomes available and has decent driver support. Dealing with the antenna will be the tricky part.
It would be nice if they offered an option to save the user a few bucks buy the phone without the modem slot populated.
The modular design results in a very thick phone. It
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Should phone screens be sold separately? What about phone radios? Shouldnt you be plugging in a 3rd party 5G module?
Yes, yes, and yes. In fact ideally every component of your phone should be sold separately so it can be replaced at any time, or so components can be upgraded adhoc without throwing away the entire device.
The reason why phone screens are different from chargers is that they are not compatible between devices due to miniaturisation requirements. If the charger was built into the phone instead of at the other end of a USB cable then it too would by necessity be sold as part of the device. Anything that isn't
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They only thing I would do is ask brick and mortar stores to offer chargers for sale at the exact same locale as the phone with a reminder. As well as more featured chargers, sort of arrayed at the bottom row of the display, as in don't forget to buy a charger if you need one. The ones that come with the phone are pretty crappy. An additional port you can charge another device or the phone can access a large usb thumb drive whilst charging, to play content, or transfer files.
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Now virtually every device, with the exception of Iphone, uses USB C. Almost all phones can simply be plugged in using any USB plug, which are increasing available. No adapter is needed. While the PD standard is not absolutely uniform
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The EU forcing standards for cell phones has been one of the best things that has happened to the industry. Of course Apple is still in the corner with its own Lightning standard, getting past the EU mandate with bundling an adapter, but before this went into effect, basically every phone had a completely different charging cable. Some phones used their own flat-edge connectors like Apple's 30 pin, some had round connectors, some used oddball USB variants, one phone I saw even used the audio jack with add
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Bull Fucking Shit - the answer is NO!
That is a default answer on
Not a huge issue (Score:2)
I'd say no, as that would hopefully prompt cell phone manufacturers to stop changing the technology.
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The Industry Follows Apple Again (Score:5, Insightful)
Apple: Drops non-USB Legacy ports
Others: Laugh at Apple for dropping non-USB Legacy ports
Others: Drop non-USB Legacy ports
Apple: Drops Floppy drives
Others: Laugh at Apple for dropping Floppy drives
Others: Drop Floppy drives
Apple: Drops Floppy CD/DVD Rom drives
Others: Laugh at Apple for dropping CD/DVDs drives
Others: Drop CD/DVD ROM drives
Apple: Drops Headphone jack
Others: Laugh at Apple for dropping Headphone jack
Others: Drop Headphone jack
Apple: Drops Charging brick
Others: Laugh at Apple for dropping Charging brick
Others: Drop Charging brick
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Apple: Drops x86
Others: Laugh at Apple for dropping x86
Others: Drop x86
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considering no one has dropped x86.. . . . . . .
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What is with you Apple fanatics always wanting to re-write history to only make it look like Apple does anything in tech?
Here is some documentation from Microsoft about Windows 10 ARM being able to run x86 code in Feb of 2018:
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/uwp/porting/apps-on-arm-x86-emulation#:~:text=Emulation%20for%20x86%20apps%20makes%20the%20rich%20ecosystem,unless%20it%20calls%20specific%20APIs%20(%20IsWoW64Process2%20). [microsoft.com]
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It is happening. I'm seeing CPUs by Ampere Computing going to 80 cores. It is only a matter of time before ARM or RISC-V reach speed parity with at least the desktop line of CPUs, if not competing head to head with EPYC or Xeons.
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Others: Laugh at Apple for dropping x86
Who?
Re:The Industry Follows Apple Again (Score:4, Informative)
Not a mac user, but is this correct?
Apple: Drops escape key
Others: Laugh at Apple for dropping escape key
Apple: Restores escape key
Re:The Industry Follows Apple Again (Score:5, Insightful)
Apple: lets have a 1 button mouse
Others: 2/3 button mouse
Apple: lets add a button
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Around 2015-2016, Lenovo had a laptop which replaced the escape key and the function keys with a touch bar... which didn't work under Linux. They also remapped things like the "|" key to really oddball locations. I had to use one for a work laptop for a month or so... wound up using a USB keyboard with it, since it was such a pain to use.
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Many computers still have legacy ports too, particularly PS2 ports as gamers think they offer lower latency. Many motherboards still have serial port headers too, often unpopulated but still...
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From 2016: "Apple's New Macbooks Are Dumping the Escape Key"
https://www.popularmechanics.c... [popularmechanics.com]
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So Apple never dropped the escape key,
as a vim user with (until recently) one of those awful machines who suffered at work for several years: fuck you and the horse you rode in on. :)
Seriously though. They dropped the key and replaced it with a soft keyboard. There's a reason they didn't replace the entire keyboard with a soft keyboard because it sucks for regular use. The lack of an actual escape key was bad if you wanted to use it regularly.
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I mean, I stopped buying new iPhones and new laptops because of DVDs and headphone jacks respectively. And I've been using bluetooth headphones primarily for a while now - I just still have an excellent headphone jack based headset that doesn't rely on batteries.
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The headphone thing I can appreciate, but DVDs drives, what are you using them for?
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Apple : lets go with Power PC
Others : lets continue with with x86
Apple : Lets drop Power PC and go with x86
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Apple : lets go with Power PC
I mean, given PowerPC was Motorola's replacement for the 68k that move made perfect sense.
Not to mention industry sentiment at the time was that CISC was an obsolete technology.
Even Intel wanted to get off CISC, though in the end their VLIW replacement ended up being a complete dead-end while much to everyone's surprise they were able to keep their CISC designs competitive with RISC.
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I luved my PowerPC Macs back in the day - they rocked!
I had 3 or 4 of them, I forget exactly
Re:The Industry Follows Apple Again (Score:4, Insightful)
Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't. For example -
They dropped USB-A from their laptops 4 years ago, but virtually all thumb drives are still USB-A. In fact the default cable for any USB device is still USB-A.
They dropped the headphone jack 4 years ago, but people still complain about not having a headphone jack, phones with headphone jacks are still produced and the overwhelming majority of audio devices still have headphone jacks.
Of course not including a charger with the phone isn't really the same, because it's something you either already have or can buy. It's more like buying a phone with a headphone jack that doesn't come with its own pair of headphones in the box.
Re:The Industry Follows Apple Again (Score:5, Informative)
Oh gosh spot the apple fanboi. Bro, Jobs is dead, you can stop following the reality distortion field now.
And then this piece of blatant revisionism:
Apple: Drops Floppy drives
Others: Laugh at Apple for dropping Floppy drives
Others: Drop Floppy drives
It was:
1. Everyone knows floppies are reaching the end of their life, but there are no great alternatives.
2. Apple drops floppy
3. Everyone owning a mac has to buy a USB external floppy drive to exchange files with the rest of the world. Or maybe a zip drive, except they were never ubiquitous and then they have to find a friend with a flopy drive and zip drive in the same machine
4. Eventually CD-Rs then USB memory takes over and apple fanbois get collective amnesia about how annoying step 3 was.
Everyone gets that technology moves on. This is not some special insight Apple have. all apple do is remove things early, often early enough to be really annoying.
In the case of "legacy" ports, no one cared because Apple's legacy crap was incompatible with the rest of the world. And my brand new Ryzen 3k last year has a "legacy" PS2 port which I use with my "legacy" keyboard, because you know why not? Because it's not apple so you don't have to keep generating waste ebuying new stuff that's why.
Dropping DVD drives first is blatant fanboi revisionism. There were laptops without spinning media before Apple dropped DVD drives. The Hp/Compaq TC1100 shipped without a DVD drive in 2004 (I had one at work), and then Apple completely ripped it off while claiming the design as their own in the famous "rounded corners" patent, because it looks like an iPad.
The headphone jack is impressive: Apple found a way of making headphones both much more expensive and have a much shorter service life. By the end of their life, floppies and DVDs were of marginal utility. For the remaining "legacy" ports USB was superior to the common uses being faster, hotplug and supporting autodetection, chaining etc. For the headphone jack... wireless isn't universally superior by any stretch. And the data ports are more fragile.
If you want to credit anyone for the last point, credit the EU. They said "you will standardise on chargers or we will force you to". The entire point was to allow for reuse of these things to cut down on e waste. Apple resisted for the longest time and fanbois are now apparently claiming credit. This is despite gadgets coming without power bricks for several years now. Amazing!
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Except apple wasn't first, Nintendo was, they didn't include a charger with their hand held gaming device, the DS.
Re: The Industry Follows Apple Again (Score:3)
This doesn't mean Apple is brilliant and foresightful; it means industries are driven by market leaders for good or ill.
Oh, and that developing a cadre of consumers who view your brand with something nigh unto religious zealotry is really brilliant.
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It's impossible to easily reply to you post since you've cherry picked your history to make Apple look good while completely ignoring that only some of those things were a good decision by Apple, and only some of them were even *possible*. So let's go through the list:
Non-USB ports: Apple dropped them at a time when they had fully functioning USB stacks and at a time when USB wasn't even a module in the Linux kernel. In the wider PC industry moving to only USB was always an end goal. No one laughed at Apple
Re:The Industry Follows Apple Again (Score:5, Insightful)
It's called progress...
The USB-C port is better, it's reversible, can support higher power charging, can support thunderbolt and displayport etc.
If you kept providing USB-A ports, then people would continue using them and peripheral manufacturers would continue producing devices for them. They would ignore the USB-C ports entirely.
It happened before, USB was around for several years, and was just "some weird port that we never use and dont know what its for"... Often motherboards would include USB headers on the board but they didn't even bother breaking them out to actual sockets on the outside of the case. Windows 95 lacked USB support initially, as did NT. I had several such boards back in the day. Everyone continued to use rs232, parallel ports, ps/2 mouse and keyboard etc.
Once Apple came out with the iMac that ONLY had USB ports, third parties stepped up and started providing USB devices. The same thing is happening today, there are now USB-C devices widely available and Apple users will generally prefer these devices due to the lack of dongle.
And how is this greedy? USB-C is an open standard, anyone is free to support it or produce devices for it. If anything it's the opposite, before the days of USB Apple used several proprietary ports, after the introduction of USB you could now use third party peripherals far more easily. It's the same today, you no longer need to buy an Apple charger - any USB-C charger will work if it provides enough power.
USB-C becoming ubiquitous benefits everyone, not just Apple.
Re:The Industry Follows Apple Again (Score:4, Informative)
USB-C is an open standard
Not to split hairs but USB is absolutely not an open standard. You must pay a license for it, hence the reason there's a whole vendor ID in the protocol. Additionally, the USB logo is copyrighted and there's a fee if you want to include the logo on your device. Now does anyone enforce all of that? Not really.
Now if you take a USB header and do whatever you want with it and not slap the USB logo on it (which you might see for some hobby electronic kits that take USB-A to two pin 5v header for breadboard) you can do that. It's just when you want to interoperate with other USB devices and hubs that you cross that copyright and patent domain.
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I've made a few "USB" products that were not certified, it's not at all uncommon, especially with industrial devices. For consumer stuff it's worth doing it legit, last time I checked it was $2000/year for membership which nets you the IDs and right to use the logo if you self-certify. Having said that I made consumer stuff without legit IDs as well...
The worst abuse I've ever seen was a cheap lamp my brother bought. It used USB A sockets to connect the 18V AC power supply to the lamp. The PSU side was a so
Re:The Industry Follows Apple Again (Score:5, Insightful)
If you kept providing USB-A ports, then people would continue using them and peripheral manufacturers would continue producing devices for them.
I mean, Apple dropped USB-A from the laptops 4 years ago and I still don't see the number of flashdrives and devices that are USB-A decreasing. Unfortunately the use of dongles with USB-A ports on them has just become the norm instead.
Windows 95 lacked USB support initially, as did NT. I had several such boards back in the day. Everyone continued to use rs232, parallel ports, ps/2 mouse and keyboard etc. Once Apple came out with the iMac that ONLY had USB ports, third parties stepped up and started providing USB devices.
Well, lets be fair here, USB didn't even exist when Windows 95 was released. It was brand new when Apple released the G3 iMac. That may well have helped speed up adoption a little, but with IBM, Intel, Microsoft, and several PC manufacturers being the creators of USB it was clear they intended it for PC use.
Re:The Industry Follows Apple Again (Score:5, Insightful)
It's a bit of a myth that Apple spurred USB adoption. It was really a combination of things.
USB 1.1 made it viable for PCs by allowing the BIOS to support USB keyboards fairly easily, without the need for a full USB stack. 1.1 also introduced a much better test suite and clearer documentation, although to this day it's still a bit of a mess.
Around that time cheap chipsets for USB started to appear, both for the PC side and the peripheral side. In particular dual USB/PS2 keyboard and mouse controllers. Once cheap controllers were available it became possible to make cheap peripherals that were competitive with PS2 ones.
USB 2.0 added enough bandwidth for peripherals like drives and scanners and cameras.
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USB 1.0 came out in January 1996, the iMac came out in August 1998. USB was more than 2 years old when the iMac was released. USB predates the release of NT4, which lacked support for it. Windows 95 OSR2.1 first had USB support in August 1997, a year before the iMac but more than a year after the first spec and supporting hardware was available.
Microsoft were part of the group that initially started developing USB in 1994 whereas Apple were not. You'd have expected them to be shipping support a bit sooner t
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The USB-C port is better, it's reversible, can support higher power charging, can support thunderbolt and displayport etc.
It's also more fragile and less commonly supported by random crap.
If you kept providing USB-A ports, then people would continue using them and peripheral manufacturers would continue producing devices for them. They would ignore the USB-C ports entirely.
I want a laptop not a crusade. My SO's Carbon X1 has a smattering of everything, A, C, headphones, HDMI, micro SD, micro SIM, even a min
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USB-C is supposed to be the most robust USB connector so far, and in my experience is pretty durable. They changed the mechanical design to make the sockets extremely strong, much less prone to damage than USB-A.
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If you want to use that many ports at the same time, then a docking station may be for you.
Sure dongles might be a minor inconvenience. I mean they make your thin, light, fancy laptop need a bag of ancillary crap. And it's one more thing to lose/forget going on travel. It's not like it's a, show stopper, but why pay extra for minor inconveniences? Thing is it's always apple users asking the audience for dongles at conferences because the conference system expects HDMI not USB-C and someone forgot their dong
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It happened before, USB was around for several years, and was just "some weird port that we never use and dont know what its for"... Often motherboards would include USB headers on the board but they didn't even bother breaking them out to actual sockets on the outside of the case. Windows 95 lacked USB support initially, as did NT. I had several such boards back in the day. Everyone continued to use rs232, parallel ports, ps/2 mouse and keyboard etc.
So basically what you're saying is let the Mac users suffer while the industry slowly adopts change and then make the switch to USB-C when we're actually ready, just like USB?
I fully agree with you. All the more reason *not* to standardise on USB-C yet.
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I mean, a new phone without a charger wouldn't stop me from charging it. In fact I didn't even bother swapping my bedside charger out with the new one when I last got a new phone.
Really? (Score:3)
If we're being honest, none of this shit matters. I doubt it's any much better for the environment and frankly, I think this really about people getting fleeced for money. No, not being fleeced to buy the charger. I'm talking about the people being fleeced for buying a new computer phone that they don't need in the slightest but are definitely going to shell out their last dollar, if need be, for it anyway. Quibbling about the fact that they found a way to bleed you for a few more dollars is like complaining that you got sand in your shoe when you went to the beach. Yes, it happened, what did you expect?
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If they really cared about the environment or sustainability they wouldn't be designing disposable phones with planned obsolescence.There's much more exotic material in the phone than the charger.
Re: Really? (Score:2)
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I doubt it's any much better for the environment and frankly, I think this really about people getting fleeced for money
Doing a quick google search leads me to an estimate of 300,000 tons of ewaste per year created by phones including chargers in the box, which isn't nothing.
One Charger for All! (Score:3)
In a place where conversations with corporations were healthy and respectful, I'd imagine something like this.
Companies: "We are all going to have separate chargers!"
People: "No, please, just one or two."
Companies: "Ok, that does make sense. We'll just charge you an extra $10."
This is more what happens.
Companies: "We are all going to have separate chargers!"
People: "No, please just one or two."
Companies:
Launch 100 million dollar advertising campaign discussing why its safer to not share chargers.
Launch $250 million dollar lobbying campaign to make sure their first amendment rights are not trampled on.
Spend $200 million on lawyers to submit legislation that states that the representatives of the people in
government can not speak for the people and enshrine anything into law that infringes on the constitutional rights of the people.
People: "No, please don't infringe on our rights. I need 6 different shaped USB Chargers!"
--
The history of the twentieth century was dominated by the struggle against totalitarian systems of state power. The twenty-first will no doubt be marked by a struggle to curtail excessive corporate power.
- Eric Schlosser
I'll wait for USB-D chargers (Score:2)
Maybe by then they can decide on some universal standard like we had with USB-A (5V@500mA)
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The local library fitted USB ports but they were all 'slow', so students continued to plug in their 240V AC wall chargers.
USB PD at airports and hotels would solve country-specific adapters but from a security aspect, my mother taught me never to trust an unknown USB port.
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That will only make the chargers larger to provide the max theoretical limit of the standard. Converting AC to DC generate heat. I think electrical wall outlets needs to be updated to serve the modern reality. They should have USB-C port(s) as default and have a charger/inverter behind it.
You've been able to get USB-A ones for years. I have some that do 5V/2.1A, so a little over 10W. Not fast charging, but enough to run and slowly charge a phone, charge a laptop overnight, run one of those mini PS-1 things
You dont already have one? (or 12?) (Score:2)
By this time, don't we all already have a handful of cables and chargers by now, making the new ones redundant?
At my company, we throw away PC power cords left and right. Most devices we buy nowadays are upgrades/replacements so we already have the necessary power cords on hand.
By this time I suspect those buying new are outnumbered by the upgraders. The new user can buy their own cables/chargers. Its not hard so long as its clear the new device doesnt include the cables/chargers so they can buy what they
Re:You dont already have one? (or 12?) (Score:4, Insightful)
The same thing happened with USB cables not being included with printers anymore. At first a lot of people complained, but a few years later nobody cared anymore.
It makes no sense to keep including things that are compatible with hundreds of devices spanning years of device generations.
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I've never had a USB B printer cable break on me.
Are USB C cables durable? I have had plenty of microusb ones that have died.
I can understand not including a wall charger but still have 4 'legacy' microusb devices and a shortage of working cables.
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I guess it's been a while since I've purchased a USB printer (I've a household with multiple people who desire to print, so an ethernet or wifi connected printer is required for ease of use)... and I have probably a USB cable or two of just about every type (remember the USB mini A, B or AB interfaces, I've got them all.. somewhere), but that doesn
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It's true there are a lot of surplus chargers out there, including in my own junk drawers. But every few years, the charger standards change, such as from Micro-USB to USB-C, and from QuickCharge 1 to 2 to 3 to 4. So those old chargers laying around DO become obsolete. Just because YOU buy a new phone every year, doesn't mean we ALL do. Some of us actually need a new charger with that new phone, and we don't want to shell out MORE money to get it!
Not obsolete (Score:2)
But every few years, the charger standards change, such as from Micro-USB to USB-C, and from QuickCharge 1 to 2 to 3 to 4.
Just because something is slow or requires an adaptor does not make it obsolete.
I've been saved many times while traveling by having a handy combo-cable with a lot of different plugs, I can use any old USB charging adaptor - some will simply be slow. They still work though which is all that matters.
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When a charger requires an adapter that it didn't need before, that does indeed make it obsolete. An adapter is something one must purchase, that should not be necessary to purchase.
I don't know about you, but there are many situations when I don't have 12 hours to recharge my phone, so fast chargers really do make a difference.
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Environmental burden (Score:4, Insightful)
How about the environmental burden caused by fully functional phones being artificially rendered obsolete by a lack of software updates?
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And unable to reuse them due to security, hard to replace parts, etc. Even donated working ones get destroyed: https://www.vice.com/en/articl... [vice.com]
Re: (Score:2)
Most users don't even know that lack of updates is a problem. The most common reasons for throwing away phones are damage and failing batteries.
Because modern phones are made of glue and are extremely hard to do even basic maintenance on, like replacing the battery, they often get thrown away instead.
Re: (Score:2)
I have modpoints today. So I could have helped mod you into even more oblivion, just because I can. Instead I'm writing this for other passers-along to read.
Whataboutism is strong in this one.
Just because you have a word for something doesn't mean it's 100% good, or 100% bad.
"Whataboutism" can be a legitimate way of showing double-standards or hypocrisy in an argument. Here, it does.
If "environmental burden" is so important to you, why are you still driving a car to work?
He didn't say whether it was important to him or not. For all we care, and for the sake of argument, he may be collecting spaghetti piece by piece using his truc
Rare Betteridge Law Resistant Question (Score:2)
That is, answer is yes.
But corporations, as always, need to stop with their BS.
Not including chargers with their cellphones won't do any significant good to the environment, but will do pretty good to their bottom line.
There is a law that might apply (Score:2)
Don't know the exact wording, and ianal, but it's bound to be relevant to phones too.
(Not sure if a usb cable for charging would fill the letter of the law, somebody should ask a lawyer.)
Re: (Score:2)
The US has a law that devices that are rechargeable must include the adapters necessary to recharge them.
Don't know the exact wording, and ianal, but it's bound to be relevant to phones too.
(Not sure if a usb cable for charging would fill the letter of the law, somebody should ask a lawyer.)
Obviously untrue just based on the fact that the Nintendo 3DS is sold the USA with neither charger nor cable and even more than phones, it's a proprietary charger not even related to USB.
I'm fine with it. (Score:2)
I have any number of USB power outlets around my house. I've got wall warts, outlets with built-in USB charging ports, TVs, computers, monitors, laptops, solar-powered external bricks, more ways to provide power than I can count.
At this point, I have enough power sources. I don't need more.
For the most part, if you stick with powering the device with micro-USB, I've even got lots of cables so I don't need more. If you switch to something other than micro-USB, I'll need a cable and it better have a classic U
Apple is doing it wrong (Score:5, Insightful)
But with Apple, it is different: everybody and their mother have finally agreed on USB type C, so using anybody elses or your old charger is a non-issue. Apple still, for no consumer-friendly reason fathomable, is the only one clinging to a proprietary port. The recent iPhones seem to ship with a USB-C to Lightning cable - but most iPhone users don't have a USB-C charger, since previous iPhones didn't come with that. So this is just a money-grab.
Re: (Score:2)
If it's free... (Score:2)
If it's free, you take it wether you need it or not. Then it either sits there unused, or you throw it away.
If it costs extra, even a token amount, then you will think about wether you actually need it or not.
Looking forward to the natural conclution of this (Score:2)
While you were clutching your pearls, they already decided to also do away with the packaging, the manual, tech support, and the warranty.
In (almost) the year 2021, you do not NEED one (Score:2)
Oh, wait, you've got an iPhone? Supply a cable that plugs into any USB jack to charge your iPhone.
You have {something else}? Supply a cable that plugs into USB.
In any other case: Just supply a USB charging cable with the damned phone as a courtesy.
EU USB power supply standard (Score:2)
One of the EU's better ideas:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
Probably yes (Score:2)
The obvious issue I'd see is that Apple and others would make sure their chargers (or cable) had some proprietary bullshit that unlocks the faster charging rates. So the good intention of reducing electronic waste, packaging etc. would turn into another opportunity to screw over consumers by forcing them to buy a charger at the same.
So any legislation aimed at banning chargers sho
Yes. Just like every other part. (Score:2)
From the first iPhone to today, touch-screen smartphones have become an absolute commodity. Which means, also for the sake of the environment, it would be trivially easy to standardise power and replacement parts, such as batteries.
That Apple started this new trend on a bullshit premise with a premium phone makes no difference. Reusability and it's encouragement generally is a good thing.
Yes (Score:2)
Mostly..yes. (Score:2)
Yes, also... (Score:2)
Why? It's about time we started making devices with the goal of being able to use them anywhere/everywhere. I should be able to put my phone down at work on a desk with thousands of embedded coils and have
No, and here's why (Score:2)
My answer: No.
My reasons:
1) Phones need chargers to work. Companies that include them with a phone are being courteous, just like when a car dealer fills up your tank when you buy a new car. Now imagine how you'd feel if the car dealer drains the tank before you buy the car, or adds on a $50 fill-up-the-tank fee onto the sticker price.
2) Phones don't charge equally. Does yours support Qualcomm Quickcharge 2.0? 3.0? 4.0? Or was that MediaTek Pump Express 2.0? 3.0? or 4.0? Or Samsung Fast Charging, Apple
USB charging? (Score:3)
Doesn't everyone use USB charging these days? I charge my iphone with USB cable connected to a power outlet. So why is this such a big deal?
Re: (Score:2)
What are you talking about? I pulled the oldest charger I had out my drawer, one that came with a HTC Hero (that's over 10 years old!), and tried it with my Galaxy S9 and it worked flawlessly. Even provided the charger's maximum 1A output.
What old USB charger could possibly leave you with no way to recharge your phone other than maybe needing a different cable?