Speculating On What a Microsoft Superphone Might Mean 371
smitty777 writes "Forbes is running an intriguing story on a new 'Superphone' under development by the folks at Microsoft. According to this leaked MS roadmap document, the plan is to build the Apollo-based phone in the 4th quarter of 2012. FTA: 'In the end, however, none of this matters. Microsoft's "peek into the future" is barely a glimpse into what the company may or may not have planned for 2012. While the "superphone" bullet is worth noting, it is not the confirmation of a revolutionary new product. At best, it indicates that Microsoft wishes to compete with Apple by offering a product that is, well, super.' It's also interesting that Sony and AT&T also appear to be working on superphones of their own."
Super (Score:5, Funny)
I expect a Super cool bluescreen on that phone!
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Will it a be world 4g / 3g phone with GSM / CDMA (Score:4, Interesting)
one phone for all bands? so you can get the phone and use it on any network with have to buy a ATT or sprint one like the iphone. No having the phone locked to the carrier you choose.
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one phone for all bands? so you can get the phone and use it on any network with have to buy a ATT or sprint one like the iphone. No having the phone locked to the carrier you choose.
My iPhone 4S works with any carrier...
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Are you certain about that? I would think that for a phone to be GSM and CDMA it would need to have hardware for both on board... doesn't seem like a very cost effective way to manufacture. Interesting...
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Perhaps the savings of not having to deal with multiple phone models outweighs the costs of including hardware for multiple bands? I don't know, but this is a guess.
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one phone for all bands? so you can get the phone and use it on any network with have to buy a ATT or sprint one like the iphone. No having the phone locked to the carrier you choose.
My iPhone 4S works with any carrier...
No. The iPhone 4S can work with any carrier in general, for the most part. A specific one cannot though, since there is a GSM model and a CDMA model. You either have the GSM or CDMA model in one phone, not both. You could however own both models...
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If it's anything like Microsoft's original answer to the iPhone [collegehumor.com], I think we can be sure it will do all of those things and more!
dual sim? (Score:2)
for that to work at it's best. Same number does work that well for dual use.
Like xbox (Score:3)
Microsoft has deep pockets and is not shy to use them to support a money pit until it becomes a success (like the xbox). Maybe this phone thing will be a success, but I hope they will come up with something better than Windows CE which, as a developer, was painful to work with.
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You realise WP7 is still WinCE but with a nice-ish managed UX layer.
No native stuff tho, so no Unity3D stuff. http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/38561/Unity_Engine_Not_Coming_To_Windows_Phone_7.php [gamasutra.com]
Re:Like xbox (Score:5, Funny)
Yes but the Superphone will go further than that. It will channel the qualities of all the Microsoft mobile products we've come to know and love over the years, like Pen Windows, the Pocket PC, Tablet PC, Windows Mobile, the Zune, the Courier, the Kin, and yes of course Windows CE!
Err ok maybe most people didn't exactly love them. Or know them, for that matter.
Re:Like xbox (Score:4, Funny)
You forgot Bob.
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Microsoft has deep pockets and is not shy to use them to support a money pit until it becomes a success (like the xbox). Maybe this phone thing will be a success, but I hope they will come up with something better than Windows CE which, as a developer, was painful to work with.
I'll see your X-Box and raise you a Zune.
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Microsoft's corporate culture = mediocrity. (Score:5, Insightful)
Microsoft reminds me of General Motors.
The capability of both companies is immense, yet due to various internal
influences, both companies have an overwhelming tendency to produce
things which are mediocre at best and outright repulsive when compared
to alternative choices, this with distressing regularity.
Microsoft could produce an amazing phone, but it will suck in ways which
matter to smart users, who won't want to use it, much less buy it. Just
wait and see.
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Indeed, Microsoft could produce an amazing *anything*, but they are hobbled by their own situation.
When it comes to a phone, unless they go the route of the XBox, where they build it themselves, there is no way to keep it secret when so many other vendors have to have access to the plans to get their own version out. Thus, companies like Apple and Google can move faster and mitigate any new or innovative features said phone might actually have.
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Indeed, Microsoft could produce an amazing *anything*, but they are hobbled by their own situation.
It always amazes me that some people still believe Microsoft is just chock full o' amazing ideas that would overwhelm the world - if ONLY their corporate culture didn't get in the way.
There's simply no evidence for this. Microsoft has done very little innovation - most of their successful products have resulted form iterative fine-tuning on ideas that originated elsewhere (e.g. Windows, Office). They've done this very well at times... but it's not innovative in the least.
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It always amazes me that some people still believe Microsoft is just chock full o' amazing ideas that would overwhelm the world - if ONLY their corporate culture didn't get in the way.
There's simply no evidence for this. Microsoft has done very little innovation - most of their successful products have resulted form iterative fine-tuning on ideas that originated elsewhere (e.g. Windows, Office). They've done this very well at times... but it's not innovative in the least.
I think people are referring to the fact that a company of the size of Microsoft with that much cash flowing in, should be able to produce fantastic products. The fact that their company structure is set up to produce boring products is what is interesting.
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Well, the do have a lot of sharp computer scientists who sold their souls for Microsoft Research. So I guess it could be the corporate structure getting in the way. On the other hand, maybe the suckiness of the company turned their brains into mush.
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Microsoft Research pumps out some am
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They are so far behind in marketshare they need to do more than create a competing phone, they need to create a better phone. It's hard to see how they can claim much marketshare quickly. the churn rate on iPhone is quite low and people who have those phones generally purchase apps they may be be hesitant to abandon for the MS phone which has a fraction of the apps that iOS has available. On the Android front there are way more models than wp models which creates great pricing deals on the 6 month old mo
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I think you want to take that back. GM is producing good [dailyfinance.com] products now.
Superphones? Cheap is the answer for them... (Score:2)
iPhones are a commodity with a certain amount of cache, it will eventually collapse. Android is the reasonably priced alternative used by the masses. Unless MS can come in with phones at half the price of Android phones with all the features this will be a two pony race for some time. As Android and Chrome grow though I suspect it could eventually eat into the Windows market which is the biggest strength that MS has for making Windows mobile viable. Of course this is all speculation and at best conjectur
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There is no certainty that Android will start taking share from IPhone, it hasn't happened yet, I don't see it happening in 2012. the difference between Apple and Google is that Apple is number two in marketshare but number one in revenue. Google needs to find a way to make android more profitable, winning marketshare certainly hasn't helped.
All Microssoft Phones are super in their own way (Score:5, Insightful)
I dont think there's been a single other player out there who can stand to compete against Microsoft in it's ability to generate huge amounts of press and fanfare in unreleased products that ultimately become unparalleled market failures.
Frankly, Microsoft would do well to take a note from Apple's playbook and SHUT THE FUCK UP about the product until it's release instead of blathering like a spastic child about it's vaporware, leaking feature after feature and allowing the competition to catch up or even surpass it's abilities before the product is even launched.
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It's a coin toss. Do you want companies telling you what they're trying to do so you can prepare for changes, or do you want to be broadsided by a truly innovative product developed in secure isolation?
I'd argue that if a company is working on something truly revolutionary, it's there obligation to let others know about it so they can issue the layoff notices before having their lunch eaten. :p
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STFU? WTF? This was a leak of a simplistic chart. Apple has managed to get actual prototypes stolen.
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Frankly, Microsoft would do well to take a note from Apple's playbook and SHUT THE FUCK UP about the product until it's release instead of blathering like a spastic child about it's vaporware, leaking feature after feature and allowing the competition to catch up or even surpass it's abilities before the product is even launched.
Actually, it's a strategy MS has used over and over again when it's products are waning in the competitive market. They'll bluster and blather about all these wonderful features, and, but wait!!!... there's more!!! and inexplicably (in my mind anyways) they manage to get the entire media world to listen to them and ignore everyone else. Until they fail to deliver... Anyone else remember Chicago, Blackcomb, or Longhorn?
What a Microsoft Superphone Might Mean (Score:5, Insightful)
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I agree. 'Funny' I might buy. But Insightful? Seriously, what are the alternatives to Slashdot? This is getting to be too much.
Can I make phone calls with it? (Score:2)
How's the phone business going, Microsoft? (Score:2)
We're super, thanks for asking.
probably based on Windows 8 ARM - Windows Phone 8 (Score:2)
OT: is a Windows Phone based phone called a Windows Phone phone? Android based phones are called Android phones.
LoB
Too late. (Score:5, Interesting)
I was a Windows guy for portable stuff for many years because they were usually the first to market with the "killer apps" that I needed. (Apps not necessarily meaning applications but also features.) Honestly, M$-based PDAs had some killer features back in the day. But what they've got on the phone market now is a joke. They're a distant third these days. One or two phones per carrier, some still on 6.5 which is 2 years old now. Verizon doesn't even have a 4G WinMo smartphone. It's pretty pathetic. Apple's nice but they've always been behind the curve in connectivity. Last OS to get tethering, still don't have 4G, etc. Android's been at the cutting edge for a while now and, unless they totally drop the ball, it will be hard to pull existing customers away from the platform.
I made the switch a couple weeks ago and haven't looked back. It doesn't really matter to me what Microsoft puts out in the next few years because I don't think they'll be able to catch up, let alone regain the lead. The only hope they have is to go after business clients with cloud computing, workstation docks, etc. Of course, they'd still be playing catchup to Android. Already got laptop and desktop docks for Android phones along with google docs to work on your documents from any device.
Re:Too late. (Score:4, Insightful)
They're a distant third these days.
How does this myth persist? Blackberry, Symbian, and even Bada outsell and have a higher marketshare than windows phone. They might be third in marketing and fanboys but they damn sure aren't third in sales.
No Monopoly, No Success (Score:5, Interesting)
It's fascinating to watch Microsoft fail in market after market where it didn't start with a monopoly, like in mobile devices generally, phones specifically, tablets specifically, media generally, mobile media players specifically, and everything else.
Except for mouse and keyboard, and in games both console and PC. Why are those different from the rest? Maybe because mouse and keyboard are just extensions of the Windows brand monopoly on the desktop, with no real brand competition whatsoever. And maybe in games the competitors each have their own monopolies, and the competition is the kind Microsoft likes: based on spending a lot of money and running a corrupt supply chain / marketing system rather than on quality.
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It's fascinating to watch Microsoft fail in market after market where it didn't start with a monopoly.
Like game consoles?
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I'm curious.. how do you start with a monopoly? Is there some hidden gem that you need to acquire that makes you go from 0% market share to 90+?
SQL Server, MSVC tools, .NET, etc, are all non-monopolies and are all high quality software products.
The main problem with microsoft is that they are cowards and the middle management is filled with people that should be fired ASAP. They only look at business markets when someone else has spent capital to create a billion dollar market and thus allowing some doucheb
Re:No Monopoly, No Success (Score:4, Insightful)
You start with a monopoly by making a deal with IBM as it introduces its first PC, requiring all IBM PCs to run your OS (but letting you license your OS to any competitor to IBM that might arise). I don't know how you missed that - it's pretty common knowledge. In fact it was a Supreme Court decision, if there were any doubt.
MSVC tools and .NET are extensions of the MS monopoly.
SQL Server gained its market share by making a deal similar to the IBM one with Sybase, though MS in that case literally copied Sybase and then used its business SW monopoly to kill first Sybase, then nearly all its other competitors. SQL Server is an interesting example, because it has gained market share not only through its business SW monopoly, but extended that monopoly through actual innovation and quality. But also through the synergy with its business SW monopoly and its developer market share that it gained through that monopoly.
The rest of what you say about MS is true. It's a symptom of its monopoly advantages. In fact MS benefits from sitting on good developers, even if it doesn't get better products from them, by denying them to the competition. More monopoly strategies.
The main problem with Microsoft is that they have abused their monopoly power to clog the innovation with anti-competitive software and market strategies for decades. Their crap software dominating through monopoly and other unfair competition is deadweight that has divided and slowed personal technology, and saddled it with all kinds of legacies that benefit no one but Microsoft.
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You start with a monopoly by making a deal with IBM as it introduces its first PC, requiring all IBM PCs to run your OS (but letting you license your OS to any competitor to IBM that might arise). I don't know how you missed that - it's pretty common knowledge. In fact it was a Supreme Court decision, if there were any doubt.
Not exactly. Microsoft did not "require" anything in the deal. They had no such leverage, they were a tiny company back then. IBM just contracted MS to give them an OS. IBM then rebranded it as PC-DOS. When IBM sold their PC they sold it with the option of CP/M & PC-DOS. But because PC-DOS was cheaper by $200 and so it won out. But ofcource the main thing that fucked up IBM was when other PC manufacturers reverse engineered IBM's proprietary hardware/BIOS etc and created clones. Since PC-DOS was already
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A real superphone (Score:2)
A "superphone" should be super strong. It should be able to handle being run over by a car, immersion in water, and falling off a building.
Like the Sonim XP3, the Kyocera KX12, and the Casio Ravine phones, all of which can do that. Those thin black plastic things, not rigid enough to survive and not flexible enough to bend when necessary, aren't "super".
Another thing a "superphone" should have is fallback to Iridium satellite links. None of this "no service" crap.
Supermodels - ha! Nothing super about
That "leaked" roadmap... (Score:4, Interesting)
Zune? (Score:3)
Didn't we hear the same crap about the Zune over the iPod a few years back? Big hat, no cattle.
Historically.... (Score:2)
- Exciting features delivered with disappointment
- Revolutionary change followed by a miserable user experience
- Energetic marketing strategy followed up with monotonous patching and bugfixes
- missed boats and opportunities
- stale product model
- lotta' MEH
unifying windows kernel and api (Score:5, Interesting)
Here's my take. I think Microsoft wants to unify their operating systems.
Windows Phone was the first "Metro" experience, but it runs on an old CE kernel and the stack above that is Silverlight (and XNA). Metro is huge. It's the first really new user interface Microsoft's shipped since Windows 95. Metro makes classic Windows and even iPhone and Android feel ancient -- the same old square icons on a desktop we've all been using for the last several decades.
Windows 8 brings Metro to the desktop, laptop, and tablet world. This world, though, is built on the NT kernel, with the WinRT API above that. Sure, you can build Silverlight-like apps in Windows 8 Metro, it might even be trivial to port your WP app to Windows 8 Metro, but you can't easily go the other way.
So, what can Microsoft do about this? Well, it's easy, move Windows Phone onto the NT kernel, and carry over the bulk of the WinRT API. This would make developing your Windows app for any form factor, from desktops to phones, a very easy task. Throw in some nice Visual Studio and Blend templates for re-shaping your app to fit the various form factors, and you've got something really compelling.
The problem with that? Well, today's Windows Phone hardware probably isn't sufficient to drive an NT+WinRT OS. Enter "Superphones."
Superphones, I'm guessing, are the first generation of Windows Phone that run on the NT kernel and support the WinRT (or at least enough of it for most apps.) Note the Apollo release timing is not far from the expected Windows 8 release. Put that together with the recent news that the Windows Phone chief was put in charge of a "a new role working for me on a time-critical opportunity focused on driving maximum impact in 2012 with Windows Phone and Windows 8", and there might be something to this.
So, what do you all think. Am I crazy? Would "same API" across all devices be a worthy Microsoft goal? An achievable one? And what about X-box? Could Microsoft pull off the hat-trick, and unify all of their major platforms under a Metro front end? No doubt that's a tall order, and there are three CPU architectures to deal with. But Microsoft is a big and wealthy company.
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Re:unifying windows kernel and api (Score:4, Informative)
I don't think Apollo will be on the NT kernel.
One of the bullet points for Apollo is support for dual core (current wp is single core only due to a limitation in wince 6), which by coincidence is also a bullet-point for wince 7 (released March 2011). I'd therefore guess they will stay with wince until at least 2013.
I wonder if wince is the thing that's also keeping them from allowing native code. It has rather poor process separation, compared to linux / osx anyway, so they would find supporting it safely difficult.
4Q 2012? Who will care? (Score:4, Insightful)
The phone market is done and dusted. People have increasing investment (in money and in time spent learning to use) a collection of applications, and the market for "dumb phone to smart phone" transition is finished. The only market left is competing head-on to switch people away from iPhone (good luck with that) or from Android (fractionally easier, as there's evidence people can be switch to Apple).
In order to compete, Microsoft would either have to completely kill Apple stone-dead in functionality and quality, with a release one product going against a mature product with a mature eco-system (didn't Zune teach them _anything_?) or would have to undercut the commodity Android vendors on price, which is essentially impossible now, never mind in a year's time.
Microsoft are increasing slow to react, and are arriving both late and under-armed at every fight. Music Player, Smart Phone, Tablet: they've missed all three. They need to find a new place to innovate, and for as long as they refuse to do anything which isn't based around Windows, that's going to get harder and harder for them.
Re:4Q 2012? Who will care? (Score:4, Interesting)
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No matter... (Score:2)
Microsoft has its good points and bad points, but where it really, really always fails, is marketing. A "zune", in brown, that squirts? What complete and utter retard thought that would work?
One example of many over the past 7 or 8 years that just prove that their marketing droids are talking to the wrong people in their focus groups. Microsoft products are not cool.... at all, in any way, to anyone. Busines
Why bother? (Score:2)
I'm sure they'll find a way to ruin it, just like many other products before that, no matter how nice they may have been in theory (Zune clusterfuck, Courier debacle, ...).
"Superphone " meaning a really great MS phone? (Score:2)
If that's what's suggested, then I think a Microsoft Superphone would mean...that hell froze over. Don't get me wrong; I think Microsoft is amazing, and has done a great deal for the world. But their phone products are the biggest, steamiest nut-studded shitloafs I've had the displeasure to use. I HATED my phone when I had Windows Mobile, and the odds of them coming out with a great product all of a sudden (be mindful..they've been trying to sort this out for as long as there have been smartphones) are
Freezing the market... AGAIN (Score:2)
A cunning strategy (Score:2)
MS realises they can't compete in the Smartphone market so they have devised a cunning plan to create a whole new market, the superphone market.
Sure a superphone looks and acts kinda like a smartphone but that' doesn't change the fact that a smartphone is just not a superphone (It doesn't have an MS logo on it for starters).
And when the stats come rolling in, MS will be the only player in this new market so they will naturally have 100% market share.
But it doesn't end there. MS will trademark the Superphon
Re:Easily explainable: Nokia (Score:5, Insightful)
Winphone 7 isn't *that* good.
However ... It's a good start considering they wiped the Windows CE slate clean and implemented XNA and Silverlight on a decent minimum-specced hardware base.
It's still *very* immature, considering the polish of its competitors.
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They wiped the visible parts of the CE slate clean, but it's still the CE kernel. They needed to keep the CE guts to get the phone to market when they did. If they had started fresh, they wouldn't have made the same design compromises with the CE kernel that they did years ago. IMHO, Apple made some very smart decisions with iOS, especially in power management features. It's amazing just how much of the iPod/iPad/iPhone gets shut down when idle or doing something like watching video. I think Apple's heritag
Re:Easily explainable: Nokia (Score:5, Informative)
Only bad thing about WP7 is that you can't run apps outside markets as easily as with old Windows Mobile's. It really sucks. But it's something iPhone and Android mandated, so blame is on them.
Erm.. android? erm... no there is a nice simple setting where you can chose to install things not from the official android market, there are also other markets such as the app brain market for android.... so yer kinda of .. well way off the mark
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Honestly, I can't think of anything that would immature about it.. In fact, especially the UI is great once you've tried it. Easily beats Android and even iPhone too.
Seriously? Have you either of the other devices?
Also, development on WP7 phones is ridiculously easy, as you point out. I'm more than happy that Nokia finally dropped Symbian, which was a *major* pain in the ass to even set up development environment for. XNA, Silverlight etc make it ridiculously easy to do apps for WP7.
Agreed. Compared to Symbian, XNA/Silverlight is amazing :)
Only bad thing about WP7 is that you can't run apps outside markets as easily as with old Windows Mobile's. It really sucks. But it's something iPhone and Android mandated, so blame is on them.
Not the *only* thing, but I'm not going to enumerate them, as it's likely to be a waste of time. I am surprised you didn't mention that Microsoft has blessed a jailbreak/sideloader http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2011/11/official-windows-phone-7-jailbreak-now-live-for-a-fee/ [gizmodo.co.uk]
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XNA, Silverlight etc make it ridiculously easy to do apps for WP7.
Only if you completely ignore the position Microsoft is in with respect to the overall market.
XNA doesn't matter. What matters is how easy it is for the developers who have already written apps for iOS and Android to port them to WP7. Microsoft is trying to apply their usual MO to a market where they have no market power, and it doesn't work. Pushing platform-specific developer tools and EEE are useless when the platform is a very small minority, because instead of locking out other platforms from software
Re:Easily explainable: Nokia (Score:5, Insightful)
XNA doesn't matter. What matters is how easy it is for the developers who have already written apps for iOS and Android to port them to WP7. Microsoft is trying to apply their usual MO to a market where they have no market power
Hey, I would you introduce you to these two small guys called Windows and Xbox360.
When the controls differ so much (Score:4, Informative)
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Nokia didn't drop symbian. It's still the biggest mobile OS in the world by a large margin.
Re:Easily explainable: Nokia (Score:4, Interesting)
The previous poster did not point out that development was ridiculously easy. He did however say, "Winphone 7 isn't *that* good."
A great UI means nothing without decent apps for the user to interface with. I am not interested in pissed-off avians or whatever game clones may be available for WP7, I want tools not entertainment. Most of the quality app makers for WM have jumped ship for Android or iOS, and WP7 won't catch up anytime soon.
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Why would he need to be paid? It's a good product. My son's iPhone and wife's Android device look primitive in comparison to my WP7. I've only got 50,000 apps to sift through, but that will improve, I think.
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I like Android, I think it's good, I've been using it for the past year. I used an iPhone for the previous year or so.
I don't think there is any question that on things like graphics and UI issues, iOS is more polished. Apple is very good at the user experience.
Android is a good balance. My android phone has more options, more customizability. I used a Blackberry before this, and it really took the cake on options/customizability (to the point of confusion, often).
Android has strengths and weaknesses, polis
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\When i had to root and install a cooked rom just to get the camera to take more than 2 pictures in a row, there is a problem.
Yes, there is. Return your phone to the manufacturer and get a brand new one for free. No need to flash your ROM to take two pictures without crashing.
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*snigger*
It does have a certain amount of polish, things have certainly improved since Android 1.6.
I do get what you mean though.
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Depends on your phone. I bought an HTC a while ago (my first smartphone) and thought it was pretty neat. I was surprised at how much different other Android phones were when I compared them, particularly the lack of consistency between the various apps. (HTC includes their own media player, mail, calendar, etc. so it all looks the same throughout.) I have a few gripes with my phone, but on the whole I'm very satisfied with it.
Re:Easily explainable: Nokia (Score:5, Insightful)
Nice astroturf. Too bad it hasn't much to do with TFA, but then again neither does the summary. Which can be be summarized as
How exciting.
(Sarcasm in the TFA)
It's a hyperbolic expansion of a marketing blurb that in essence, means absolutely nothing except to perhaps cement "superphone" as the next idiotic buzzword in this segment.
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No, I think superphone is just about right. The only thing that prevented their desktops from being superdesktops was that most people aren't strong enough to send them sailing across the room after the umpteenth random CTD or other error.
Re:Easily explainable: Nokia (Score:4, Insightful)
One word:
Astroturf.
Re:Easily explainable: Nokia (Score:5, Informative)
This obvious troll is obvious has gotten out of hand.
Seriously, it would be wonderful, just once, for InterestingInsightbitesCmdPony et al ad infinitum to STFU, and perhaps enter the fray once the discussion begins, rather than rushing to be the first post with all the ms tripe.
Ducks, "great software" from Microsoft, google sucks, etc.
All just pure bullshit and astroturf.
With the added bonus of modding oneself up, with who-knows-how-many aliases, and modding anyone who points out the obvious troll, down.
Really, it would be nice to, just once, to read a discussion that isn't anchored by some preselected MS astroturf.
cheers,
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Ducks, "great software" from Microsoft, google sucks, etc.
All just pure bullshit and astroturf.
Please explain why you want to forbid someone from having a positive opinion about microsoft products?
I use their compilers daily and couldn't be more happier. Its my opinion that their developer tools are superior to everything else that I've used.
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Please explain why you want to forbid someone from having a positive opinion about microsoft products?
I use their compilers daily and couldn't be more happier. Its my opinion that their developer tools are superior to everything else that I've used.
Only if you explain where I said I wanted to forbid anyone from having any opinion about anything.
The portion you've quoted is an example of the general tone of the OP's numerous first posts; it's bullshit because it's constant, persistent, and ultimately exasperating, not because it's necessarily untrue or exaggerated.
Perhaps, rather than "setting the stage", and anchoring every discussion each and every time there's a chance to promote MS and/or dis anyone but MS (google, linux, geese), our wizard can ho
Re:Easily explainable: Nokia (Score:4, Insightful)
We could go on forever, however, riddle me this:
When you perused the headline, then the summary...did you have any *inkling* whatsoever, that InterestingFella would have the first post? That it would have the same timestamp as the submission? (ya, it's Firehose! yep, Firehose!). That, despite having the same timestamp, the spelling/grammar is usually good; that the thoughts seem pretty-well laid out, embedded links, sales info? Cursory competitor bash? Shall I continue?
Of course you did. If it's not frosty piss, it's this weeks incarnation of the same dude.
ergo...obvious.
How many accounts does one have to have on this site, anyway?
cheers
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I don't read every single story nor do I waste my time digging up past comments of posters. If your criticism is about off topic posts, then by all means use the moderation system to mark them as such. The poster obviously has a positive opinion about microsoft, I get that, but I don't see why that should necessarily be a bad thing or grounds for claiming that its simply astroturf.
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That would be useful if the single reason I used MSVC was to create code that benefits from whatever optimization that ICC does better. (I still don't believe your claims, just taking them at face value)
MSVC has better debug support via Visual Studio. It understands the memory layout of most of the C++ containers out of box. The edit and continue feature alone cuts down on a large chunk of my dev. time. The only thing I dislike about Visual Studio is the editor. It parses the code and stores it into some la
Re:Easily explainable: Nokia (Score:5, Interesting)
Define "great products".
I'll remind you that each of the products you cite had competition, until Microsoft used their monopolistic advantages to squash that competition.
If, in truth, Microsoft has any "great products", the competitor's products were sometimes greater. It sucks to be deprived of those products, just because Microsoft had the influence to crush them. Look at the close call we had with Java. Imagine a world in which the only surviving JVM was Microsoft's own version.
Those people who define "great products" as those products promoted by the most successful mega corporations would certainly agree with you that Microsoft has a lot of great products. Those of us who define "great products" differently will continue to disagree with you.
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If you cant recognize that Microsoft has made SOME great products, then youre either ignorant or a fanboy, and probably both. Examples: Exchange, Outlook, Excel, Visio (FINALLY there is a worthy competitor in Gliffy),
Win7 (Hows gnome3 / Unity treating you?), etc.
Nice try.
So I'm either ignorant or a fanboy? How's about neither. Try realist. I don't recall saying that MS has made NO great products. The same way I didn't say I hated ducks. But keep demonstrating where your level of comprehension is, and perhaps I can dumb my posts down (even more) for you.
Gnome/Unity? Seriously? Fluxbox, ftw.
Keep flaming, tho. Looks good on you.
cheers,
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with all the ms tripe......."great software" from Microsoft, google sucks, etc.
If thats not implying that Microsoft cant make great software, I dont know what is.
Is it possible that some people ACTUALLY LIKE the Win7 GUI more than OSX, KDE, and Fluxbox? That we like a GUI that is minimal, usable, has sane defaults (and keyboard shortcuts), and doesnt get in your way?
No, of course not. Anyone claiming so is spouting "ms tripe".
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Outlook! That is the absolute worst MUA ever. It's defaults and broken replies have ruined email forever resulting in everybody using TOFU messages to make any discussion/question for more than just 1 point per email impossible.
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If you cant recognize that Microsoft has made SOME great products, then youre either ignorant or a fanboy, and probably both. Examples: Exchange, Outlook, Excel, Visio (FINALLY there is a worthy competitor in Gliffy), Win7 (Hows gnome3 / Unity treating you?), etc.
Im just not sold on the whole Phone 7. Minimal isnt something MS does well; most of their products include the kitchen sink.
Exchange/Outlook both suck, with the exception of internal email/calendaring integration. MS managed to completely screw over 20 years of internet convention with a single product.
Excel - this is a product that does everything half-assed. It's not really good for any single use, except perhaps the most basic - spreadsheet functions. Which, btw, Visicalc did long long before them with a tiny fraction of the resource requirements.
Visio - not originally an MS product, after MS purchased Visio they promptly scr
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Outlook is actually good software if you need email + calendar. I really haven't found anything as good. The Bat! [ritlabs.com] sure comes as close and is lightweight as hell, but it just doesn't have the same integration and feel either. It's the best try so far, at least.
I will admit that Microsoft kinda got the email/calendar integration right. Why "kinda"? Because it was actually a whole lot better back in Exchange 5/Outlook97 before they completely screwed it up due to security and performance concerns. Even with that said, it's still one of the better client integrations out on the market, albeit with the caveat that no one else can integrate 100% with Outlook nor Outlook's Calendaring.
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If your phone can't find an AT&T, Sprint, Verizon or T-Mobile store, might I suggest you look more closely into WP7. It can do maps and stuff. ;)
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Is this phone cheaper? Who is buying this phone? Who is selling this phone to whom and how?
Early Android sales was much about competitors "getting something comparable to an iphone to sell" as it was about consumers "getting something comparable to an iphone on their network".
One cannot just look at product to explain sales.
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The Lumina 800 is made of parts recycled from the N9 (which is a "super phone"). Except for the processor (ARM - N9 Snapdragon - Lumina ) it uses the same case, glass, and most of the internals. I don't know if the front facing camera that the N9 has is just missing, or if WP7 just can't handle two cameras.
Nokia would have been better off sticking with Maemo (the N9 is not really MeeGo). It is truly beautiful.
On a side note, does anyone know if Microsoft got copy and paste working on WP7? Or have they fixed
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No, the Nokia N9 is "MeeGo Harmattan", not "Maemo Harmattan" (note you spelled it incorrectly too).
MeeGo is a marketing term, and the Nokia N9 has it. Technicalities are not relevant with marketing.
Also, it's Qt, not QT.
If you have one, check it...Settings/About product. On my N950, which I have to hand and runs the same s/w, it says :
"MeeGo 1.2 Harmattan"
Make no mistake, it *is* MeeGo. It might not be the same as you get on the public web site, or on other devices, but it *is* MeeGo.
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Nokia has been preparing their Windows Phone 7 line-up. Their Nokia Lumia smart phone [nokia.co.uk] has beat sales in many European countries and Australia in December and November, even topping iPhone and every Android phone. It is also a very solid offering. I think both Microsoft and Nokia did the right to go together. Great hardware from Nokia and great software from Microsoft. That combination is pure gold.
I suppose you are confusing the Lumia with the MeeGo-powered N9, which is the phone that's been selling unexpectedly well despite the fact that it wasn't released in a lot of markets, including but not limited to the US and UK markets.
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You have a strong stomach. I think I threw up in the back of my mouth.
Re:Good grief... (Score:5, Funny)
I'm no MS basher, but seriously, their "roadmap" [speedymirror.com] if at all authentic, is embarrassingly redolent of this:
Step 1: Release new OS/Phone
Step 2: Sell in more markets
Step 3: ???
Step 4: Profit!
Seriously. The graphic is almost literally like that
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Noscript won't let me see the roadmap, but it is is anything like a slide David Patraeus (sp?) used in a brief once, I can imagine. That slide had arrows pointing nowhere in particular, many arrows of different shapes and sizes presumably indicating different things. The general admitted it was confusing and then... ....he let the cat out of the bag: (I paraphrase) If the people from Microsoft who we used to put these slides together could see fit to help us a bit....
The slide immediately became crystal cle
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Mango, last holiday season, was supposed to take WP7 and make it really good. I'm not sure if it has - I have never used one of their phones. By most accounts they have a pretty decent product, but no way into a market that isn't very interested in another mobile OS.
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Apple's unwillingness to yield to 3rd party apps for core functions such as enterprise mail is very infuriating. I frequently need to send out updates to attendees on a calendar item and Blackberry (and every other email /call system on PC or phone I've ever seen) makes the process of sending an email to fellow meeting attendees very straightforward -but the iPhone ( iOS 5) mail client doesn't let you do this and even makes it very hard to gather all the email addresses in a meeting to copy them and create