Nokia Chases Blogger To Recover N8 Prototype 122
boris writes "Nokia has approached Russian authorities to retrieve its N8 prototype from blogger Eldar Murtazin, in a case similar to Apple iPhone 4/Gizmodo fiasco. In its official blog, Nokia said, 'we formally requested the return of all unauthorized Nokia property from Mr. Murtazin and he declined to respond. As a result, we have contacted the Russian authorities to assist us in the return of all unauthorized Nokia property.'"
Did they pay off the Russian authorities? (Score:4, Insightful)
Did they pay off the Russian authorities?
As that how things get done in Russia.
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1. You get pulled over. Frequently, you don't know why.
2. You pay the officer an amount at least half the cost of what you'd expect the official cost to be.
3. The officer talks about your infraction, or talks about larger possible crimes you committed.
4. You pay the fine, or, if the officer is talking about other crimes, GOTO 2
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Police in Russia are authorized to demand cash directly...
As a US tourist, couldn't I just poke the cop in the chest and say "Back off Ivan, we won the cold war!" ?
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No. But as a US tourist, you're entitled to some special rates. Like, the same amount, but in USD rather than RUR. Enjoy your stay.
Re:Did they pay off the Russian authorities? (Score:4, Insightful)
As a US tourist, couldn't I just poke the cop in the chest and say "Back off Ivan, we won the cold war!" ?
Smart people don't insult people with weapons, especially not in countries where human life has never been a priority.
Re:Did they pay off the Russian authorities? (Score:4, Insightful)
As a US tourist , couldn't I just poke the cop in the chest and say "Back off Ivan, we won the cold war!" ?
Smart people don't insult people with weapons, especially not in countries where human life has never been a priority.
For a bit of context I highlighted the critical parts of both your statements.
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The OP said "US Tourist", but that's a given as anyone else knows the US did not actually win the cold war it just fizzled out (realistically it had been approaching this point for years with Moscow and Washington increasing diplomatic relations (glasnost) and leaders figuring out trade would get more then espionage ever did).
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I've been to White Russia last month, with a English teacher overthere as a "guide" (a girl I've been communicating with.)
"The current sentiment here is that they hate Americans, they've been conditioned by propaganda, the same way Russians have been conditioned by their media to hate Russians. They don't care about Europeans", while I noted how friendly and accomodating they are overthere.
So, you couldn't. He'll do everything to humiliate you, being a "US tourist".
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Police in Russia are authorized to demand cash directly from drivers for perceived infractions. It's not like in western countries where the officer writes you a ticket and then you must pay it before a certain time.
Actually, "write a ticket" is precisely how it is supposed to be done by law in Russia (I know because I went through the procedure first-hand). Any direct cash extortion you may experience is unlawful, which isn't to say that it's not "authorized" by the officer's higher-ups (they usually get a cut of all bribes obtained that way).
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Law? Law? Ha! In No-Longer-Soviet Russia, law makes you!
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Law? Law? Ha! In No-Longer-Soviet Russia, law rapes you!
Fixed that for ya.
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apparently, police in russia are slower to do megacorps' bidding, though ?
First past the post (Score:2)
Nokia or Murtazin?
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Nokia is Finnish. You know what happens when da russkies piss off finns?
Fuckin' Winter War! That's what! And continuation war if they are not satisfied with the body count of the first one!
Putin and whatever-the-official-president-is are probably right now personally crawling around, trying to get back the Finnish marvel of forbidden technology, lest Tarja bestows them with unimaginable horrors of "motti".
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Even lived to kick ass after getting half of his face shot off.
Epic Blockbuster (Score:5, Funny)
So, in 30 years from now, when the world looks back on current events and news stories as inspiration for movies - is this what they're going to be about?
If so...
COUNT ME IN.
Think Jason Bourne meets Verizon guy.
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Verizon Guy: Can you hear me...
BLAM
Bourne: Not now. Not ever.
Roll credits
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Shouldn't that be rollover credits?
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I've got the perfect title: Hear me if you can
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Think Aliens meets Verizon guy. Here's the title: "In space, can you hear me now?"
You're too drunkski! (Score:2)
Maybe you shouldn't be drinking so much Vodka that way, Nokia.
On an unrelated note, the proper way to say Vodka ("Wodka") sounds awesome when a Russian says it.
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On an unrelated note, the proper way to say Vodka ("Wodka") sounds sexy as hell when a Russian says it.
Fixed that
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Pavel Chekov fetish?
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wod = water
ka = little
Re:You're too drunkski! (Score:5, Informative)
On an unrelated note, the proper way to say Vodka ("Wodka") sounds awesome when a Russian says it.
"Wodka" is not a proper way to say "vodka" in standard Russian, unless you're talking about some regional dialect, or you're a German. IPA for it is ['vodka].
Indeed, there is no sound directly corresponding to /w/ in Russian at all, and in loanwords it's approximated by either /v/ (as for "Washington") or, more commonly, by /u/ (as for "Watergate")
Nokia just want its property back (Score:5, Informative)
Actually in it's blog I believe Nokia wrote "please return our babies" or something like that. No lawsuit etc. They just want the phones back and avoid bad press.
And yes, the phone is an early N8 prototype (from march). The reviewers named it N9 and started a lot of false rumors on it, despite (at least my) posts indicating it was a N8 and early Symbian ^3 on it.
The N8 that will ship soon is slightly different hardware wise, and vastly improved software wise.
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The N8 that will ship soon is slightly different hardware wise, and vastly improved software wise.
Color me skeptical; what are the chances this is not another overpriced "flagship" POS from Nokia?
Comment removed (Score:5, Informative)
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Color me skeptical; what are the chances this is not another overpriced "flagship" POS from Nokia?
I think Nokia's hype machinery has failed at least partially if you are tellimg me you haven't seen any specs, hands on's or rumors about N8. As moderately satisfied Symbian user I have good feeling about it. But I'm looking forward for the camera maybe more than the next person probably.
http://conversations.nokia.com/2010/07/08/nokia-n8-camera-2260-days-in-the-making-part-12/ [nokia.com]
Re:Nokia just want its property back (Score:5, Interesting)
My 2 cents:
Nokia probably doesn't give a rat's ass about the device itself. They want it returned so they can check its serial number/IMEI and track down the person who is continuously leaking their prototypes to Eldar Murtazin.
They have publicly stated that they are trying to find his mole.
http://conversations.nokia.com/2010/04/27/one-of-our-children-is-missing/ [nokia.com]
Re:Nokia just want its property back (Score:5, Interesting)
Yes, that's what I'm thinking. They want to shut down the leaks, not to punish the bloggers or whichever tech site end up getting the devices. That's why there's no lawsuit, they don't care going after the tech fans, they know it's a bad move. Eventually they'd rather not make noise about it.
The guy who leaks stuff at Nokia will prolly get fired and stuff however.
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A bit fuller quote is quite telling... (also how the case seems to go on for over 2 months by now)
This particular site openly flaunts its ability to acquire our property. Yes, we have to take a look at ourselves, and we are diligently hunting down the source of these leaks. Frankly, we pride ourselves on trust at Nokia, and someone has greatly betrayed that.
However, whilst we are determined to protect our intellectual property and maintain the surprise when a shiny new gadget is introduced, we are not going to do so at the expense of the working conditions we enjoy here at Nokia. We are not the Secret Police, and we want to maintain our culture of openness. We won't let days like yesterday alter that.
So now that the official news is out, we'd like our prototype back. Please.
(emphasis mine)
So - ignoring Nokia requests to return their property ever since, even seems taunting them quite openly, gets in the way of launch plans, offers what reads as conclusions about an upcoming product based on an early prototype (how can one not mean all of this?), plus all that "consultancy" for some other manufacturers? The case looks pretty simple (and generally, is it just my impression that such
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"Actually in it's blog I believe Nokia wrote 'please return our babies' or something like that. No lawsuit etc."
Puh-leeze. They're asking for Russian security stormtroopers to track the guy down and bust into his house. That's better than a lawsuit? Nicey-nice PR be damned.
Legit concern (Score:2, Informative)
I actually read the articleyea yea blasphemy here on Slashdot.
The guy isn’t just a blogger apparently he also describes himself as a consultant to the mobile industry. I think Nokia has a legitimate concern that he will “consult” for their competition after he’s already seen their hardware, so they want it back.
Re:Legit concern (Score:4, Informative)
I've read the new Nokia post as well now, and the guy not only wrote a lot of crap "haha Nokia you can't get me etc" on the net, but on top of that he's working for Samsung and gives away the Nokia prototypes there. (it's all in the comments here http://thenokiablog.com/2010/07/07/nokia-n8-property-eldar-murtazin/ [thenokiablog.com] )
Quite of a bad guy actually :P
Re:Legit concern (Score:4, Insightful)
The guy isn’t just a blogger apparently he also describes himself as a consultant to the mobile industry.
"Describes himself" is very apt here. The guy is very well known in RuNet, and is largely the laughing stock of the industry and people interested in it. His "consultancy" is a single-man company where he is a senior (and only) consultant, and its only known outlet is his blog. He is also quite famous for making incorrect and downright laughable predictions.
Stupid Swede (Score:1, Insightful)
Russians never give back. We steal, yes, of course, but this is not a crime. It is the Russian way.
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Nokia is Finnish, not Swedish...
What's the rest of the story here? (Score:1, Flamebait)
How did this "blogger" (also being accused of being a mercenary consultant) get hands on the prototype? Was this a pre-release review unit provided to a media member? Found in a bar restroom a la iPhone 4? Corporate espionage?
I suspect it was the first case. It wouldn't be the first time a manufacturer pulled a review prototype after they came to believe the reviewer wasn't either (A) going to be particularly favorable, or (B) was going to do something beyond just reviewing the phone, like give competitors
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They say it is a supposed leak from inside Nokia.
This is a non-story (Score:2, Insightful)
Nokia politely asks said invidividual to return their property.
Individual does not respond.
Nokia involves the authorities.
I am failing to find a story in all this.
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The Apple prototypes were given back before any lawyer or police raid involvement - whereas in this case the person/organization seems to be withholding the prototypes. I don't think many people would have had a problem with the police raiding on behalf of Apple to recover stolen property - but that wasn't what happened.
Re:This is a non-story (Score:4, Insightful)
An individual comes into an unauthorized posession of a development prototype.
Apple politely asks said invidividual to return their property.
Individual responds dickishly.
Apple involves the authorities.
Replace a few words, and there's plenty of story. What makes Nokia so different?
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Re:This is a non-story (how it actually happend) (Score:3, Informative)
Individual politely asks Apple if they want it back.
Apple denies existence of property.
Individual sells property to Gizmodo.
Apple involves the authorities.
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The individual did not ask apple if they wanted it back. But the truth shouldn't get in the way of a good apple bash
Re:This is a non-story (how it actually happend) (Score:4, Informative)
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"Level 1 tech support guy who has no knowledge of prototypes brushes guy off."
Which represents Apple.
The fact that the tech support guy was incompetent doesn't enter in to it.
you for got:
"The Apple throws a huge hissy fit and destroys peoples lives."
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So every Level 1 support person in your company of 50,000 people knows what the guys in new product development are working on even though they don't work in the same building, city, or even state? That's not their job and they often don't know.
"The Apple throws a huge hissy fit and destroys peoples lives."
The founder of the phone already knew the identity of the engineer Hogan who lost the phone. If he really wanted to return it, he could have just driven up to Apple's campus and left it at the front desk. He could have turned it into the police. He could have tur
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Individual through a third party makes a call to the generic Apple support line inquiring about prototypes. Vaguely asks if there are any rewards for missing prototypes.
Level 1 tech support guy who has no knowledge of prototypes brushes guy off.
This was Gizmodo's story, and later contradicted. Via Wired [wired.com]:
Hogan didn’t know what he had until he removed a fake cover from the device and realized it must be a prototype of Apple’s upcoming next-generation iPhone, according to Gizmodo’s account of the find.
A friend of Hogan’s then offered to call Apple Care on Hogan’s behalf, according to Hogan’s lawyer. That apparently was the extent of Hogan’s efforts to return the phone.
After the friend’s purported efforts to return the phone failed, several journalists were offered a look at the device. Wired.com received an e-mail March 28 — not from Hogan — offering access to the iPhone, but did not follow up on the exchange after the tipster made a thinly veiled request for money. Gizmodo then paid $5,000 in cash for it.
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No that's not how I remembered it.
You forgot: Individual's roommate gets nervous over stolen iPhone and reports him to police.
The geek re-writes history once again (Score:2)
He lifts a phone left behind at a bar.
Anyone who witnessed the incident would have called him a thief.
Individual politely asks Apple if they want it back.
Apple denies existence of property.
He shops the prototype phone around to Wired, etc.
He quotes a price that makes it perfectly clear he knows that the phone is hotter than a stove.
He has the number of the employee who was issued the phone but never calls it.
Instead, he cov
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"What he does not do - as California law demands he must do - is surrender the phone to the police.
no it doesn't.
It says he must attempt to return it; which he did.
Gizmodo had every right to buy the phone. You don't hold the purchaser responsible for the item.
If Apple has violated a licensing agreement, do all the people who use apple products get sued?
BTW, I can find you a dozen phones that looks like that nioe already on the market at the time.
Apple behaved improperly.
You also forgot the part where Apple
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Gizmodo had every right to buy the phone. You don't hold the purchaser responsible for the item.
Wait, there are no laws about fence there?
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It says he must attempt to return it; which he did.
The individual already knew who the identity of the engineer who lost it. Did he return it to the engineer? No. Did he return it to the bar? No. Did he turn it into Apple? No. Did he turn it into the police? No. In my world, every attempt to return the phone does not involve selling it to Gizmodo.
If Apple has violated a licensing agreement, do all the people who use apple products get sued?
And what does this have to do with stolen property?
BTW, I can find you a dozen phones that looks like that nioe already on the market at the time.
And what does this have to do with stolen property? So if someone stole my piece of crap Ford, you'd say that there are nicer Ferarris on the road?
Apple behaved improperly.
You also forgot the part where Apple denied it was there prototype to Gizmodo.
Gizmod
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Gizmodo would return the phone (which was Apple's property) only if Apple publicly acknowledged that they had a prototype. That borders on extortion.
I think having someone at Gizmodo prosecuted for extortion (for attempting to force Apple to reveal trade secrets, no matter how unsecret they really are) would actually have been the most rational response to the whole thing.
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Individual sells property to Gizmodo.
Apple doesn't confirm it's theirs
Apple involves the authorities.
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An individual comes into an unauthorized possession of a development prototype.
Individual politely asks Apple if they want it back.
Apple denies it is theirs.
Individual sells it to Gizmodo.
Apple demands it back.
Gizmodo returns it.
Apple sends in the SWAT.
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Because Nokia is doing it correctly?
Apple denied it was their phone, and then later through a fit and called the authorities.
Nokia blog post (Score:2)
Here's the relevant link on conversations.nokia.com:
http://conversations.nokia.com/2010/07/07/legal-action-against-eldar-murtazin-official-statement/ [nokia.com]
It pretty much boils down to this:
"To be perfectly clear, we have asked Mr. Murtazin for the return of all Nokia property in his possession. As he has declined to reply, we asked the Russian authorities to assist us. We leave it to the Russian authorities to determine the most appropriate course of action."
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It pretty much boils down to this:
"To be perfectly clear, we have asked Mr. Murtazin for the return of all Nokia property in his possession. As he has declined to reply, we asked the Russian authorities to assist us. We leave it to the Russian authorities to determine the most appropriate course of action."
Ye gods! It's like you have the power the read the submitters mind, and then travel forward in time 30 minutes and post your gleanings. Have you considered connecting with James Randi to try and get that million dollar prize?
:-P
Equal opportunities (Score:1, Troll)
Well, if the free publicity stunts work for Apple, why cannot Nokia try them too? They will probably need to "lose" four prototypes, for Apple two, but in the end they will probably move a bit the interest of the people.
The only difference is... (Score:1, Flamebait)
It's a Nokia.
It's going to be boring, difficult to use, and feature a lousy API and app distribution system.
Who's going to care?
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Re:The only difference is... (Score:4, Interesting)
Maybe thats just me.
The N900 is a limited success *despite* Nokia's best effort, just like the "NIT"'s before it. I mean come on, the firmware has bugs that are 2 generations old and still stewing. Development for the device is a joke since it was ( last I checked ) still basically tied to running debian or ubuntu on your development system unless you wanted to use Python.
I have developed for the N810 and was sponsored by Nokia to the first Maemo conference. What I saw and heard lead me to the conclusion that it was a dead-end without partners. MeeGo *might* change my view if they can finally bring a mainstream success to the table without the continued alienation of their development community.
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i have one and i LOVE it... it's fantastic and i cannot wait to see what the MeeGo release for the N900 will be like.
it'll still be the debian based maemo under the bonnet but will have the Meego front end on it.
the device plain rocks to be frank
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You don't actually have to be running Linux at all, though you need something POSIX-y and the right libraries. The cross-compile toolchain could certainly stand to be easier to set up, though. I eventually said "screw this" and write/tested my code natively on a laptop, then copied it over (ran `svn up`, actually) to the N800 and just built it in place. Sure, the processor's build speed leaves something to be desired, but most of the time stuff that had worked correctly on desktop Linux worked fine on the N
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Or, more precisely, a limited success despite Nokia being quite clear it's not a mass market device at this stage?
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Does any other phone have a better API & App dist system than N900?
Yeah, Objective-C and the iTunes App Store as well as Java and the Android Marketplace beat the hell out of, "Pick a language" and "Good luck, maybe you'll get in some apt repo."
Ovi's a joke and apt is something for purpose built linux installs; not mobile phones. Netbooks, tablets, and other tiny devices running explicitly Linux; sure, mobile phones or PMPs? No. Just, no.
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Did you try to ignore that the recommended way of development is via Qt now, or just don't know? (for both Meamo/MeeGo and Symbian)
And seems recently that iTunes App Store is quite a joke in itself...
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Yes, it's "recommended" to develop in Qt. It's recommended to get into the Ovi store.
These sound like the ruminations of a company that really doesn't give a fuck about their developers.
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Ah, yes, "choice is bad" (hey, you don't have to develop in Qt if you don't want to...)
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Choice does suck.
When you give that choice to developers that is.
Developers DO NOT make the best choices. Period.
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Unless one tells it's the best choice and the way forward for new apps... (and srsly, wut? :> )
Downvoted to oblivion (Score:2, Funny)
Truth hurts, eh Nokia fanboys?
I've owned Nokia phones. They were great in the 90s. Then they took forever to start shipping quad band handsets, and I switched to Sony Ericsson. Then they went through that period where most of [mobileburn.com] their designs [ixbt.com] looked like they were put together by crack-smoking monkeys.
Then came Maemo. The N770 looked interesting. I saw them drop support for it and bring out the N800. I actually bought one of those, and they dropped support for it and brought out the N810. Then they dropped sup
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It's going to have Qt as its API (which also became available for their devices up to around 3 years old), possibly the nicest toolkit there is. Ovi, et al ...I like something is "boring."
No one really cares (Score:2)
In a case similar to Apple iPhone 4/Gizmodo fiasco
Similar except for the fact that in this case that no one really cares...
Apple fan or Apple hater, no one can deny Apple's ability to generate free PR, even inadvertently.
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In Soviet Russia (Score:2)
Happens more then you think... (Score:2)
Back in 1993 I invented an iPhone type device (larger, no multitouch, slower), and needed a cellular data part to test with. I contacted the dev group at Nokia and asked if I could sample a module.
They gave me that part and then 2 days later asked for a return. They mistakenly thought I was an employee... oops. I guess they do read those sign-out sheets though.
And how are the "authorities" going to help? (Score:2)
Evidently, the person with the prototype is in Russia. I guess Nokia probably could pay for whatever police enforcement they would like to have on this, so that may be what is going to happen.
I would suspect the proper answer would be the same as if it was dropped into an active volcano - something along the lines of "Well, there it goes."
Aha ! (Score:2)
Perhaps it was the same person who stole Maemo 6 ... that's been missing for ages.
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IMHO there's been way too many leaks lately. I smell covered-up, underground marketing techniques.
IMHO there's been way too many accusations of underground marketing. I smell cover-up, karma whoring techniques.
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I smell... dinner... must go now! Bye!
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Yeah because a year ago, that number was closer to %50, rather than dropping towards %30.
RIM, Google and Apple are the future of smart phones, not Nokia. Nokia's smartphone marketshare's going down. A lot. There's also nearly zero buzz among non-tech, non-suit types about Nokia's latest; and even among the techies and the suits, Nokia's shine's going away. Nokia had a chance to put together great devices; and failed miserably.
(I've got my doubts about RIM, but they're a nimble and entrenched enough comp
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He wasn't talking about smartphones, but phones; where Nokia has been pretty steady , at 37% now (actually there was a slight growth in the last year IIRC); Apple has 2%, RIM likewise (rounding of from below 2.5...), HTC 1% (whole, that includes their WinMob and BREW devices).
Nokia smartphone sales are 45%, still much greater proportion than their overall share of phone market. With fluctuations to be sure, but you have to remember that it's not a zero sum game - the segment is simply expanding, also in pla
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So, a support for sort of European (they of course have quite a lot of presence throughout the world, also in the US; and even one manufacturing plant quite close to Cupertino...) entity suddenly takes over /. just in stories about this entity? (are there not enough anti-EU types here? Not enough (largely deserved of course) Android fans?)
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Naming of what presumably happens was very secondary to my post - it was, first and foremost, asking how it's supposed to be happening here?