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Israeli Border Police Shoot US Student's Laptop 929

zerothink writes "American student Lily Sussman, 21, upon entry into Israel from Taba (Egypt, Sinai) caught Israeli border police in grumpy mood — after two hours of questions and searching through her belongings they decided to put three bullets through her laptop. Explanation? 'I'm sorry but we had to blow up your laptop.' Haaretz also covered the story." All three bullets missed the hard disk.
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Israeli Border Police Shoot US Student's Laptop

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  • by assemblerex ( 1275164 ) * on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @05:37AM (#30455454)
    She had the following on herself -hand drawn map of downtown Jerusalem -Arabic stickers on laptop -"Fuck Star of David" pic on phone
    -passport stamps from Arab countries -various Arab publications -photos condemning Israeli military action in Gaza
    • by jhoegl ( 638955 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @05:42AM (#30455486)
      Soooo... they nerdraged her puter?
      Seems a little odd they would attack her puter. Feels more like they were little babies because they didnt agree with her on some subjects so they hurt the only thing they could. School playground antics from grown ups, awesome.
      • by OverlordQ ( 264228 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:10AM (#30455672) Journal

        Given the other evidence they probably determined there was a statistically significant percentage that the laptop wasn't just a laptop, so they disposed of it how almost every group disables potential bombs, by shooting it.

      • by flyneye ( 84093 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @08:14AM (#30456520) Homepage

        We're sorry miss, but that is a Macbook. Therefore it is horrible and must be destroyed before our children see it and make an arbitrary decision about the proper O.S. and hardware. You might get away with using that in a Muslim land, but here it is not kosher.

      • Feels more like they were little babies because they didnt agree with her on some subjects so they hurt the only thing they could. School playground antics from grown ups, awesome.

        More likely that the left hand didn't know what the right hand was doing.

        Fact 1: If you show up at an Israeli border crossing with a bunch of Arab stuff, you are going to be subjected to extra questioning.
        Fact 2: If you leave a bag unattended in Israel, it will be assumed to be a bomb (for obvious reasons), and will be destroyed.

        I'm guessing that when the guard saw all her Arab stuff, they told her to leave her bag and go get questioned. Then another guard saw an unattended bag and called the bomb squad, w

    • by Yvanhoe ( 564877 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @05:43AM (#30455492) Journal
      So they had to shoot down her laptop. With three bullets. Missing her hard drive. That really makes sense now.
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by L4t3r4lu5 ( 1216702 )
        They're military grunts, not PC repair men. Tell me, from looking at the case behind the LCD of a laptop, can you tell me where the hard drive is located?

        Do you know what the symbol for "Arm" is on the firing control mechanism for an M1 Abrahms main gun? I'm guessing they have a better idea than you, but then again you have a better idea of which symbol means "hard disk" on a computer case.
    • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @05:49AM (#30455538)

      She had the following on herself -hand drawn map of downtown Jerusalem -Arabic stickers on laptop -"Fuck Star of David" pic on phone

        -passport stamps from Arab countries -various Arab publications -photos condemning Israeli military action in Gaza

      It is not convenient at all forgetting the details you mentioned. They change nothing about the story. The only thing that can justify such an action is if her laptop battery was made by sony.

      Now that's a threat.

    • by Dunbal ( 464142 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @05:55AM (#30455582)

      Of course. Everyone knows that terrorists will do everything they can to draw attention to themselves while setting up a plot.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by VShael ( 62735 )

      She had the following on herself -hand drawn map of downtown Jerusalem -Arabic stickers on laptop -"Fuck Star of David" pic on phone
      -passport stamps from Arab countries -various Arab publications -photos condemning Israeli military action in Gaza

      Unless her name was Ms. McGyver, I don't see how posession of any of these items is a threat to anyone or anything.
      And unless there was a good reason to shoot the laptop, these folks were simply acting like dicks with too much power and too much paranoia. (A common

    • by unbug ( 1188963 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:08AM (#30455648)
      Indeed. I'm constantly amazed at how people carrying Arab publications act all surprised when their laptops get shot.
    • by Sockatume ( 732728 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:09AM (#30455662)

      Half of those are covered by her living in Egypt, half of them by her being a journalist. Either of those in isolation or combination strike you as a bomb threat?

      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        by Xest ( 935314 )

        Um, Egypt and many of it's citizens have fairly good relations with Israel because they realise Hamas, an offshoot of the Islamic Brotherhood is Egypt's biggest terrorist threat. This is why Egypt is happy to help Israel keep up the Palestinian blockade on their border, and why most of Egypt's citizens aren't too fussed about that either.

        "Fuck Star of David" picture isn't something that's covered by either of these and yes it would strike me as a concern as a person responsible for security in a country tha

    • by hashax ( 1190057 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:14AM (#30455700)

      She had the following on herself -hand drawn map of downtown Jerusalem

      Geography students in Israel better start wearing kevlar soon.

      -Arabic stickers on laptop -

      If you're one of the 530 million people speaking Arabic, here's some news - knowing a language could be a crime.

      "Fuck Star of David" pic on phone

      I'm not one for nasty language, but I won't go popping bullets in things I don't like, Mr Columbine.

      -passport stamps from Arab countries -

      What's wrong with visiting an arab country? or do you believe in enclosing a race to their own land and prevent them from outside contact? Similar logic to that of a certain country, I must say.

      various Arab publications

      That sounds plain xenophobic. Education is not synonymous to English or Hebrew.

      -photos condemning Israeli military action in Gaza

      You should start getting trigger-happy with the U.N., Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch and a dozen other human rights monitoring agenices and governemtns, because they condemned military action in Gaza. I should not have to leave my opinion at the border when entering a country, if my opinion is not causing any harm to anyone.

      • by Loki_1929 ( 550940 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @07:17AM (#30456134) Journal

        You quite obviously have the luxury of living in a place where completely random things suddenly exploding isn't a regular occurrence. The border agents in Israel do not have that luxury.

        When Hamas, Islamic Jihad, and all the other local terrorist groups stop stuffing bombs into everything they possibly can in order to blow up buses and nightclubs full of civilians, Israeli border patrol agents can stop testing suspected bomb containers by shooting them as a matter of policy. Until then, if it were my life and the lives of my friends and neighbors on the line, I'd be plugging holes in anything being carried across the border that I thought could even possibly contain a bomb if I had even the slightest thought that something wasn't right.

        This snooty little cunt knew exactly what she was doing and she went there with every intention of stirring up trouble. What she didn't count on was the fact that - unlike where she's from - the government in Israel takes all potential threats seriously because they've been taught to do so by decades of cleverly hidden bombs blowing up their citizens at random. And the reason they questioned her for two hours is because they've learned from vast amounts of experience what to ask and when to figure out what someone's really up to.

        She was packed to the brim with anti-Israel crap and had maps and directions to a public bus station and a hostel in the heart of Israel. She couldn't have looked more like a foreigner coming to do harm if she'd written "TERRORIST" on her forehead in red lipstick. So they decided her laptop could be a bomb and destroyed it the simplest way they could; by shooting it. And after all that? They gave her the info so she could be compensated for the damage done to her property. That's right; they're paying for the damage because it turns out she wasn't a terrorist carrying a bomb; just a snooty cunt carrying a big chip on her shoulder and a lot of attitude.

        • by sharkman67 ( 548107 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @07:52AM (#30456364)
          Wish I had mod points right now. Finally a dead on post. This girl needs to understand the rest of the world is not like the US and her rights don't extend outside it's boarders. She's just lucky she didn't pull this BS in some third world country otherwise she may have just disappeared.
      • by xaxa ( 988988 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @09:12AM (#30457102)

        -passport stamps from Arab countries -

        What's wrong with visiting an arab country? or do you believe in enclosing a race to their own land and prevent them from outside contact? Similar logic to that of a certain country, I must say.

        From the FCO website [fco.gov.uk] (just as an example): "You require a visa for Syria. Whether or not you have a visa you should be aware that if your passport contains an Israeli stamp or stamps from other countries' border crossing points with Israel, you will be refused entry to Syria."

        Similarly, it's not recommended to visit the USA if your passport has a stamp from Cuba. Cuba know this though, so they usually won't stamp foreign passports.

        I should not have to leave my opinion at the border when entering a country, if my opinion is not causing any harm to anyone.

        That's funny, because when I went last visited your country I had to tick a box saying I wasn't a communist.

    • by billius ( 1188143 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @07:17AM (#30456124)
      Conveniently taking said details out of context:

      hand drawn map of downtown Jerusalem

      Could either be suspicious or not depending on what said map entails. Given that according to the blog it was just the main streets in town, I don't really find it that suspicious at all, though I realize we're only getting one side of the story.

      Arabic stickers on laptop

      The Arabic stickers were on the keyboard, which, along with the Arabic phrasebook, would seem to indicate that she was learning the language. I don't know about you, but my guess would be that most people planning to collaborate with Palestinian terrorists would be at least fluent enough in said language not need a phrase book. It's not as if she has a bunch of Arabic stickers denouncing Israel stuck to her computer.

      "Fuck Star of David" pic

      As per TFA:

      a picture of graffiti, which read “Fuck” scrawled next to the Jewish star of David

      It's not like she had some fancy logo from an Anti-Israel website saved as her background or whatever. She saw some graffiti and took a picture of it, that's it.

      passport stamps from Arab countries

      So legally entering and exiting these countries makes her dangerous?

      various Arab publications

      What the hell does this even refer to? All she mentions is an Arabic Phrasebook. You're making it sound like she's reading a signed copy Osama Bin Laden's authorized biography when all she wants to know how to do is order food and ask where the bathroom is.

      photos condemning Israeli military action in Gaza

      From TFA:

      pictures from a photo exhibit about Israel’s January attack of Gaza

      You're assuming that the photos were condemning the military action. There's no mention of whether or not they were for, against or simply neutral on the subject.

      The bottom line is, the only way shooting the laptop makes any sense is if they believed that there was some kind of explosive hidden within it that needed to be safely discharged away from people and given the context, even that sounds like bullshit given that they saw the computer working. Data pertaining to terrorist attacks, etc, could simply be erased. They could have just impounded the hard drive or laptop if they found something about the information suspicious. No matter how I slice it in my head, I can't figure out why on earth they shot a fucking computer except that 1. it might be really fucking fun or 2. they were hardcore MS fanboys.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by stephanruby ( 542433 )

      She had the following on herself -hand drawn map of downtown Jerusalem

      She is Jewish after all (even if she's not religious apparently, that's not a crime). If she's going to Israel, then it sort of makes sense for her to have a map.

      -Arabic stickers on laptop

      You mean? The stamp/sticker of an Arabic/Gypsy woman with rather large bosoms in a red shirt??? Is that the sticker you're speaking of? In Afghanistan too, the Taliban would probably have shot her laptop as well for having such a disgraceful sticker

  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @05:46AM (#30455520)

    But this is what happens if you don't set up partitions properly.

  • Backup! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Jojoba86 ( 1496883 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @05:46AM (#30455524)

    What.all my client case notes and testimony, writing, pictures, music and applications. Years of work. NO!!!! What?? Are you insane?? What were you thinking? THAT’S ALL MY WORK!?

    What? There are a million and one things that could happen to a nice shiny laptop while travelling, if your data is that important it's pretty stupid not to backup, especially before travelling.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      What? There are a million and one things that could happen to a nice shiny laptop while travelling, if your data is that important it's pretty stupid not to backup, especially before travelling.

      I work while traveling so backing up before embarking on a lengthy trip is of limited value. If you are on the road you have three options for backup: You can use an external HD which you have to carry with you and while traveling and which these paranoid guards would have put another three bullets through so although that's a valid option it's no good in a situation like this. Also keep in mind that your backup HD stands a good chance of getting stolen right along with the rest of your luggage. The second

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by AbRASiON ( 589899 ) *

      Do any slashdotters still have the recording of the customers voicemail regarding the lost data on his hard disk? I think it was to Compaq or maybe even Canon (?) it'd be over 10 years old and they replaced his hard disk without telling him and he went proper, proper insane in this voicemail.
      I haven't heard it in years, I do recall the line along the lines of "last 4 years of my goddamn fucking life" or something.

  • by A12m0v ( 1315511 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @05:47AM (#30455526) Journal

    She will be reimbursed on her shot MacBook.

  • by dushkin ( 965522 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @05:47AM (#30455530) Homepage

    Nothing new to me. It even beats American airport security paranoia, I hear.

    Here's an outline of the security measures at the train station near my home (minor suburban station with about a train an hour):

    Before I enter the station, I see guard dogs, handled by security officers (in their 20s). They're actually a bit cute. Except they have sharp teeth and they're trained to kill etc.

    I have to take my bags and put them through an X-ray machine, examined by a clueless security officer. I also have to step through a metal detector in case I have a gun/knife on me (never gets triggered by my belt and house keys)

    Then as the train arrives, commuters are instructed not to board it until "security examinations" are finished (even if it's the back-and-forth shuttle train that only has two stops).

    All train personnal are armed with a pistol. Including drivers. ... And then a 20 year old soldier walks in carrying an M16 and ammo which he is somehow allowed to because he has a slip of paper and uniform.

    Security at its finest!

    • by furball ( 2853 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:09AM (#30455654) Journal

      Security at its finest!

      I'll play! When was the last time someone managed to bomb or hijack a plane originating out of Israel? Now how about the US? UK? India? Germany? France? Spin the globe. Pick a random country.

      Bonus trivia question: How many aircrafts have been hijacked originating from an Israeli airport in the entire history of Israel?

    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by Thanshin ( 1188877 )

      I see guard dogs, handled by security officers (in their 20s). They're actually a bit cute. Except they have sharp teeth and they're trained to kill etc.

      Are those cute, trained to kill, and sharp teethed officers in their 20s, single?

  • well duh! (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @05:48AM (#30455532)

    who wouldnt want to put three bullets through a Mac?

  • by sciencewatcher ( 1699186 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @05:50AM (#30455554)
    Safety and security procedures in Israel are strict, but effective and generally well applied. Terrorists often send 'innocent' foreigners with equipment across the border to test procedures. They now know what does not work. As far as the woman involved concerned, just reading the leaflets with info available at all embassies and airlines would have prevented her laptop in need of replacement.
  • by darkeye ( 199616 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:05AM (#30455634) Homepage

    armed thugs stop the travellers on a regular basis, and demand all sorts of things from them, at gun point. like removing clothing, penetration of clothing (tap search inside pants), stealing items like water bottles and knifes, or destroying property as here. in worst cases they can even enslave you (called arrest and inprisonment now, or rendition)

    this is not much different from the middle ages, where bandits would stop travellers, and demand all sorts of things from them at the threat of physical violence. at least, at that time one could prepare and fight back.

  • Mobility problem! (Score:3, Insightful)

    by zolf13 ( 941799 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:07AM (#30455644)
    Clearly, the iMac was not mobile enough comparing to the bullets.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:10AM (#30455666)
    Based on her current and past posts it is obvious she is anti-israeli. Israel like any country has the right to protect its borders and the security of the state with all means. Trying to harm border guards is not something unheard of there is even a video of a successful attempt running on youtube (www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPyAMSh_yLo) Israel is known to have strict protocols when dealing with suspicious objects (Which includes laptops or any other unattended bags left in any area). I have seen this in action more than once. I.e baggage left accidentally at the bus station will probably get blown up by a bombsquad in a matter of minutes since it has been reported (after the area has been cleared). It's the same in every border in the world. Even laughing about a bomb will get you arrested in most places and probably deported. Don't forget she had arab stickers on her laptop, a picture of a star of david defaced, she has beenliving in Egypt (While it has peaceful relationships with israel , egypt is known to be home for many terrorist cells). The fact is that the laptop was suspicious and got blown up to eliminate a possible threat. Based on Israeli officials she will be reimbursed for the laptop - Hey look on the bright side - she could buy a new MacBook Air
    • by martinbogo ( 468553 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @09:16AM (#30457136) Homepage Journal

      Lets see .. you're a terrorist, and you want to get a bomb into place. So:

      o) you make yourself as conspicuous as possible
      o) ... put antisemitic stuff all over your baggage
      o) ... post TONS of antisemitic stuff on the internet just to be sure
      o) ... enter Israel from a country known to harbor terrorists

      Get my drift? It's that very kind of behavior at a border crossing that makes her the least likely candidate to be carrying explosives. Also, most explosives have a residue signature that can be easily scanned for in Israel because they keep that kind of tech handy at customs points. A few swipes with a swab and a portable scanner later .. you know -exactly- what's in the bag. Five minutes or less. I can't say if shooting her bag was an over-reaction, but I can say that at least at that facility -- they had options.

      At the end of the day, it's a wash. She is getting reimbursed for the laptop, and the Israeli security forces look good inside of Israel, but look silly to the outside world. Nobody really wins.

  • by mirix ( 1649853 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:16AM (#30455704)
    The bullets would have bounced off. But it does figure that angsty types would have an apple product.
  • Priorities (Score:5, Funny)

    by SkunkPussy ( 85271 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:32AM (#30455814) Journal

    On other news websites, "Thankfully, noone was killed". On Slashdot, "All three bullets missed the hard disc".

  • by JenniP ( 824070 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:35AM (#30455834)
    I've crossed into Israel at this particular border point, around 5 years ago, and yes it was one of the hardest border crossings I've ever done, we were part of a tourist party who were going to be in Israel for around 30 minutes (a quick drive through Elat then out into Jordan), and its not somewhere I would take anything bigger than a camera I would even if I could empty the card before I went through. Everything was Xrayed, the metal detectors were so sensitive every scrap of metal was detected, a few people having to remove jeans with quite a few studs, your personal property was swabbed and checked for explosives and then once through there you were grilled about your personal details at passport control, quite a few people getting long grillings. All under the watch of guys with automatic weapons. It wasn't a place you made any kind of joke, you do exactly as you are told. At the time I though it was overkill then a week later this happened http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Sinai_bombings [wikipedia.org], a terrorist attack aimed at the Israelis pretty much at that border point (although on the Egyptian side), kind of puts it all into perspective. Saying that since that border crossing, I am a lot more careful what I take with me, laptops and cameras fully backed up, and only take essentials, even bought a travel laptop so my main machine would stay safe at home. Everything electrical packed into one easy to search bag. Jen
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by t0p ( 1154575 )
      So the border guards interrogate this woman for 2 hours, X-ray her laptop, see her laptop working, and still decide to shoot it... and that's okay because a terrorist detonated a bomb in Egypt? I'm not trying to play down the horror of terrorist bombings. I'm just saying that security concerns do not justify harrassing innocent tourists just because you don't like the look of her.
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by lewko ( 195646 )

      Most of the weapons at Ben Gurion airport are concealed, worn by very attractive officers as it happens. Sexy and deadly.

      I saw plenty more German Shepherds and machine guns on display at Heathrow and Frankfurt airports, where the security was nowhere near as good when it all comes down to it. All show and no go.

  • Stupid bitch (Score:4, Insightful)

    by soundguy ( 415780 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:37AM (#30455848) Homepage

    You have to be pretty goddamn stupid to fly into a fanatical military state like Israel from a Muslim country with a laptop covered in Arabic stickers. What's the next leg of her journey? From Israel to Iran wearing a star of David and demanding a kosher meal?

  • by Sun ( 104778 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @06:44AM (#30455896) Homepage

    Admittedly, it does not sound as if shooting the laptop (and the display, of all things) was necessary, or even helpful. Having said that, the Israeli procedure seem to be:

    Our procedures are strict, but we try to apply them fairly. They HAVE saved life before. We do get it wrong occasionally, and then your property may get hurt. When it does, we apologize and reimburse you

    Contrast and compare that with the US customs, which says:

    Our procedures are arbitrary, and we do not commit to any specific policy. Most people go by unmolested, but if we do decide to molest you, there is nothing you can do about. Deal with it. If we took away your possessions, you will never see them again

    Even on sheer "friendliness", I'm not sure which I prefer.

    Shachar

  • by amiga3D ( 567632 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @07:02AM (#30456036)
    And she entered with her nice little laptop 'puter with the star of David on it and some stickers about how Allah was a faggot and the Iranian president a ninny. I wonder what would have happened? I wonder when Americans are going to wise up to the fact that in some countries they don't have the sense of humor about criticism that we do here. That it can be dangerous to travel abroad with a smug sense of superiority and invulnerability.
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by PjotrP ( 593817 )
      your point being that Israel and Iran are comparable in how they handle criticism?
  • by nidarus ( 240160 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @09:11AM (#30457082)

    Over 300 comments, most of them about how the girl deserved it because she had some Arabic stickers, or how the Israeli police is stupid and evil.

    But the truth is: you don't know. You have no idea what happened there, what made the police suspect the girl, what she actually said to them, what they found in her luggage, or, hell, even if she was a terrorist, you'd have no way of knowing it.

    All you've got is a short news article, and a short blog post, both very light on details. Even the girl doesn't know why the police blew up her laptop. The reporter knows even less. And you, the average slashdotter, know jack shit.

    Seriously, people, get a grip.

  • by thetoadwarrior ( 1268702 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @09:37AM (#30457344) Homepage
    The correct procedure, when coming in contact with a Mac, is to shoot it at least 5 times.
  • Two anecdotes (Score:5, Insightful)

    by oren ( 78897 ) on Wednesday December 16, 2009 @11:40AM (#30459234)

    First - My work place was on the 3rd floor overlooking a main post office. I remember a case where someone left his groceries when he picked up his mail from his mailbox. About 20m later, we saw the guy sprinting back a few blocks down the street. However, the bomb disposal people were at ground level... and their robot shot his bag before he could get close enough for them to see him. Veggies everywhere. So no, this isn't picking up on someone in particular. Leave a bag unattended in a sensitive public place, and this may happen to you - regardless of who and what you are.

    Second - I am sure this girl had a most unpleasant time. She is overlooking the fact that she wasn't a suspect as such. If you were a terrorist trying to smuggle a bomb into a high security area, a good way would be to plant it on some young, sympathetic, naive, idealistic western girl who is "obviously" not a terrorist - a profile this girl fit to a T. To rule this out you need to ask a lot of invasive, personal, seemingly irrelevant questions. If this sounds far fetched to you, read about http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nezar_Hindawi [wikipedia.org] who planted a bomb in his pregnant Irish fiance's bag. I am certain she went through a most unpleasant time as well. I am also certain she appreciated keeping her and her baby's lives. I am also certain all the other passengers on her flight appreciated continuing living, too. And the crew. And all their families. And friends.

    The bottom line is that security in Israel is different from the USA. Instead of inflicting ineffective, mindless, low-level nuisance on everyone, it focuses on people who may (knowingly or unknowingly) pose a risk and gives them a thoroughly unpleasant, but effective, screening. This method works. And for most people, Israeli security is a much more pleasant experience than going through USA security. Of course, for the few who end up getting the 3rd degree, it is much worse.

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