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Smart Bullets Phone Home 158

Posted by CowboyNeal from the jumping-the-gun dept.
giampy writes "New Scientist reports the creation of a 'smart bullet' that can be fired at a target and then transmit back informations via wireless connection. The range is 70m. The project is funded by Lockeed Martin and its official goal is the detection of hidden TNT."
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Smart Bullets Phone Home More

Smart Bullets Phone Home

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  • Yes, this is a good idea (Score:3, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:16AM (#9285149)
    Because we can't tell if our bullets have hit TNT without some sort of tracking system.

    The big explosion only tells us that there may have been TNT in the path of the bullet.

    I gotta get that Lesko book and figure out how to get my fair share of government pork.

  • Smart Bullets, Tom Toles, and Spider-Man (Score:5, Interesting)

    by The I Shing ( 700142 ) * on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:17AM (#9285150) Journal
    The headline about "Smart Bullets" reminds me of a Tom Toles book entitled At least our bombs are getting smarter, a cartoon preview of the 1990s [amazon.com]. The cover art is humorous... a daft (and probably tragically typical) American student can't figure out how to spell "budget," while the man-sized smart bomb sitting at the desk behind him is working out some kind of complex mathematical equation. In the corner of the cartoon, as in all Toles cartoons, there's a tiny punch-line. In this case, someone, probably the teacher, assures the smart bomb that "There'll always be a job for a chap like you." Dear God, it's more true today than it was fourteen years ago.

    As far as smart bullets go, it sounds like the little spider transmitters Spider-Man uses to track the henchmen of his enemies, whom he inevitably follows right back to the bad guy's lair just in time to get clobbered by $villain. I wonder if there's an average number of years between the time a technology is introduced in comic books and the time it becomes a reality. Looks to me like it hovers around thirty.
    • the teacher, assures the smart bomb that "There'll always be a job for a chap like you." Dear God, it's more true today than it was fourteen years ago.

      Dear Logic, why should that be so surprising [blogspot.com]? It should be expected that our technology will continue to get smarter, and faster, than your average "daft" person because of the differences in the rate of evolution.

      Soon enough we won't even have to send any "daft" grunts with smart bullets onto the battlefield; we'll send bots who won't question orders [analogik.org] ins

    • . . .it sounds like the little spider transmitters Spider-Man uses to track the henchmen of his enemies. . .

      Except for the sticky projectile bit tiny little tracking bugs are pretty old hat though.

      You'll find the plans for one at Radio Shack in a Forrest Mims III book published in the 80s. I used them in the 90s to track R/C cars. The basic design can be traced back to the 1920s (medical researchers put them in capsules, had subjects swallow them, and then traced the path they followed through the body).

  • Hrmm (Score:5, Funny)

    by acehole ( 174372 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:17AM (#9285151) Homepage
    I'm glad I don't have the job of testing that...

    shooting at TNT seems a little risky.

    • Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • Re:Hrmm (Score:1, Interesting)

      by Bri3D ( 584578 )
      I'm sorry, but shooting at TNT has as much risk as shooting at a tin can. TNT does not detonate from shock or flame. It must be detonated by an electrical impulse. This is why blasting areas prohibit talking on a cell phone etc. Most dynamite these days is TNT and will explode from electrical implulse, not shock etc.

      • Re:Hrmm (Score:5, Informative)

        by BravoFourEcho ( 581460 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @12:09PM (#9285380)
        As an ex-EOD tech, I can assure you that your impressions are quite incorrect.

        All explosives are detonated by shock and/or heat. The amount of either depends on the formula used for the explosives. RDX, which is the active component of C-4, is quite sensitive on it's own. C-4 adds plasticizers to both reduce the sensitivity of RDX and to make it more plyable (hence, "plastic" explosives). Setting off explosives uses blasting caps (detonators) to provide the approriate shock to cause the explosive to detonate. This is accomplished by setting off a sensitive amount of explosive, which detonates a slightly more powerful explosive, on up until the last bit is powerful enough to set off the C-4.

        The reason that you are required to turn off cell phones and other radio transmitters is because the blasting caps are usually electrically primed, and stray RF can set the caps off. Those long lead wires make very good antennae.

        • Clarification. (Score:4, Interesting)

          by The Tyro ( 247333 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @01:59PM (#9285851)
          not to question an ex-EOD tech (you guys are all a little nuts), but I was under the impression that only some explosives (rather than all) are sensitive to heat, and some to percussion... while some require both to initiate a high-order detonation. C-4, for instance, can be safely set on fire, and will not detonate. It can also be safely exposed to significant mechanical shock, and will not detonate (exposing it to both simultaneously isn't advisable). I've never seen pure cyclonite (RDX) used much... probably due to its sensitivity, as you mentioned.

          Most military high-explosives I've been around don't require much chaining (setting off sequential explosives to detonate a less-sensitive material)... I can't remember the last time I saw anyone use more than a standard cap. (I'm not an bomb/EOD-guy... I've simply been around the stuff a bit).

          The original poster's comment about shooting at TNT is funny... because that's exactly how a fair amount of ordinance gets detonated these days. The last time I was in theatre, the EOD guys were using Barrett light-50's (with a type of european incendiary ammo) to detonate mines and other ordinance... a whole lot easier and safer than walking up to it and setting up the shot by hand. My tactical gear was heavy and unwieldy enough... I don't know how you guys are able to do anything in those bomb suits...
          • ...I was under the impression that only some explosives (rather than all) are sensitive to heat, and some to percussion... while some require both to initiate a high-order detonation.

            Well, the amount of heat or force required depends on the particular explosive. But if you have enough of either, you can generally set off whatever you want. Gunpowder takes very little heat, but C-4 requires quite a bit if no shock is involved. You can burn a lot of explosisves without them detonating. Shock is similar.

            • that's a good way to put it. I wasn't casting any aspersions on the intelligence of EOD and bomb guys (God knows, they come in mighty handy... I've always been thankful to have their expertise in the appropriate situations).

              I don't know what it is about some bomb guys, but some of them like what they do... I don't mean that they're simply cheerful... I mean they really, really like their work. Some of those guys literally have a gleam in their eye when they're working. They remind me of the kid in schoo
        • Its my understanding that in order to start off a high explosive reaction you must impact it with a velocity equal to or greater than the explosives burn rate... IE some high explosives explode at a rate of say 3400 feet per second and need a impact velocity of 3400 feet per second or greater. A blasting cap is made of high explosive that has a burn rate greater than the explosive being detonated... :-)

        • Re:Hrmm (Score:2)

          by Malc ( 1751 )
          EOD? What is this? Bomb squad?
        • EOD = explosive ??? disposal? Ordinance?
      • well I'm going to send you up to look after the TNT next time, Darwin will take care of it .... What you use to set of TMT etc is not and electrical current .... it's an electrically fired detonator - that creates the shock wave in the explosive that causes the detonation ... uh kind of like firing a bullet into it .... that's the difference between "detonation" or "explosive" and just burning fast - the chemical decomposition is driven by a shockwave at the speed of sound.

        Sure detonators can be set off b

        • Re:Hrmm (Score:2)

          by AJWM ( 19027 )
          that's the difference between "detonation" or "explosive" and just burning fast - the chemical decomposition is driven by a shockwave at the speed of sound.

          Very close. With a high explosive, the detonation wave travels faster than the speed of sound in that material. Power aside, the advantage is that such explosives don't have to be confined or tamped, they're self-tamping. (The mechanical impulse that would push material aside travels at the speed of sound.) Low explosives (gunpowder and the like) w

    • Even if the target doesn't blow up there could be mines between you and where the bullet landed!

      SGT Smith: PVT Jones, fire the transmitter on that big hunk of metal.

      PVT Jones: Okay, I hit it.

      SGT Smith: Okay, the transmitter says its clean. You go over and check it out.

      PVT Jones: Good news, I'll run right over there sarge.

      SGT Smith: PVT Marshall fire the transmitter on that hunk of metal next to PVT Jones...

    • When someone is hot with one of these "smart" bullets, perhaps they could "trace" the device the bullet was communicating with, leading to an arrest.
    • No, no, that's only the facade reason. The real reason is to tell the CEO where his wife has been last night.

  • The AI bullet (Score:5, Funny)

    by Colin Smith ( 2679 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:17AM (#9285152)
    Oooh. I think therefore I am... *CRUNCH*!

  • Shoot first.... (Score:5, Funny)

    by nabil_IQ ( 733734 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:19AM (#9285165) Homepage
    Shoot first, get answers later.
    • (prolly gonna get troll-modded for this but it's what I think
      Technology won't save troops from deteriorating political situations, it just adds another tool to carry and another IT support problem - and with any projectile-launcher, another way by which to cause civilian injuries and the concomitent reprisals.

      Safety can only be gained by acting (in terms of foreign, domestic and social policy) in a manner which does not inspire bloodthirsty desire for vengeance in people of other cultures. Use an ethic

      • Re:Shoot^H^H^H^H^H think first... take cover later (Score:1, Interesting)

        by Anonymous Coward
        I'm not a big fan of Bush (in fact I dispise him), but the war in Iraq was a long time coming. I believe that future historians will group both GWI , the blockade, and GWII into one conflict, in the same way was we now look at the "hundred years war"

        The morning of Sept 11, we had no troops in hostile teritories, no prisoners being held illegally, and no delared wars with any country. Ethics didn't help us avoid that disaster. In fact our commitment to help repel Saddam Hussain in GWI was the spark which

        • Apologies to slashdot moderators, I'm going offtopic here - these are interesting comments, and worth the time to reply.

          Disclosure, I'm not a US Citizen, although I suspect you've already realised this. When people speak about the effect the United States has upon the world we're not just discussing military operations.. in fact about the only thing we're not talking about is Joe Public.
          I specifically referred to "foreign, industrial and social policy" as I don't see a real distinction. The United State
          • |> There is significant anger at the US' |> diplomatic policies which support and defend |> Israel, a state which is in defiance of more |> UN Resolutions than Iraq ever was, and one |> which unlike Iraq was founded illegally and |> in defiance of commonly-accepted rights. I beg your pardon?!
            Israel was founded prefectly legally and in accordance with a UN Resolution of 1947.
            Which resolution was rejected by all Arab countries and they keep defying THAT resolution by denying the r
        • "It's not an easy situation, perhaps you believe that Saddam Hussain was a just and kind leader who was no threat at all, I think that it is pretty obvious that he wasn't."

          I don't think ANYONE believes that Saddam was a "just and kind leader".

          I also believe that ANYONE who believes Saddam was a threat to the US is living in a fantasy.

          "The morning of Sept 11, we had no troops in hostile teritories, no prisoners being held illegally, and no delared wars with any country."

          Well, we had people in Saudi Arabi

  • Comics (Score:1, Redundant)

    by KrisHolland ( 660643 )
    "New Scientist reports the creation of a 'smart bullet' that can be fired at a target and then transmit back informations via wireless connection. "

    Didn't Spider man always use to shoot homing devices on cars etc and track them ;). I am surprised it took until now to get it developed in real life.

  • What will we call this? (Score:5, Funny)

    by BabyDave ( 575083 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:23AM (#9285177)

    We've got warchalking, wardriving, so this would be ... er, warwar?

    • No, warwarring is unauthorized use of an unprotected wifi used by smart bullets. These have authorized use of the wifi.

      I wonder why the range is only 70 meters. They should hire those guys from New Zealand to make a system w/ a longer range.

  • And then what? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by divine_13 ( 680820 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:23AM (#9285179) Homepage
    So, after the bullet hit a target, it transmits information back to tell for example where it hit, damage made etc.
    The fun part starts if the host could transmit data back to the bullet, telling it how to operate next. Who knows what it can do? Explode, burrow etc...
    O.O
    This will be the end of cool action shooting scenes in movies though.
    • There was an article in Popular Science a number of years back about a new gun being developed for the military, with "programable" bullets, you could have them explode on impact, or after having burrowed for a number of seconds. It also split into two guns, a pistol and a lower powered rifle.

  • Understatement? (Score:4, Funny)

    by Elequin ( 137149 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:23AM (#9285180)
    "King also warns that firing a projectile at a potential explosive goes against bomb disposal guidelines."

    Ya think? I know one way bomb squads dispose of potential bombs is to simply blow them up, but to fire a bullet (even if just at paintball speeds) at a potential explosive, just to try to find out if it's an explosive? Seems pretty silly.
    • Dude, when in Belgium the bomb squads goes out, it's al over the news. Hey, it's a small country.
      And every time, I saw them drive a little car to the pakket and shoot it to pieces.
      And yes, I have the exact same question:
      WTF?
      • As said by N.N. here - better than poking them. If the bomb don't go off when you shoot it i guess there is little chance that it is just a booby-trap.

        And besides - what are the bomb-crew supposed to do? bring a ton of explosives and blow the POTENTIAL bomb just to be sure?

        if it doesn't go off it's relatively safe to approach the device. if it blows, well then you know the answer - and at least you didn't ADD explosives to the blast.

        i think i read that ordinary bomb-crew robots carry either a gun or

  • and the bullet said (Score:4, Funny)

    by Easy2RememberNick ( 179395 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:25AM (#9285187)
    Bullet: "Splat!"

    That's going to be a lot of bullets to track.

  • Really Officer (Score:5, Funny)

    by Prince Vegeta SSJ4 ( 718736 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:25AM (#9285189)
    I wasn't shooting at the bank teller, the bullet was trying to find TNT
  • If result of Step 1 is: No detonation then most likely, there's no TNT.

    Of little on topic relavence: Have you seen what a blended metal bullet does to a potroast? [gizmodo.com]

  • Reminds me of an old defence company advert... (Score:5, Funny)

    by mikael ( 484 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:27AM (#9285193)
    ... all our missiles are guaranteed to hit the ground if they fail to reach the target...

  • OT: Why can't we moderate stories down? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Some of the stories posted to this site are pretty lame. Others are obviously flamebait or troll. Why can't we moderate the top level as well as the comments?

    • Because that's not how slashdot works. (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      There ARE sites that allow you to moderate the top level stories. Kuro5hin [kuro5hin.org] comes to mind. I believe there's a public-voting version of Metafilter as well.

      However those sites just somehow haven't wound up being as popular as Slashdot. Go figure. So did Slashdot just get lucky, or is Slashdot actually doing something right?
    • Some of the stories posted to this site are pretty lame. Others are obviously flamebait or troll. Why can't we moderate the top level as well as the comments?

      Because CowboyNeal doesn't want to be replaced by a very small shell script?

      Seriously though it'd be cool: 7 of 15 stories, 8 stories beneath your contempt (or whatever).

      • K5 [kuro5hin.org] or any other scoop [kuro5hin.org] based site for that matter. Community edited is the keyword you're looking for.

        /. prides itself of its exceptionnally good editors, if you are unsatisfied there are plenty of community edited sites...

  • Semi-Dupe (Score:5, Informative)

    by TwistedKestrel ( 550054 ) <twistedkestrel@gmail.com> on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:30AM (#9285211) Journal
    Don't know why nobody has noticed this yet, but we already covered this topic [slashdot.org] a couple days ago.
  • If these are used for, let's say, more violent purposed:
    "Yup ...... he's definitely dead. Nice shot."
  • If someone runs, shoot at the car, stop the persuit and hunt for the signal later.

    This might just save some lives.

    • Re:How about car chases? (Score:1, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Not always possible. Some persuits need to be stopped quickly. Usually because the driver presents a grave danger to the public (i.e. drunk, escaped felon). By the time they catch up to the signal, they car may have been ditched with the criminal long gone.

  • So... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Daimaou ( 97573 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:44AM (#9285278)
    ...can I shoot one at my boss so I'll always know where he is, or will it kill him?

    Actually, never mind, it seems a win-win situation either way.
  • FATAL ERROR: damn its not TNT its a hydro...**KAAABOOOM**
  • Ooo, maybe now they can make that tracking sniper rifle [backfire.dk] that some one came up with as a scam.
    Though I'd guess you'd notice it if you got hit with a paint ball, like this thing is.

  • And what does a smart bullet say... (Score:4, Funny)

    by Vellmont ( 569020 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @12:03PM (#9285354) Homepage
    After it hits someone? "He's dead, Jim" of course.
    Sorry, it had to be said.

  • Receiving transmission... (Score:5, Funny)

    by Gilmoure ( 18428 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @12:07PM (#9285374) Journal
    Wind! Lots of wind! ...
    Something's coming towards me. I wonder if it'll be my friend? ...
    Ack! I've crashed into something! Oooooh! It's really icky in here. There's all sorts of red stuff going past me. I think I'm tumbling, too. Urp! I think I'm going to be sick. ...
    Some kind of hard, white tree or something just shattered on my face. ...
    Well, it looks like the ride has stopped. ...
    Hello? Hello? Anyone out there? ...
    Isn't anyone going to come and get me? It's really noisy here. Sounds like someone's screaming or something. And it really stinks here too. Looks like someone's mixed a septic tank and cow in a wood chipper. What a mess. Who the hell would do this? This sucks! Game over, man, game over!

  • Ummm........this story has already been posted here on slashdot already here [slashdot.org]

  • ...but, if you shoot TNT, won't it blow up?

  • official goal (Score:3, Funny)

    by frovingslosh ( 582462 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @01:01PM (#9285531)
    its official goal is the detection of hidden TNT

    Lets not make too many jokes about shooting bullets at explosives. This is only the official goal . I'm sure Ashcroft and his gang have prefectly good reasons for wanting to go around shooting bullets randomly, and hoping to hit TNT. Americans must learn to give up our rights and safety and sanity in the fight against terrorism.

  • Like any other technology, this could be abused (Score:3, Interesting)

    by EchelonZero ( 555776 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @01:11PM (#9285579)
    This story reminded me of a recent art exhibit in NYC. Jakob Boeskov, an Danish artist, infiltrated an international weapons fair in China with a fake weapon, the "ID Sniper Rifle". While his story is interesting, his concept weapon was frightening; although even more frightening was the response it received from interested parties at the fair.

    What is the ID Sniper Rifle?

    To put it short, the idea is to implant a GPS microchip in the body of a human being, using a high-powered sniper rifle as the long distance injector. The microchip will enter the body and stay there, causing no internal damage, and only a very small amount of physical pain to the target. It will feel like a mosquito bite, lasting a fraction of a second.

    At the same time, a digital camcorder with a zoom lens fitted within the scope will take a high-resolution picture of the target. This picture will be stored on a memory card for later image-analysis. GPS microchip technology is already being used for tracking millions of pets in various countries, and the logical solution is to use it on humans as well, when the situation demands it.

    -------------

    Projectiles witht the ability to "phone home" are in our near future. How long can we expect to wait until something like the ID Sniper Rifle really exists?

    Check out Boeskov's account of the weapons fair- crazy! http://events.thing.net/Boeskov_text.html [thing.net]

  • Hunting (Score:3, Interesting)

    by ivan1011001 ( 751254 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @01:14PM (#9285596)
    I don't know about all this TNT finding stuff, but I can see the major benefits for hunters using these. Deer hunters sometimes can't bring a deer down right away (think drunks, or someone shooting through brush, both of wich are bad shooting habits) and so they have to track it through the woods.

    Now, assuming the bullet didnt go all the way through, instead of following drops of blood for miles we can follow the bullet. It says the range is only 70m, but maybe that'll get better by the time they (maybe) release it for the public.

    B/c for reasons other than hunting, it sounds completely pointless.
    • Great.. now people can sit in their camouflaged camouflaged tent, shoot a deer from a few hundred feet, and casually walk after it tracking their bullet. Why not just hire someone to go kill the deer while the 'hunter' sits and suns himself..
  • New Scientist reports the creation of a 'smart bullet' that can be fired at a target and then transmit back informations via wireless connection. The range is 70m.

    "Hey Bob, where's the smart bullet?"

    "Let me check the computer...hmm, over...there, next to the coffee machine."

    Seriously, what the hell use is a tracking device that's only good for 70 meters? Or did the poster use the wrong units, and it should have been 70 mi?

  • You'll have no problem detecting TNT by shooting at it. Why the bullet needs to be "smart" eludes me considering it will likely be incinerated in the blast.
  • These bullets were used in the anime Ghost in the Shell movie(1998?). The non-techie member of the team shoot off two of these at an escaping vehicle.

    Life imitating art?
  • correct me if im wrong (which im not)

    but its Lock h eed dammit

  • I'm sure it's been said. (Score:3, Funny)

    by mcrbids ( 148650 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @03:43PM (#9286384) Journal
    "Dammit, I'm too old for this shit", said the stern, muscular, middle-aged Marine commander, surveying with binoculars.

    Dozens of miltary agents and officers stand in front of cars parked in the street. Lights are flashing, numerous troops stand around, guns drawn, facing a building.

    Across the street, a badly shaven, greasy-looking middle-eastern (sterotype = terrorist, a la "True Lies") holding an automatic rifle in one hand, defenseless female in another screams threats from the large white house.

    "Call in the sniper-detector" said the large, square-jawed Marine commander.

    Up comes a small, wiry man in camoflauge, donning thick eye-distorting glasses. There's a weird electro-mechanical contraption vaguely resembling a satellite dish fixed to his military helmet.

    "Sniper-detector Melvin reporting for duty, sir!" says the wiry gent.

    "I need you to tell me if there are any explosives in that there building!" screams the military commander.

    "Aye sir!" screams back the nerdly sniper-detector in a fearful tone.

    Melvin promptly enters and briefly emerges from an unmarked, large, black moving truck parked nearby, holding a long, powerful-looking sniper rifle, on which is an enormous-looking scope.

    "Here, I need you to shoot this into the building when I tell you to!", says Melvin to a nearby, muscular ground trooper. "Make sure not to hit anybody!" he adds with intent and feeling.

    Melvin then disappears into the back of the large, black truck.

    "OK!" comes the muffled scream from Melvin in the back of the truck.

    With a barely perceptible nod, the trooper takes the gun, and with careful, confident smoothness, the trooper points the rifle at the building, and carefully takes aim at the building and carefully fires a single shot.

    KABOOM!

    Boards and shrapnel fly in all directions, the blast blowing back everybody standing against the ground. Windshields and car windows are shattered, a hubcap noisily rolls by, eventually coming to rest against a heavily damaged 2x4.

    Officers and agents get up, dusting themselves off, one officer screaming in pain off in the distance. As officers and infantryman check each other to assess the damage, the back door of the truck flies open.

    "Good news, sir!" says Melvin, suddenly pausing as he surveys the damage all around.

    "What's that, dammit!" screams the commander.

    "Well, sir, I was going to say that there was no sign of nuclear weapons, just some plastic explosives..."
  • That you're going to shoot at a suspected TNT container and see if it's actually TNT.

    Why not just go sit on top of it and light up.
  • Can we get one that finds huge caches of WMDs in Iraq?
  • Because god knows, the first thing we want to do if we suspect we've found TNT is shoot at it.
  • Wasn't it Gene Simmons, the guitarist from Kiss, and not a bad actor, who played the villian with the gene-coded smart bullets that tracked targets ?
  • Without RTFA, I'll bet these bullets cost exactly $5,000.... Just like Chris Rock said they would.
  • Tom Selleck Already Knew how to handle those in the 80's.. who remembers the movie Runaway [imdb.com] ? the bad guy literally had bullets with your name written on. and those spiders ... OMG... I had nightmares with those... I was 6 when I first watched this movie...

    and it is a movie by Michael Crichton ! he is a genius...

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