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Wireless Networking The Internet Hardware

Mobile Internet Down Under 192

Posted by timothy from the fending-off-roo-attacks dept.
Anonymous Coward writes "A truck, a sat dish and a sunburnt country. When you absolutely positively need to connect to the Internet, why not carry your own broadband connection with you? One Aussie guy and his wife are doing just that -- packed up the lot and have gone on the road, so far roughly 3000km. He says 'Of course nothing is simple. The salespeople were convinced that I couldn't line up the dish -- it took me about an hour to figure out and now roughly takes about ten minutes each time I set up. They told me that the wireless gear wouldn't talk to the modem, they told me that my Debian workstation wouldn't be supported, they told me that the BOC wouldn't talk to me, they told me that I needed training, they told me that it wasn't done and it wouldn't work, they told me that I'd void my warranty, they told me so many stories..'"
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Mobile Internet Down Under More

Mobile Internet Down Under

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  • i can already see his new slogan (Score:5, Funny)

    by tokaok ( 623635 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @02:13AM (#7091733)
    Can you ping me now?

  • Typical salesmen (Score:4, Insightful)

    by switched4OSX ( 668686 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @02:16AM (#7091743)
    Sounds like this guy dealt with the modern day saleman. When people don't know the answer to your questions, it is easier for them to say "can't be done" than "I don't know, let me see if someone else does". At least he had the initiative to figure it out himself, though.
    • Most salesman I interact with will tell you that [whatever your buying] can do [anything].

    • Re:Typical salesmen (Score:3, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward
      To be fair, they parsed "has never been done" to "cannot be done," and they were right until he proved them wrong. Now when faced with similar problems they'll reply with, "Well there was this one really crazy guy...."
    • You know, in some ways it's better to say "can't be done" or at least "you can try, but it's your problem" than the all-too-common "sure, sure, that'll work FINE, just buy the damnn thing".

      I've had that experience more than a few times, and personally I'll take "can't be done" anytime. It's irritating, but nothing like as bad - especially when it's an ISP with a large monthly fee who doesn't actually care if you're getting service or not, you still have to pay.
    • There's an old saying that applies to situations like this:

      "Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, and why. Then do it."
      -- Robert Heinlein, from "The Notebooks of Lazaras Long," in Time Enough For Love

  • Of course it's not supported. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by JessLeah ( 625838 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @02:17AM (#7091747)
    Most ISPs (and I would imagine Satellite ISPs are no different) operate wholly on scripts. If you deviate from what is accepted on those scripts, you're not supported. In most cases, simply running anything other than Windows or (occasionally) Mac OS/Mac OS X is enough to lose your support.

    I had an ISP once who wouldn't even help me out when the link went completely down and the DSL modem couldn't even sync... because I ran Linux. They begged and pleaded with me, "Do you have a Windows machine you can use?"...

    Given that things like this are the norm, do you honestly expect some guy in a truck with a Debian box to get support?

    Amazing accomplishment. If I were the person who pulled this off, I'd send a long letter to the CEO of my ISP, telling them what people can do with "unsupported" setups. Not like it'd make much of a difference. The only way ISPs can find enough "qualified" techs is if the only "qualification" is "can read from a script and follow simple orders".
    • It's not that the techs that don't want to help you, it's management that forbids it.
      Basically, they say that if a customer gets support once for linux, then he'll want support next time he calls no matter which tech answers.
      And of course ISPs don't want to train all their CSRs to support linux and other OSes.

      And as most tech support is outsourced anyways, unsupported platforms simply make shorter calls, which both the tech and management loves.

      • Perhaps ISPs need to have specialists for each operating system.

        I'm sure they don't have many people that call who run Linux, so they wouldn't need that many CSRs to deal with these calls.

        • The only ISPs that could afford to have a specialist for OS's would have to have over a million customers. The one I work for has about 500,000 and I get about 1 call every 4 months from someone using Linux/OS2/Somethingelse. There's ~120 techs at the company, and if they get the same amount, then that would give your OS specialist just over 1 call per day. Just isn't worth it. 98% of the people run Windows or Mac, and 95% of the people running other don't need help setting up a PPP or ethernet connection.

      • No! Longer calls!!! (Score:4, Funny)

        by eatdave13 ( 528393 ) <davec@lepertheory.net> on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @03:04AM (#7091877)

        Management likes shorter calls, poor techs like shorter calls. I like longer calls. The more I can stretch it out, the better. As it is, I'm so far above the highest metric for CPH that I get told to slow down. Their reasoning is that I'm going so fast I can't possibly be fixing their problem, even though I have almost 0 callbacks. I'm pretty sure that deep down they think I figured out a way to trick the ticketing system, especially since I get ob'd literally 1 in 3 calls I take. It's a pain in the ass, because the ob software slows my machine down to a crawl. Meanwhile, techs taking half as many calls as me get ob'd like 1 in 50 calls. Probably doesn't help that I've testified against them a few times in our union lawsuit...

        Start off every call with "OK, go ahead and restart your computer." That's a great one, because if they're not talkative it's like a mini break. Reinstall TCP/IP every excuse you get, that's 2 reboots unless they only have one phone line. Oh, and when the call starts, just let 'em talk. They'll usually go for about two minutes, and only the last few sentences usually matter, so you can tune 'em out and just kind of skim what they're saying. And if they say that you're being rude, just tell them, "I'm not being rude, ma'am." They always believe it. I don't know why, but they do.

        • I had a guy who only listened to the last few words I said when I called tech support last week for my DSL line. The error code changed right after I went on hold, then the error went away just as I got off the hold queue and with a live person. I tried to explain how my service had been restored about 30 seconds ago, but as soon as he heard "30 seconds" he started launching into a script for dealing with Blaster.

          <shudder>
        • What does ob mean?
    • Both the big two broadband [bigpond.com] providers [optusnet.com.au] in Australia flatly refuse to deal with anything other than Windows or Mac. Ex-housemate and I had heard stories to this effect when we ordered Optus cable [optusnet.com.au] to our house, so we decided to let them think we were going to use Windows internet connection sharing to pass the cable between two different machines. Within 30 minutes of the cable guys leaving we had an old Pentium running Mandrake routing the cable through every PC in the house (about 6 if memory serves me right)
    • ...but the only way at those salaries. And, if you put qualified techs on the front lines of an ISP, they'd probably end up in the looney bin over all the incredibly stupid lusers. And no, it's not as simple as escalation. While qualified people might know whether something should be escalated to a qualified person or not, the monkeys on scripts don't have a clue, and aren't able to separate between technobabble and someone that really has a clue.

      Kjella

      • Case in point... me :) I'm a qualified tech on the front line, and I AM in the loony bin. WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE E EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!! !! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAW WWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHH!!!! Buahahaha ahahhahahahah ahahahahhTBBBBBBPHHHHHHHH!

        2 YEARS OF FRONT LINE TECH SUPPORT, BIATCHES!!! WAHOOOO!!!

        I can write C++, recomplie a kernel, make up firewall rules and routing tables in my sleep, and I'm talking to people that don't know you have to push the litt

      • aren't able to separate between technobabble and someone that really has a clue.

        ME :Do you block out-bound port 25?
        AOL Tech: Sir We do block any ports
        ME: then why can't I send Email to my server through AOL?
        AOL: We have no open issues with Email today, other users are sending mail just find, are you sure your email client is set up properly?
        ME: I can send Email to MY server just fine through an other ISP, but I can't through AOL, do you block out-bound SMTP port 25?
        AOL: Sir did you say My server?
        ME: yes
    • Go ahead and work for an ISP for half a day. Take some support calls. If you manage not to shout, go crazy, and keep call time down (even with interesting clients) then start your own ISP callcenter and use your skills to sell outsourced support for ISPs.

      Whenever you have a huge subscriber base, you can bet your life that most of them will say stupid shit all the time, will expect you to support all the software they have, and try to get you to support their printer and scanner, for example:

      "I can't use

    • Just play along (Score:4, Interesting)

      by adamsc ( 985 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @02:55AM (#7091853) Homepage
      It's not even worth trying to reason most times - I've gone through the "packets disappear 5 hops into cox.net territory and started doing so suddenly w/o config changes here" game a few times and it's much faster to play along:

      "Yes, I made those changes. Let me reboot. [3 seconds] Nope, still broken. Yes it rebooted, I have a really fast computer. Okay, I'll hold for level 2."

      Once you get past the drones at level one, you can get to the people who are allowed to tell you things like "the router serving your entire county is down" (this actually happened). I asked why the level one guys couldn't simply say "Nobody in San Diego has service" - the level two guy claimed that they not only weren't allowed to deviate from the script but in fact would be punished if they were caught! (Hence the term "drone" - if you weren't one before you started there, just wait a few months...)

      • Re:Just play along (Score:5, Funny)

        by fven ( 688358 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @04:44AM (#7092120)
        I had some firmware driver issues with hardware I'd purchased. I only twigged to what was going on when the retail people let me set up my hardware next to their display model - theirs worked, mine didn't - theirs was twelve months older than mine.
        Got some mates together, worked out exactly which drivers did and didn't work, then rang the given number and asked for a firmware upgrade (or preferably downgrade).
        First we went through what kind of carpet I had, then she thought that "about two feet" off the ground was a bit high (measure the height of your desk). I got a little insistent that it was a software problem on their side - she asked if I ment games. I explained that there was software sort of pre-programmed into the chip that told it what it was and how it should detect it's environment and react accordingly (well it does...). She put me on hold for a while, then came back and told me that none of the other girls had ever heard of what I was on about and so she couldn't help me.
        Ugh..I'm still stuck with defective hardware....
      • Yes, what people forget is that level 1 service people are usually little better than meatware text ->speech algorithms. If your text->speech algorithm started saying anything other than what you told it to say, you would replace it.

        Just lie, play along with the script, and wait to get to the level 2 people. Then, when you get to the level 2 people, DON'T act all cocksure - DON'T try to come across as an "expert". From a L2 tech support person's perspective, a person who is trying to act like an "exp
        • Level 2 can suck too. I was having a problem with RoadRunner. I went through level 1, no help. He sent me to "Network Support".

          The chick on the other end was dumb as a rock. She had to be working out of her trailer, I could hear babies and dogs in the background. Her stock answer was that they had to send out a tech, and I had to pay for it. No way in hell. I told her if a tech came out he was taking the fucking cable modem back with him. I asked for her supervisor. She said he "wasn't there". Sh
          • I finally fixed the damn thing myself...
            Ever get the impression that's what they had in mind? It costs more to hire someone who can fix the problem than someone who can annoy you into doing it and that gives them the option of blaming all future problems on your work, too.

    • Simple solution (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Sycraft-fu ( 314770 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @06:08AM (#7092371)
      Lie. That's what I always did with Qwest. Their support constraints were amazingly stupid, so I'd just lie about what I had. The OS wasn't a problem, actually, since I run 2000 and they do support that. However they did NOT support the fact that I had a network. Now this might seem reasonable until you realise that I had professional class service. I had my own subnet of 8 static IPs and an external router (provided by them). Now any reasonably intelligent person would assume that the purpose of all this is to have a network of computers. Seems to make little sense to plug the router into one system and assing all the IPs to it.

      Well, they steadfastly maintained it wasn't supported and I'd need to plug the router right in to my computer. This was not only not really possible (router was ina different room) it was outright fucking stupid. Since I could access the router via telnet, which went over my internal network, I could verify that it was NOT the problem. Also, I could ask the router what was the problem, and it told me that I lacked a DSL dignal. This I tired to explain to them to no avail. So I began lying about not having a network. This never stuck any of them as odd.

      Next we got to the router reconfiguration. Every time they wanted me to blow away my router's config and redo it from scratch. I again tried to explain that the config had not changed. It was working with the config on it, and then it stopped working. I hand't changed anything, I was the only one with the password, therefore hte config was NOT the problem. Also, again I tried to explain that the router was telling me what was the problem (I was getting no signal since the DSLAM was broke). Again, no avail, so I simply lied about keying in their config they read to me. I wasn't, of course, because it was not only a waste of time, it was the wrong config, it setup a router for NAT operation whereas I didn't do that.

      After dealing with this, I skipped the arguing and went straight to the lying with subsequent steps. I was asked to do retarded things like install a TCP/IP for a dialup adapter (yes, really) and so on. I'd claim I did them, and then let them try the next thing. Eventually they expended their little script and I got escelated.

      Now the real solution, if you can do it, is to get on an ISP not run by retards. I've been happy with Speakeasy. They are happy to treat me like I know what I'm talking about, and answer my questions in a straightforward way. I can call and ask for information or status and get it, without some argument. Also they seem to be competent and can troubleshoot in an intelligent way.

      However, if your ISP is dumb, and most are, just lie about your setup. It'll save you a lot of time.
      • Amen.
        When I was with BTOpenwoe (BTOpenworld but...) I had major ADSL problems - some web sites I could access and others not, and my mail server was unreachable (not hosted by BTO). The fact that I run Kmail on Linux was a slight problem, they wanted me to run outlook express and tell them that didn't work...

        Eventually I told them that was what I was doing and that it didn't work and could they fix their network please. I think it took two days before they got me re-connected and I'm still wondering why I h

      • I used to go through these same sorts of gyrations with Verizon DSL. I recently switched to (cheaper) Time Warner cable service (in NYC) and I FINALLY have an ISP that will tell me when there's an outage at Level 1 tech support, and doesn't force me to step through some retarded script, "are all the filters still on the line?", "is your computer still connected to the DSL modem?, blah blah blah, force me to lie about having a router (I wasn't supposed to use one unless it was their approved model). Verizo
        • The stupidity of Qwest actually did work to my advantage on a couple of occasions. I several times got overbilled for things. Like when I got it setup at my new place, they provisioned my IPs ($25 charge) in the wrong city. This I called about and they reprovisioned them in the right city, wrong call centre. Finally another call straightened it out and I could use my IPs. Of course, when the bill got there, there were charges for the two misprovisions.

          I explained, with great dificulty, the problem to the b
    • My OS and networking software works just fine without my ISP's support. All I need from my ISP are a few simple pieces of information about their network, IP addresses of gateways, domain name servers and my own box. Now that they have forced everyone onto evil, dial up style dhcp, I don't even need that. I don't need them to tell me what to put into /etc/networking/interfaces, my OS comes with very good documentation. That's the way the internet is supposed to work, by standard and consistent interface

  • My one question is... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by MickLinux ( 579158 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @02:18AM (#7091752) Journal
    ... where can one get 2-way satellite internet connectivity in various parts of the world; how much does it cost [he had a ton of trouble with some of these options]; and where do you buy it?

    When I was looking at the Debian sat-dish mini howto, they had some lists of satellites, but I found no way to actually buy in. Even emails went unanswered.

    For me, it's the Baltic region (Lithuania). But it could be Rotterdam, or Liverpool, or anywhere I roam. So a list of the different options might be useful.

    • Re:My one question is... (Score:5, Informative)

      by cruachan ( 113813 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @02:53AM (#7091846)
      I'm sitting in the Scottish Highlands with a 2-way connection to Hughes Europe provided by Bridge Broadband (just a reseller - www.bridgebroadband.co.uk). They do 2-way for 99 per month and are pretty good about non-standard setups - seem to take a line something like while they won't guarentee to keep you running if your not using their specified configuration they'll have a damm good shot at trying :-). As a reseller I suspect they're the size of three men and a dog - but there is definate advantages to having what is effectively a 'mon & pop' satellite ISP.

      Apparantly there's now a fair sized market for this sort of thing in northern scotland - for example many rural post offices have satellite connections to link into the post office's IT systems.

      Don't know about roaming per se, but what I think is their main salesman makes a great point of demo'ing satellite broadband by turning up at a seminar/demo, setting up his portable dish outside the venue and having the whole caboodle running in about 10 or 15 minutes. Again I doubt they would officially support it, but they'd probably smile benignly on one's attempts. Anyway take home message must be that aligning the dish really cannot be that hard given the right equipment.
      • there is definate advantages to having what is effectively a 'mon & pop' satellite ISP.

        There's also some pretty big disadvantages. Like when Pop calls up and says, "Hey. So... Ya lookin' at porn, huh? Yeah, I know how that is. You don't mind if I follow along on my machine, do y--Ooh! I like her... Yeah, baby. No, no, no, go back to her. I wasn't done yet."
      • Hughes is doing pretty much all the 2-way sat stuff these days.

        If you're looking for *Mobile* satellite Internet, check out Motosat. The Motosat equipment is designed to be attached to the roof of an RV or truck, and while it doesn't work while you're driving the system is nice enough to set itself up when you've parked.

        Motosat covers north america, and mexico, but seeing as how it's using Hughes birds and technology I'm sure that there is an alternative for Europe and err, more remote locations.

        Come to

        • I looked at MotoSAT, liked it and sent them an email on October 2, 2002. I'm still awaiting - though I confess no longer with baited breath - a response.

          They must have enough customers...

    • While in the military. A bunch of us were overseas for the war in Afghanistan, and were really hungry for some unfiltered internet access. We had mil access, but the military access rules were a bit too restrictive for our tastes, and everything was constantly monitored. (the thought of some E-1 laughing his ass off and showing my sweet sappy emails to my wife around to all his buddies bothered me... call me crazy). To be fair, however, it could have been worse... in the early portion of the war, we wer
    • For me, it's the Baltic region (Lithuania). But it could be Rotterdam, or Liverpool, or anywhere I roam.

      Rotterdam, Liverpool and Lithuania? You wouldn't be a heroin smuggler by any chance?
      • In case you didn't notice, someone else replied "-1 Beautiful South." There's a song, you know:

        But it could be Rotterdam, or Liverpool, or anywhere you roam.
        'Cause Rotterdam or Liverpool sell net just through the phone... you're gonna need a loan."

        Your ISP has you in a pickle, 'cause they're in a pickle too!
        They oversold 64-kay-baud, and now you're down to two!

        This could be Rotterdam or Liverpool or anywhere you roam
        'Cause Rotterdam or Liverpool sell net just through the phone... you're gonna need a

  • Really, (Score:5, Insightful)

    by CGP314 ( 672613 ) <CGP@NOSpAM.ColinGregoryPalmer.net> on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @02:27AM (#7091779) Homepage
    They told me that the wireless gear wouldn't talk to the modem, they told me that my Debian workstation wouldn't be supported, they told me that the BOC wouldn't talk to me, they told me that I needed training, they told me that it wasn't done and it wouldn't work, they told me that I'd void my warranty

    Now really, what did you expect? Companies hate tinkerers. They don't like people who use their products in ways they were not intended for. They just want someone to buy their product and use it in the most boring way possible.

    Hell, this morning I needed some one-pound coins to do my laundry but I was all out. So, I went to a vending machine and started dumping in my small change until I had one pound of credit and then hit the change return button. Bingo! A nice, shinny, one-pound coin. After about five min of this, the service guy for the machine came over and yelled at me to stop. "That's not what the machine is for." Well excuse me for doing something different.

    • Re:Really, (Score:2, Funny)

      by Galvatron ( 115029 )
      Goddamn, isn't each 1 pound coin equivalent to about a buck fifty? How expensive IS laundry in the UK?

      As for this specific vending machine issue, if they were worried about people taking all their change, why not just have it return the same coins that were put in? That's what most vending machines here in the States seem to do. And what kind of a laundromat doesn't have change machines anyway?

      • Goddamn, isn't each 1 pound coin equivalent to about a buck fifty? How expensive IS laundry in the UK?

        Actually one pound is $1.60 and it costs me three pounds to do a load of wash. London is insanely expensive, that's why I put a 'give me money' button on my web page :)

  • 10 minutes to line up the dish? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by lingqi ( 577227 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @02:31AM (#7091785) Journal
    Hmm... I think with some proper tools and software you should be able to auto-align the dish - I mean, Meade telescopes do it if you provide it with a proper reference point.

    With a GPS, a level-sensor, some kind of direction sensor (since it's such a big antenna, differential GPS on two points might work out pretty good), and then some algorithm to "wiggle" the antenna toward the strong signal point once the aforementioned sensor array moved it to the general region, I think he should be able to park his van, unload the dish, and hit a "auto-search" and have internet connection in no time.

    now, of course, to properly align a dish in the middle of nowhere under 10 minutes is no small feat, and maybe he is automating it all anyway... just random ramblings.
    • Hmm... I think with some proper tools and software you should be able to auto-align the dish

      Yes, but...

      From the article: The dish I'm carrying around Oz is 1.8m - though it's oval and the largest diameter is 2m. It weighs in at around 100kg, and with the electronics attached more like 150kg.

      The problem is you need a really Badass motor and gearbox to even be able to move the dish around. The signal-detection bit isn't that hard, assuming my military digital radio experience is a sensible comparison. B
      • 100kg is not terribly bad compared to some of the higher end astronomical telescopes.

        as long as the dish will remain pointing at a certain location in an idle state (i.e. you don't need the motor to supply torque to hold the entire apparatus steady (i.e. the center-of-gravity is reasonablly close to the turning axis(es)), then as long as the motors have sufficient step down gearboxes you should be alright.

        of course, there is a tradeoff between speed and power of motor, but then again it's also a tradeoff

        • as long as the dish will remain pointing at a certain location in an idle state (i.e. you don't need the motor to supply torque to hold the entire apparatus steady (i.e. the center-of-gravity is reasonablly close to the turning axis(es)), then as long as the motors have sufficient step down gearboxes you should be alright.

          Yes, but all the gears and the motors not to mention the bearings and swivelmount would add yet more weight to the setup. And I would imagine it's already back breaking. If it only takes

          • Re:10 minutes to line up the dish? (Score:4, Informative)

            by |>>? ( 157144 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @03:37AM (#7091953) Homepage
            Back braking is the word.

            I left a crane behind in Perth that was capable of lifting the dish from the van because it was too heavy - and I'm looking at alternatives at the moment.

            That's why I currently need two guys to lift the dish from the van.

            The line-up isn't really worth the extra motor-gear, even though I'm now missing out on some satellite TV :-)

            An extra dish for TV is being looked at, it'll be lighter than all the motor gear and I won't loose Internet connectivity and have to re-do a cross-poll everytime I want to watch TV.

            • 'Back braking' is two words. But congratulations on spelling one of them correctly. That's above average for /.
              • But congratulations on spelling one of them correctly.

                It's "back-breaking". But Onno's ESL, so I'll forgive him that slip... but what about you? (-:

            • Any chance you could mount the dish on the roof of the van on a hinge and carousel arrangement?

              That way you could lie it (relatively) flat when travelling, and just raise / rotate it into position when you get where you're going, without having to lift it out and mount it.

              You'd presumably have to have some sort of cover over it when driving, but OTOH you'd be able to do away with the wireless basestation.
              • Not really, for one the roof isn't strong enough. The other issue is that the roof is two and a half meters above the ground.

                The original design called for the dish to be mounted on the back of a truck as you suggest, but if you need to go shopping for milk or eggs, you need to take the dish down.

                We briefly looked at putting it all on a trailer, but voted against it because it would look portable and someone was likely to "borrow" it and we were thinking of towing a caravan at the time, which sort of rule
    • Using a GPS to find South or North isn't hard. Put down a mark. Set it as a waypoint. Set the waypoint as a destination. Wander off in any direction. Move till your destination waypoint is due North/South. Draw a line.. It's very close to NS. Be sure to use the True, not magnetic refrence.

      Tweaking the the last 1/2 degree isn't hard from there.

    • Actualy find a bird is easy, I've done it several times, the trouble is that while we are fairly astute about such things, many are not. would you realy want 6-pack joe pointing a satelite transmitter at what he thinks is the right spot, and knocking an entire country's big football game off the air?

  • Blank look (Score:4, Funny)

    by theolein ( 316044 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @02:32AM (#7091789) Journal
    I can imagine the salesman giving him a blank look when he mentioned Debian. "Is that a Macintosh or something?" ;)
    • I've had ISP tech support people develop that confused tone when I mentioned I was using Debian Linux ... so I just said "it's Red Hat" and you could almost hear the light come on over the phone. It doesn't happen so much now, though.

      Recently, I've had the pleasant experience of ISP techs asking what OS I was using, and when I responded with "the firewall/router is Debian, my desktop is Red Hat" they've (a) been pleased they're dealing with a user who knows what an OS is and (b) gone "aah.... good. OK, in

      • LOL... at my ISP we're not even allowed to transfer calls to specific techs. I get to run through ICWs 20 times a day while people who don't know what a port is tells the Linux customers to get bent.

      • Recently, I've had the pleasant experience of ISP techs asking what OS I was using, and when I responded with "the firewall/router is Debian, my desktop is Red Hat" they've (a) been pleased they're dealing with a user who knows what an OS is and (b) gone "aah.... good. OK, in /var/log/syslog..."

        Well, you could tell us the name of this competent ISP! If they treat you well, I think you might as well plug them.

        For my part, I've had similar experiences with Speakeasy. There's one supported Linux distribut

        • ... but it's not so much the ISPs ( I regularly deal with several - home DSL, work DSL, backup work service ) as a few good individual techs at the ISPs.

          All ISPs I work with here have a sort of linux-neutral policy. Unfofficially, it comes down to "our customers want it, and because we don't have the knowledge we can't thoroughly support it, but if you're using it you should know what you're doing anyway." They'll talk to you, help diagnose issues, but if it's your end it's your problem. Reasonable as far

    • Re:Blank look (Score:1, Interesting)

      by |>>? ( 157144 )
      One day I made the tactical error of telling the guy on the phone that I was actually running Debian and that I was running Win98/WinNT, whatever he wanted, in a VMware box.

      He immediately assumed that the problem lay there...

      (Suffice to say it wasn't)

      The Gilat software seems to work OK under VMware, but there are some tricks like needing to disconnect the transmitter from the modem so the software can talk to the modem, because otherwise it ignores the ethernet port - go figure.

      My biggest fear was that
  • I don't know how powerful two-way telstra satellite is, but I know that satellite uplink stations are supposed to be taken very seriously. There are restrictions on power levels, aiming accuracy, signal polarisation, etc. It's my understanding that you only have to be out by 1 degree and you could really piss off some satellite company by interfering with their own uplinks.

    Perhaps Telstra 2way is weak enough that no-one really cares...

    • Re:Satellite uplinks - aren't they a serious affai (Score:5, Interesting)

      by |>>? ( 157144 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @03:23AM (#7091920) Homepage
      You are basically correct. My dish is technically an uplink station, but I have no control over power. I can only control aim and polarisation.

      Aim is achieved by using a set-top box in install mode, then I maximize the signal. Polarisation is read off a map and adjusted accordingly.

      When I get online, I send an email to the BOC to get a cross-poll check done so I don't splat over other people's signal, but I've set it up seven times so far and have yet to get asked to change the polarisation.

      The accuracy is waaay less than 1 degree. I could calculate it, but using a 16mm bolt, the difference between connection and not is 1/8 of a bolt-turn.

  • This can only go one way... (Score:4, Funny)

    by antic ( 29198 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @02:44AM (#7091822)
    'They told me that the wireless gear wouldn't talk to the modem, they told me that my Debian workstation wouldn't be supported, they told me that the BOC wouldn't talk to me, they told me that I needed training, they told me that it wasn't done and it wouldn't work, they told me that I'd void my warranty, they told me so many stories..'

    He's been told a lot of things, but did anyone tell him that divorce is imminent?

    They told me that the wireless gear wouldn't talk to the modem, that my wife wouldn't talk to me...

    • This made us laugh out loud.

      My wife was sitting next to me and reading over my shoulder at the time :-)

      It all started the other way around. I asked her if she'd like to see Australia and she said "yes". Then I had to figure out how to pay for it :-)

      *That's* where the dish came in :-)

  • Same again (Score:5, Interesting)

    by dat ( 11543 ) * on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @02:52AM (#7091841)
    Americans seem to forget we have sheep stations bigger than Texas in Australia.

    We've got a couple of trailer setups that we use for high-speed video conferencing anywhere in Australia. They're a ruggedised "4wd" trailer with a 1.2m dish and a 12V inverter, hanging off the back of one of the 4wd's. Takes about 10 minutes to setup from parking to surfing anywhere you can see up and north.
    • Hiya,

      Can you please send an email to the guy who is travelling (*me*), because I'd like to compare notes and I still need to get VoIP working :-(

  • It wasn't easy, but the lifestyle is great (Score:5, Informative)

    by |>>? ( 157144 ) on Tuesday September 30, 2003 @03:06AM (#7091882) Homepage
    As the guy who is doing the travelling, I figured, what better time to do some karma-whoring than when the story is about you:-)

    While it took us a long time to get it all working, the payoff in life-style change was well worth the effort. I just fielded a phone call from a guy in Sydney who couldn't believe that I really existed, that I was in Australia and that he could phone me.

    Next I'll be famous :-)

    I've gotta admit that my web-site is pretty bare at the moment, you can slashdot it if you like, because it's safely on the wired end of the net - but there is only a placeholder because I keep being asked to explain what it is I did.

    You'll notice from the photos that the dish sits on a pretty big frame. That takes about an hour to bolt together - if I do it on my own, all in all 18 bolts, then I get some beefy guys to help me lift the dish on, then plug in all the bits, power it up and on average 10 minutes later I connect - that is if Optus hasn't changed satellites or frequencies without sending me an update first :-(

    Over the solar-car challenge during October 18-28, we'll travel down the middle of Australia and the Sungroper team will help me setup the dish every night.

    If you have any questions, please feel free to email me, or post here, onno at itmaze dot com dot au.
    --
    • Your site mentioned trouble with a "card reader" in close proximity to talk about a digital camera. If you have compact flash, just use your laptop's PCMCIA card slot and a $15 adaptor. It is recognized by the kernel as a hard disk, /dev/hde1 in my case. "mount /dev/hde1 /mnt -t msdos" works for me. It's faster than USB 1 and works without all the USB pain. As a bonus, you get to use cfdisk, and can make e2 partitions for getting infromation to your Zaurus with reasonable names, user and execution info
    • I'm wondering if you have considered replacing the dish with a lighter model. A 100 kg satellite dish is obviously made for permanent mounting, and isn't designed for portability. You should be able to substitute a lighter dish somehow.
      • Sure. The challenge for me is to stay within the support boundaries that Optus provides. Imagine the conversation with the BOC if I cannot connect and I'm not using their supplied dish.

        So to bypass that I'd need to carry it anyway - which sort of begins to defeat the purpose of the exercise.

        Having said that, I'm on the lookout for other dishes that Optus supplies and supports for exactly that reason.

        One slashdotter suggested I look at wire dishes and even building my own.

        Given that it works and that I m
    • dare you to try and outrun the solar cars. I had a mate working on the Melbourne Uni EE [mu.oz.au] team saying at the completion of the race they would try to see how fast they could wind them up. So they organised a race with some hotted up late model Holdens. Gave the solar cars 20m head start and could never catch up.

      That's right, the Commodores had to refuel at regular intervals while the solar cars just kept going. Different story at night though.
  • BONGO!!

    The salesguy told me that it had no TCP/IP stack and they do not support TCP/IP over Bongo ;-)

    Heh, but what do salespeople know?? Now I can bing from anywhere in the world!! :)

  • "They told me that the wireless gear wouldn't talk to the modem, they told me that my Debian workstation wouldn't be supported, they told me that the BOC wouldn't talk to me, they told me that I needed training, they told me that it wasn't done and it wouldn't work, they told me that I'd void my warranty, they told me so many stories..'"

    Of course they are not going to help you develop any kind of system like the one that this guy has made. Most ISPs are not going to have enough time to work with people th
  • I had the "same" problem, but in europe. I was living in a "black hole", so no good internet was available. So i tried the sat-net. It is works, very well, but really have a lot of problems.
    So what you need, and not just for sat, is a good provider, a good salesman, a good SUPPORT.
    So first i checked the salesman, and the provider. I was asking questions by email, by phone, and I was just waiting for reply. Some provider answered after a couple weeks.. which is less then nothing.. but some.. yeah there are s

  • Satellite Truck (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Ceadda ( 625501 )
    Direcway says, what, 10 times on their site that you cant use their dish for mobile internet? Then you pull up a business website and they sell a fully loaded mobile satellite internet truck... Its just that they dont want you to know that you really can use it anywhere and they just dont feel like offering it to home users or rv users or internet nuts.

  • Faster Dish Setup (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    You mention having to setup a mount and then lifting and carrying the dish to it. Why not put the mount on a trailer and set the trailer up with legs to steady it. You then attach the dish to the mount and add some sort of fairing or enclosure for wind and precipitation protection. To set up you park the trailer, drop the legs, level if necessary, remove the fairing and then start your alignment procedures. It eliminates the manhandling.
    • We did look at that and Optus even offered to sell me one for $12,000 - sans wireless. Still need to run big RF cables inside.

      The main decider against this was that it looked mobile and easy to "borrow". The second reason against it was that it precludes us from towing anything else - like say a caravan.

      I've spent many hours attempting to eliminate manhandling the dish, this is the best I've got so-far. As stated elsewhere in these comments, I left a crane behind because it was too heavy - dangerously so

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