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Android Cellphones Technology

New Huawei Phone Has a 5x Optical Zoom, Thanks To a Periscope Lens (arstechnica.com) 88

An anonymous reader quotes a report from Ars Technica: Huawei officially announced the Huawei P30 Pro smartphone today. While it has a new Huawei-made SoC, an in-screen optical fingerprint reader, and lots of other high-end features, the highlight is definitely the camera's optical zoom, which is up to a whopping 5x. Not digital zoom. Real, optical zoom. Space, of course, is at a premium in smartphones. Imagine a smartphone sitting face down, and you would have to fit a vertical stack of the display, the CMOS sensor, and the lens all in about an 8mm height. There is just not a lot of room. But what if we didn't have to stack all the components vertically? The trick to Huawei's 5x optical zoom is that it uses a periscope design.

From the outside, it looks like a normal camera setup, albeit with a funky square camera opening. Internally, though, the components make a 90-degree right turn after the lens cover, and the zoom lens components and CMOS sensor are arranged horizontally. Now instead of having to cram a bunch of lenses and the CMOS chip into 8mm of vertical phone space, we have acres of horizontal phone space to play with. We've seen prototypes of periscope cameras from Oppo, but as far as commercial devices go, the Huawei P30 Pro is the first. While the optical zoom is the big new camera feature, there are four total cameras on the back of the P30 Pro. A 40MP main camera, a 20MP wide angle, the 8MP 5X telephoto, and a Time of Flight depth-sensing camera. The main 40MP camera uses a 1/1.7 inch-type sensor that, when measured diagonally, would make it 32 percent larger than the 1/2.55 inch-type sensors in the Galaxy S10 or iPhone XS.
The P30 Pro also has a new "RYYB" pixel layout, which swaps out the two green pixels in most CMOS "RGGB" sensors for yellow pixels. "Huawei claims it can capture 40 percent more light, as the yellow filter captures green and red light," Ars Technica reports. "Of course, this will make the color wonky, but Huawei claims it can correct for that in software."

Other specifications include a Kirin 980 octa-core processor with 6GB or 8GB RAM, up to 512GB storage, IP68 water and dust resistance, NFC, wireless charging, 40W wired charging, and a 4,200mAh battery. It starts at a price of $1,125.
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New Huawei Phone Has a 5x Optical Zoom, Thanks To a Periscope Lens

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  • I own and really really like my fairly new Huawei Mate 20 (non Pro, curved displays can DIE!)

    There's many great features on the phone, I like having an IR port, I have headphone, massive battery, very fast, notification LED.
    It has allmost all the old original Android features that first wooooed me from Apple (which most idiot handset manufacturers are now removing to copy Apple....)

    HOWEVER this phone, replaced a 2015 Samsung Note 5. Yet the camera's much like the p30, cameras everywhere,..... Those cameras?

    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      Sadly they removed the headphone jack from the P30 Pro.

    • These devices are always a pick and choose feature game. There are some features that are too geeky to appeal to most customers, such as the IR port, sure you can use your phone to change your TV Channel, But you will need to find the right software for your phone to match you TV, plus it is a device that will be draining phantom power that may not be used too much. The notification LED while seems like a good idea, and it probably was at the time, however we get too many notifications for it to be handy.

      • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

        You can control which applications can use the notification LED. Slide the notification a little way left or right so that it reveals the cog icon, tap that and you can disable LED flashing. That way you can reserve the LED for important stuff you actually want to know about at a glance.

        Battery size is largely dictated by screen size. Every phone has to be thin so the screen dimensions determine the battery dimensions which determine the capacity, beyond some gradual increases in energy density.

        For point-an

  • by sinij ( 911942 ) on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @08:10AM (#58340770)
    Does this phone ships with a Social Credit [wikipedia.org] app preloaded?
  • Trick? (Score:4, Informative)

    by AHuxley ( 892839 ) on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @08:18AM (#58340810) Journal
    Look back to a Minolta Dimagex.
    Asus ZenFone Zoom.
  • by lukpac ( 66596 ) on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @08:26AM (#58340844) Homepage
    The article mentions "optical zoom" and "zoom lenses", but is this not simply a telephoto lens combined with 2 wide angle lenses? "Zoom" refers to a lens with a variable focal length, which this phone does not seem to have (nor any other smartphone I'm aware of, for that matter).
    • I haven't seen the Huawei in action, but the way it used to work in old compact point-and-shoot it that the variable focal length happens by having the lens move around inside the periscope, instead of having them move in the external objective like on bigger photo cameras.

      We'll have to wait until iFixit does a disassembly to see if indeed the lens are moving inside or whether it's only a telephoto with fixed focal length as you suggest and unlike every other thing of this kind that came before it.

      • Re:In the periscope (Score:5, Informative)

        by mobby_6kl ( 668092 ) on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @09:55AM (#58341232)

        Nah this one is just a fixed 125mm-equivalent telephoto lens. So 5x isn't really accurate in the traditional sense but since the phone also has a wide-angle lens (and sensor), that's what it's relative to.

        And it kind of makes sense because the end result from the end-user's point of view is the same - they press a button and the image zooms in, it's just achieved by blending the images from the different cameras rather than physically moving some lens elements.

        • I, for one, would like to be the first to welcome our very short baseline interferometric overlords.

    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      It's not a zoom lens, but the software seamlessly blends images from multiple cameras to allow the user to zoom in. Of course all phones have a digital zoom feature but here because they have the 5x telephoto camera they can go that far optically and then add digital zoom on top to produce pretty decent results all the way to 50x.

    • You didn't even read the summary, why are you asking questions? And why are people reading your post and modding it insightful, when they didn't even read the summary either?

      • by lukpac ( 66596 )
        We all read the summary, and the story, which claim "optical zoom" despite the fact that it appears the lens in question is a fixed-length telephoto.
    • The only one that I'm aware of was the Samsung Galaxy S4 Zoom.
    • help explain please (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward

      What is the difference between 40MP with 5X digital zoom and 8MP with 5X optical zoom (or telephoto in this case it seems)?

      Wouldn't you get about the same result?

      • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

        by Anonymous Coward

        What is the difference between 40MP with 5X digital zoom and 8MP with 5X optical zoom (or telephoto in this case it seems)?

        Photo sensors are square not linear. 40MP with 5x digital zoom is only 1.6MP. This is why digital zoom sucks even with a high pixel count.

    • by tlhIngan ( 30335 )

      The article mentions "optical zoom" and "zoom lenses", but is this not simply a telephoto lens combined with 2 wide angle lenses? "Zoom" refers to a lens with a variable focal length, which this phone does not seem to have (nor any other smartphone I'm aware of, for that matter).

      No, it's a real zoom lens with elements that move in and out.

      The trick is that the camera sensor isn't the one at the back, it's the little square below it housing a mirror. If you hold the phone in portrait mode, the camera sensor

      • by lukpac ( 66596 )

        No, it's a real zoom lens with elements that move in and out.

        The trick is that the camera sensor isn't the one at the back, it's the little square below it housing a mirror. If you hold the phone in portrait mode, the camera sensor is actually looking sideways, so the lens elements can move left and right inside the phone, and the mirror makes it so it can see out the back.

        The elements obviously move to focus, but I don't see any indication the lens zooms. The image on the story page only indicates "5X Telephoto Lens (125mm) f3.4", which seems to indicate a fixed 125mm lens.

  • not so far-fetched (Score:4, Insightful)

    by pz ( 113803 ) on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @08:30AM (#58340866) Journal

    The P30 Pro also has a new "RYYB" pixel layout, which swaps out the two green pixels in most CMOS "RGGB" sensors for yellow pixels. "Huawei claims it can capture 40 percent more light, as the yellow filter captures green and red light," Ars Technica reports. "Of course, this will make the color wonky, but Huawei claims it can correct for that in software."

    That's essentially what your retina does. The red and green photosensors (more accurately called L for "long-wave" and M for "medium-wave") have spectral sensitivity that largely overlap; it is the relative difference that gets resolved into red and green percepts (after a lot of additional processing).

    So, yep, use high sensitivity sensors that mostly overlap in sensitivity, and then correct it in software. That's what your visual system does!

  • by samwichse ( 1056268 ) on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @08:33AM (#58340886)

    I'd wondered when this was coming for cell phone cameras. I had a Minolta DiMAGE X back in the day, it had a periscope lens with not just a fixed 5x telephoto, but a 3x zoom that moved inside the body sideways.

    https://www.dpreview.com/artic... [dpreview.com]

    I await the day they don't use 3 separate lenses/sensors and do something like this in a cell phone.

    Sam

  • But wait... what if the insane camera quality in the phone was strategically added by Huawei so that they can leak even higher quality images to the Chinese government??

  • by udif ( 32355 ) on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @09:45AM (#58341186)

    Corephotonics, an Israeli startup, holds several patents on this tech. It was first seen in the Oppo phone, and now the P30.
    However, Corephotonics was acquired by Samsung 2 months ago for $155M, so this might be the last non-Samsung phone to have this technology.

    https://www.androidheadlines.com/2019/02/huawei-p30-pro-quad-camera-teased.html

  • by Shompol ( 1690084 ) on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @10:09AM (#58341336)
    Ever since the Samsung's battery fiasco we owned six Huawei devices between me and my spouse -- two of mine were stolen, and my other half cracks the screen every other month. It's a nice quality package with a ~7" screen size that competition does not even offer.

    Comes with a scuba diving case, you say? I will just wait for mine to be stolen... maybe book another trip to Barcelona where things magically vanish from your pockets.
  • Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • Great, so it can, what, zoom in on your personal information, making it easier to steal from you? Fuck that, fuck 'smartphones' in general, nothing but a big fat data security swiss-cheese.

A committee takes root and grows, it flowers, wilts and dies, scattering the seed from which other committees will bloom. -- Parkinson

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