Lawyers Are Sending Mobile Ads To Patients Sitting In Emergency Rooms 74
An anonymous reader quotes a report from NPR: Patients sitting in emergency rooms, at chiropractors' offices and at pain clinics in the Philadelphia area may start noticing on their phones the kind of messages typically seen along highway billboards and public transit: personal injury law firms looking for business by casting mobile online ads at patients. The potentially creepy part? They're only getting fed the ad because somebody knows they are in an emergency room. The technology behind the ads, known as geofencing, or placing a digital perimeter around a specific location, has been deployed by retailers for years to offer coupons and special offers to customers as they shop. Bringing it into health care spaces, however, is raising alarm among privacy experts.
Law firms and marketing companies from Tennessee to California are also testing out the technology in hospital settings. "Is everybody in an emergency room going to need an attorney? Absolutely not," Kakis says. "But people that are going to need a personal injury attorney are more than likely at some point going to end up in an emergency room." The advertisers identify someone's location by grabbing what is known as "phone ID" from Wi-Fi, cell data or an app using GPS. Once someone crosses the digital fence, Kakis says, the ads can show up for more than a month -- and on multiple devices.
Law firms and marketing companies from Tennessee to California are also testing out the technology in hospital settings. "Is everybody in an emergency room going to need an attorney? Absolutely not," Kakis says. "But people that are going to need a personal injury attorney are more than likely at some point going to end up in an emergency room." The advertisers identify someone's location by grabbing what is known as "phone ID" from Wi-Fi, cell data or an app using GPS. Once someone crosses the digital fence, Kakis says, the ads can show up for more than a month -- and on multiple devices.
Ads via what app? (Score:1)
Firefox, even with adblock? Will ads be displayed in apps that generally don't display them, like, say, FBreader, the freeware epub reader? As long as they don't resort to sending unwanted text messages, I don't particularly give a damn. APPS!
Re: (Score:3)
From the article:
The data comes from applications that smartphone users have given permission to capture location.
And likely any apps that use the same ad network would display that ad.
Comment removed (Score:5, Informative)
Re: (Score:2)
Yes, but presumably this is in cooperation with hospitals (or I guess more likely retailers in hospitals? retailers beside hospitals?) because you need some kind of control, either directly or by some kind of business arrangement, of the access points that are designated as being part of the fence.
Re: (Score:3)
In other words, this is an example of how a for profit business model for a hospital is naturally leads to the kind of behavior you have to spend more money (as a tax payer) to legislate away.
Re: (Score:3)
From the article:
The data comes from applications that smartphone users have given permission to capture location.
The hospitals can't cooperate, because that would certainly violate HIPAA. Basically install an app that request location permission (and just happen to share it with the ad network), and they'll get your whereabouts 24/7 whether the app is open or not, and they can match that against the geofence coordinates. Any app that uses the same ad network could potentially display the ad.
Re: (Score:2)
Or you could use an OS that lets you deny that permission, or that lets you deny the permission for background process location services. iOS does this, as do some Android distros.
Re: (Score:2)
That's true, but that's also independent of any apps you have installed. Although it has less to do with the size of the cells, and more with the advanced beam-steering.
Re: (Score:2)
Comment removed (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Oh, I forgot... it could be worse, they could track phones that spend most evening in the same house as another phone that has visited a site like Ashley Madison and serve ads for private eyes and divorce lawyers, or they could geofence bars or pubs or liquor stores and if you visit them too often you start getting ads for rehab, or if a phone that spends most nights, again, with another and one phone is spotted spending a lot of time at a place that sells guns it serves the other with ads for crisis centers, battered spouses shelters, etc... no, the thing with ads for lawyers is NOT as creepy as it can get, either.
I would be disappointed if they are *not* doing all of the above.
How is it that they operate in the operations and intelligence business? Worst case is based on capabilities and not alleged intentions?
How about geofencing places where political rallies are held, and advertising contraceptives and assisted suicide to attendees? OR... serving ads for deals too good to pass up to people at those venues, (legitimately,) just to get people to show up for their free, or steeply discounted... whatever, so as to get their personal info so as to be able to ID them, get their license plates, see where they live, etc. No, the ads for personal injury lawyers is tame stuff, really, and not really anything to get excited over.
I have no doubt someone is collecting this data even if they have not figured out what to do with it yet.
Re: (Score:2)
It's not unavoidable. Make each instance of selling that data worth a $1MM lawsuit, and watch that
Re: (Score:2)
Um, I’m pretty sure they could get a whole lot worse. Are they deliberately causing car crashes, sabotaging consumer safety products, or hiring thugs to beat random (rich-seeming) strangers to drum up business yet?
I do not know abut beating people up but someone is responsible for sabotaging car design leading to more crashes which would otherwise not happen.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Lawyers are gonna lawyer.
A digital fence (Score:3)
I suppose since this has graduated from a handy table saw attachment to the latest privacy breach in the hallowed name of the advertising dollar, I should express my indignation... really? the Hospital? you greedy Cretins.
What the next sacred domino?
Will I ultimately be getting offers to invest in cryptocurrency, coupons for dating sites, and amazing free trial programs for Pornhub when I post on /.?
Re: (Score:2)
Why do lawyers wear neckties? To keep their foreskins from showing.
Re: (Score:2)
Android has a fanboi ID too. It's called your Advertising ID. You get it randomly assigned per device when the OS is installed, and you can change it every now and then to help decouple you and your device from privacy invading ad tracking.
Ambulance chasing! (Score:2)
Barratry brought to a whole new level.
Under which rock did the author crawl out from? (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
Better Call Saul?
Re: (Score:2)
I was going to grab lunch with a coworker probably 4 years ago at this point, and as we walked near a Walgreen's pharmacy her phone popped up special coupons she could use that day, and tried to get her to go in. That was a mind-breaking moment for me. She intentionally let a corporation watch her every move so it could try to lure her into spending money with them when she got close to one of their locations.
That's a level of creepy that still haunts me, and I know it's probably only gotten worse since the
Just click on the ads... (Score:2)
and they'll stop. They're expensive ads.
Re:Just click on the ads... (Score:5, Informative)
Relative to what attorneys pay AdWords for Personal Injury ads, they're not that expensive. Moreover, they're paid for on a CPM, not CPC model. The tracking cookie for retargeting might serve a CPC ad or dozen, but even those are cheaper than you'd think b/c tsill not adwords.
Disclaimer: I'm the President of Marketing for a law firm. We spend a ton on marketing... and I've known about this for years. We thought about this when it came out about 2 years ago, but don't like the CPM model and had other (ethical) concerns.
Defensive mechanisms (Score:2)
Unfortunately I don't see it becoming widespread since most people don't value their privacy.
Re: (Score:2)
"Please Turn Off Your Cellphone in the ER" (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
Great! By turning off your cell phone in the ER, they know for sure you entered the ER and not just drove in front of it. Like the summary says, they can spam you for two months after you've visited an ER, so getting to you while in the ER may not be their top priority.
Re: (Score:2)
There are signs all over my local ER telling you to turn off your phone so good luck with that.
Do you think people comply? We cant even get people to stop using their phones whilst driving when its both proven to be extremely dangerous and large fines/loss of license is levied against it.
Strang (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Wouldn't you want the lawyer on your side to be the one who will do every (legal) thing possible to help you win? Maybe not, but a lot of people will think that way.
Some people do indeed want that, but they really shouldn't.
There are many things that are legal that aren't ethical. There are many things that are legal and ethical that will just plain tick off the judge and make them look for ways to rule against you. And putting all that aside, some tactics are just plain disproportionately expensive for their potential upside.
Truly good lawyers pick their battles to keep all of the above factors in balance while still maximizing the odds of a good result.
Re: (Score:2)
There are many things that are legal that aren't ethical. There are many things that are legal and ethical that will just plain tick off the judge and make them look for ways to rule against you. And putting all that aside, some tactics are just plain disproportionately expensive for their potential upside.
Oh please, every lawyer knows that, even you. "Doing everything you can to win" does not mean spit in the judges face.
Re: (Score:2)
Speaking of which, there are probably ads that are geofenced around the Mar Lago golf course and the White House right now.
It shouldn't be difficult to reach the President. By all accounts, his travel schedule is mostly public and he's the only one with an insecure phone.
Re: (Score:2)
It is, but the problem is there are enough people that respond to the ads to keep this kind of annoyance around.
Ambulance Chasing Laws (Score:3)
Something tells me this could run afoul of ambulance chasing/barratry laws, especially given the direct targeting.
it needs to stop (Score:2)
It really needs to stop with this drowning everyone in advertisement. It's a par excellence example for the tragedy of the commons.
Advertisement needs to be opt-in only. We have the technology. I can tell my phone and my computer what kind of things I'm interested in and it will show me only those things. And sometimes I'm not interested in anything. Most of the time, actually.
Re: (Score:2)
You could just block all ads. We defiantly have that technology today.
Re: (Score:2)
You could just block all ads. We defiantly have that technology today.
There is actually advertisement that I want. When I am interested in buying a new car, computer, phone, sofa, whatever, I'd like to know what exists out there.
But only then. For some strange reason, the "smart" advertisement we have today, you know, tailored and customized to you individually, shows your ads about everything that you recently bought, i.e. in the exact phase of life in which you are least likely to be interested in that specific thing.
Re: (Score:2)
Sure, me too. But I've never said, "The best way for me to get that information is in 30 second shiny commercials or as text/images next to an unrelated article".
Re: (Score:2)
Typically, a Google search is more rewarding than the best advertisement, but we all know that Google makes its revenue not from the ten cents that you don't pay to make that search.
Can 2 play at that game? (Score:3)
Radical New Treatment for Venereal Disease!
Keep Your Wife From Discovering Your Girl Friends!
Steal Even More From The IRS This Year And Not Get Caught!
How to Hide Your Klan Membership In Plain Sight!
ads must be destroyed as a concept. Period (Score:3)
No compromise. Compete extermination of the concept of someone annoying someone by peddling goods and services.
This barbaric medieval insane practice needs to stop.
Re: (Score:2)
When Your Location Is Personally Identifying (Score:2)
For example, although the EU has garnered a lot of publicity recently for the General Data Protection Regulation (which came in to effect 5/25), location tracking applications have run the risk of breaching EU law for at least he last two years. As this article [welivesecurity.com] shows, the main reason this practice falls foul of EU law is that the actual tracking/location determination takes place without