HP (Re-)Announces a 14" Android Laptop 121
PC Mag reports that an upcoming laptop from HP (one that was prematurely announced in April, and now official) has decent-to-good specs — under 4 pounds, battery life more than 8 hours, Tegra processor, and a 1928x1080 touch screen — but an unusual operating system, at least for a laptop. The SlateBook 14 will run Android, rather than Windows (or ChromeOS, for that matter), which helps keep it relatively cheap, at $400. According to the article, Android is "a lot cheaper for HP to implement in a laptop; ChromeOS, in contrast, comes with more stringent system requirements that would cost HP a bit more." Ars Technica's mention in April includes a screenshot taken from a video (note: video itself appears to be disabled) which shows the keyboard layout and which reveals some Android-specific changes. Update: 06/01 19:23 GMT by T : Here's an alternative link to the promotional video.
A 14" phone. (Score:1)
OK, a 14" phone. Just what we needed.
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Its a labtop, not a tablet.
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Its a labtop, not a tablet.
So it's a flip phone.
(Jokes aside, I like this product; I don't mean to be flip).
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HP Is Being Cheap (Score:5, Interesting)
ChromeOS, in contrast, comes with more stringent system requirements that would cost HP a bit more.
In other words, this thing is going to be really slow if you try to use it for serious work. Why? Because HP is cheap and doesn't want to shell out for decent components. That and/or they like their locked down bootloader.
Re:HP Is Being Cheap = LOSER segment (Score:4, Insightful)
HP always made the best far back, like the HP-35, 45, 41cx and then PCs of high quality.
Now HP apparently seeks to blend in with the masses of the cheapest laptop designs on the Asian continent.
Who is going to match Apple for top-of-the-line laptops, which a professional can use for 5-6 years before replacement?
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dunno, my dell is a fucking tank, its not as sexy as an apple but already 3 years old, been dropped twice in the airport and still acts and looks like brand new...
not to mention it was cheap to begin with
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call us when your dell is 6 years old
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call us when your dell is 6 years old
My latitude D520 was assembled from parts of many other dead Latitudes. I call it frankentop. Runs reliably. Take it everywhere. Ugly as sin. Dell latitudes are more rugged and parts are cheaper and more interchangable in my opinion. The cheap consumer Dells are more problematic.
I also have a nearly 5 year old quad core HP laptop, hasn't given me any problems other than a noisy fan that stopped being noisy after a while on it's own.
The best is a 13 year old IBM thinkpad, still going. This thing is so old it
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Just give me a decent sound chip
And speakers (if you use them).
Branded audio isn't necessarily bad (though I gather beats is).
My SO has one of those thin Asus laptops (Zenbook). It came with Bang & Olafsson branded audio which we both thought was a massive gimmick. But it had all the other features she wanted (thin, light, quite powerful, decent battery life, runs Linux fine etc) so she got it anyway.
Well, turned out to be head and shoulders the best laptop speakers I've ever encountered. Her previous
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Cool, thanks for the heads-up on that, will have to look into it. Always looking for a solid laptop to recommend if nothing else.
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The Zenbook (UX21 in this case) has been very good. The main problem is that the wireless reception is quite poor, probably due to the all metal case.
Other than that it's been very good. Excellent audio, good screen brightness, decent keyboard, well put together, light. Generally a very solid machine.
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hopefully it will be better than when my macbook turned 6 after two motherboard replacements and a keyboard that hardly functions
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My current Lenovo W520 is going is just over 3 years old now (16GB RAM, i7, Dual SSD's). I have an older W500 as well which is almost 6 years old now and it is also still happily working and still quite powerful (8GB, Core 2 Duo). The Lenovo's are mostly butt ugly but they do seem to last quite well.
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Panasonic Toughbooks are nearly indestructible. The newer ones looks like normal laptops too, not like the old chunky ones. They are very popular in Japan where they are sold under the Let's Note name, and you can pick up ex-corporate used ones for a bargain price (same with Thinkpads). They cost maybe 20% more than other similar spec machines but will pay for themselves by lasting longer.
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Who is going to match Apple for top-of-the-line laptops, which a professional can use for 5-6 years before replacement?
Pretty much anyone with a flat top on the screen.
Close the lid, put the order on the lid, walk to the table, and serve the coffee.
Wouldn't a tray be lighter though?
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Who is going to match Apple for top-of-the-line laptops, which a professional can use for 5-6 years before replacement?
(fanboi warning)
Origin PC. I'm north of four years on my EON-17. Yes, it's a Clevo chassis, but they're easily serviceable, and fiercely supported. For the most part, Macbooks are cheaper than the base units of each series, and if you're looking for the less-expensive route to the same thing, go with Sager - Sager is the unaffiliated,"drop-ship the hardware" Clevo rebadger, and Origin is more the "we have your back no matter what, and will custom paint your rig and install your software and test it out for
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After having to replace laptops with stuck pixels far too many times, I like the idea of Sager/Clevo laptops. They guarantee no stuck pixels on delivery and for a few extra dollars they will guarantee no stuck pixels for a period of time. That's pretty important when you're spending hundreds or thousands of dollars on something you have to look at for most of the day, every day.
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Probably the Lenovo Thinkpad T-series is still up to snuff. Build quality on a recent T440 purchase is pretty good.
Personally, I'm still using a T61p from mid-2007. Purchased it with a 4-year warranty and made sure to use that warranty during the 4th year to get worn out bits replaced.
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There *are* additional hardware costs (Score:5, Informative)
ChromeOS, in contrast, comes with more stringent system requirements that would cost HP a bit more.
In other words, this thing is going to be really slow if you try to use it for serious work. Why? Because HP is cheap and doesn't want to shell out for decent components. That and/or they like their locked down bootloader.
There are additional hardware requirements on a ChromeBook:
o No COTS keyboard (ChromeOS requires a custom keyboard)
o Work required on the TP bus input lines and power to deal with wake-from-trackpad
o EC modifications for wake-from-trackpad, including some tricky PS/2 state machine work
o EC modifications including additional GPIO pins and a couple of resisters and capacitors, if the parts PS/2 bus is on the C3 power rail (i.e. there's some issues with C-state transitions if the PS/2 or I2C bus for the TP are powered down in sleep state)
o EC state machine modifications for prioritization of traffic from the keyboard matrix "pretend" i8051/i8042 parts to provide a muxed PS/2 bus with e.g. a Synaptics PS/2 trackpad; specifically, HP's EC parts tend to drop keystrokes under certain conditions, and the typical solution to the hardware problem in the EC firmware is to stop TP input for a period of time following keyboard input - same solution used by Toshiba - and it means you can't use both keyboard and mouse in games, unless you use an external mouse in place of the TP
o If the TP remains powered in sleep state, for wake-from sleep, as part of the C1 rail, then there is an associated batter cost, even if you chat with it to clock it way down; this implies either clam-shell it shut to turn off the TP, -OR- a bigger battery to achieve the same battery life. FWIW, that also means that the C1 line to the TP power has to be gated by *another* GPIO line from the EC
o Wake-from-trackpad also has some implications for BIOS default state on initial boot or wake-from-sleep (C1->C3 state transition); most BIOS are broken in this regard (hint: try holding the TP click down when booting some time, and see how long it takes).
o A TPM to implement the "trusted boot" in a way that it can't be worked around in software (Microsoft Trusted Boot can work without TPM hardware, but can be worked around in software if you are diligent).
o There's a known defect in I2C bus sharing on some TPMs when doing back-to-back transactions, which means that they tend to demand their own I2C bus.
o The last HP ChromeBook was withdrawn from the market due to power supply overheating problem (this is public information), which had to do with the charging circuit and the power draw in sleep state, while leaving certain peripherals powered on that aren't on in a normal Windows sleep state.
o CoreBoot and u-boot for the BIOS (technically, you could flash both and select which one in a setup screen, but that means higher NVRAM costs for the storage of the BIOS)
So... a lot of software work in a sensitive system area, a potentially larger battery, a potentially higher per unit cost for the keyboard, a potentially higher per unit cost for the TP, a modified BIOS and other BIOS costs, and a TPM and maybe an extra I2C line, plus a potential mod to the charging circuit.
Full disclosure: I did the EC state machine work and worked with Synaptics and Samsung on the EC and hardware modifications for a number of TP and keyboard issues, as well as other of the above issues, for ChromeBooks from Samsung, Acer, and other companies while part of the ChromeOS team at Google. Basically, they'd need to make my recommended list of partner modifications to their hardware and firmware in order to build a successful ChromeBook.
I suspect that they will find the android OS not very satisfactory as well, but with a standard keyboard and other features, they can use COTS parts for most things, and pop the rip cord and switch to Windows on the thing if they absolutely had to do so.
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Tegra? 4 Lbs? (Score:1)
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Battery required for a 14" Screen I guess. I like the idea actually. Quick booting and not using ChromeOS are pluses in my book.
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Battery required for a 14" Screen I guess.
My MacBook Air says otherwise.
(I know Apple has some patents on great battery tech, so yea that's maybe unfair, but it does set the standard for me now. Under one pound will impress me, unless this laptop has an 8 day battery or also makes toast or something.)
Re:Tegra? 4 Lbs? (Score:4, Interesting)
I doubt it is just the patents. Add in the price point and the fact that this is a relatively minor product, so there are no fancy retooled factories and a minimum of custom components are going into this, as opposed to in a flagship product. Plus a dozen other little issues that fall under those or add to them. It's basically using cheap components for a cheap price point. The Air uses the absolute latest and best to get to the minimum weight and size, but at a high price point. Sony did that for years as well, and had a similarly high price point relative to the general market of the time.
It is quite a bit underwhelming compared to even higher end Android tablets like the $650 Galaxy Note 12, but the killer feature is probably intended to be what will likely be a $300 and change street price with the ease of Android (for those who already have an Android phone). It's comparable to their Pavillion 14" laptop: http://www.amazon.com//dp/B00B... [amazon.com]
Noooo! (Score:1)
You won't kill my dreams HP!
The first android on my lap top must be Cherry 2000!
Product definition, they're doing it wrong (Score:2)
> Android is "a lot cheaper for HP to implement in a laptop; ChromeOS, in contrast, comes with more stringent system requirements that would cost HP a bit more."
It looks like sweet hardware. They may have good intentions re costs. But that's not how to define a product. The laptop form factor works against the touch interface by putting the screen just a little too far away. It also completely destroys the ability to hold a device like a sheaf of paper or clipboard.
The other side of the coin is that a br
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A chrombook, or anything for that matter running ChromOS, only works if you have internet access.
Most labtops not even support cellular commections.
Considering that the world is slightly bigger than the USA, I would say most people buying a laptop travel very often outside of their country, hence: they habe no internet connection during traveling (regardless if it is a car, a train or a plane they use). They only have internet in the hotel lobby (wifi/wlan) or very often have to pay premium prices to even g
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Thats false. All apps and data can be cached locally, and sync whenever you do get a connexion. An off-line Chromebook is fully functional.
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How much data can it cach?
Sorry, I doubt this.
Why the heck would it be marketed as an internet OS/notebokk if it is that easy?
Why not market it as a 'normal' laptop with optional 'cloud synching'?
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How much data can it cach? Sorry, I doubt this. Why the heck would it be marketed as an internet OS/notebokk if it is that easy? Why not market it as a 'normal' laptop with optional 'cloud synching'?
I have one. You can doubt that it runs off the network, but that is just plain wrong.
The Chromebook uses a browser based operating system. It also uses "the Cloud" for a lot of storage. But you hit the power button, and in a couple seconds, it will ask you to log on, and internet connection or not, it's working.
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Umm I have a (sub-$150) Chromebook and it runs Xubuntu just fine. Also ChromeOS sans-Internet is handy for reading and playing audiobooks (I bookmark them so I don't have to switch OS's and type xine) while I'm driving. The 9ish hourish battery life makes it fine for most drives and I don't need to plug it in.
I think there is some kind of offline Officelike package but I haven't tried it. LibreOffice works under Ubuntu. I have all my favorite dev-tools and slashem installed on mine, so it is perfectly ap
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I was talking about ChromeOS, not about a chrome book running a linux derivate. But thanx for the info, it is cebrtainly interesting!
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Could have been a great Chromebook.
Yes. Having bought a Chromebook as an experiment when Best Buy was giving out tradeins on old XP laptops, I was all ready to learn about all it's deficiencies.
But after spending the 99 dollars, I was really pleasantly surprised. Faster than my Wife's W8 laptop that cost 8x as much, almost instant booting, and they've made it easier to work offline now. Chromebooks are now what I recommend to peopel for "Grandma's computer".
But for my serious side, I dual boot it with ChrUbuntu, and I have a fully funct
$400 ain't cheap for that hardware (Score:4, Interesting)
In Nov/2012 I bought an HP 15.6" AMD based laptop (notebook?) with 8GB DDR3 RAM, 500GB HDD, USB3, Win7 Home Premium, and Beats Audio for $399.00 Canadian. This was retail price.
Upon purchase, I wiped and installed Funtoo Linux, and have since replaced the HDD with an SSD. It does everything I need it to do. I regularly get 4.5 hours battery life of continuous use. Runs a tad warm but I don't use it on my lap so its fine.
My point is, this is android based notebook is limited as a general purpose machine, and costs more than I paid for mine a year and a half ago.
I do understand is had a touchscreen, larger battery and built in flash based memory, and that can drive costs uo a bit, but in terms of general usefulness I don't think it will fly.
Re: $400 ain't cheap for that hardware (Score:2)
According to `cat /proc/cpuinfo` its an AMD A6-4455M w/ Radeon HD 7500G.
The HP model # on the bottom is Envy 6-1040ca.
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If the 14" even has a SSD - and not just basic flash-ram, a 64GB SSD should be about equivalent with a 500-650GB HD. A touch screen tends to add nearly a $100 to a laptop... but with only 2GB of ram, and a standard dimension screen, I do
Re: $400 ain't cheap for that hardware (Score:2)
Pretty good deal you got. Was that $450 in USD, CAD, or some other currency? $450 USD back in November would have been closer to the $495 Canadian. Plus everything in Canada is usually more expensive due to levies and such.
Regardless those specs at $500 Canadian would be pretty good. I don't regret my purchase. I like the 15.6" screen, the touchpad sucks but I use a wireless mouse when its more convenient.
Ask for NSA subsidy (Score:3, Funny)
Re: Gee, I wonder what WebOs might have cost? (Score:3)
I think HP killed it because HP.
Why would I spend $400 on this? (Score:2)
I can't help but wonder if these products are just HPs way of saying to Microsoft that they have alternatives to Windows.
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I was about to say the same thing, and even my i5 gets 6 hours of battery if I throw it in power saver mode.
The problem I see with the whole "see Microsoft we have choices" thing is that none of then have been successful, which reinforces MS's point
To run Android apps (Score:2)
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And how many of those ( that the average person actually uses ) benefit from having a permanently attached keyboard?
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How about i define dimwit instead: "Tepples"
Damned idiots around here, its no wonder i rarely bother to come here anymore. Between lame stories, and total morons pretending they are functional trying to comment....
Should round you all up and send you away. Far far away. Or Soylent Green.. mmm Soylent Green..
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You won't get a dual core i5 laptop for $400 "easily", unless you're buying a used notebook or something easily outdated. Try maybe $600. And then you end up almost certainly with the garbage 720p or 1366x768 screen.
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Faster boot? Faster shutdown? Less crapware? Less malware? Less rebooting? Less vendor lock-in? Longer battery life?
I don't really know, but those are possibilities. All of those things certainly apply to ChromeOS.
boot loader (Score:2)
If the boot loader is not encrypted I might buy one.
HP consumer laptops horrible (Score:1)
http://www.engadget.com/2009/1... [engadget.com]
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Was in a rush to get a replacement desktop, thought I was getting a duel core, after everything was setup discovered it was single core.
Yes, should have looked into it more but from the PC description, it sure looked to be duel core.
You bought duelling core processors and one of them lost the duel. So you got the computer you wanted, not the computer you expected. There is a difference.
Sounds DOA to me (Score:2)
Nothing wrong with android on a phone or tablet, but a laptop? I cant see it being of much value tacking on a permanent keyboard.
People will want more functionality with a laptop than this will give. is chrome OS the right choice? I donno, but Android sure isn't.
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So, if you think so, care to elaborate?
Why should I prefer an OS that only works with an internet connection over Android? What is wrong with Android?
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Reading comprehension issues i see.
I clearly said nothing wrong with Android by its self, just that i dont feel its appropriate for this device.
I also clearly said i wasn't sure if ChromeOS was the answer or not. And from what i gather its becoming less and less reliant on a constant connection, so your argument may be a moot point now anyway.
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It is not reliant on a 'constant' connection, nevertheless it is an 'internet OS' ... and the time is by far not ripe for that.
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It is not reliant on a 'constant' connection, nevertheless it is an 'internet OS' ... and the time is by far not ripe for that.
Seriously man, what the exact fuck is your issue? Chrome OS works off-line, and since this is like the 5th post where you claim otherwise, you must have some reason to be dissembling.
Tell us of your experience with ChromeOS, and the failures of trying to get it to work offline.
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I did not say 'it does not work offline' I said for seriousw ork you need an internet connection.
And here are plenty of posts supporting my standpoint.
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ChromeOs works w/o internet connexion.
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In its limited 'offline mode'.
So how long can you be offline and how much work van you do in that time?
Which software development environment does it support offline?
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Offline mode is not limited. Google docs for example is fully functional.
No clue about software development, whether connected or not. That's not really the target, anyway.
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I just took an SD Card to try to manipulate some images. Without an internet connection, Chrome OS was completely unable to do anything with these pictures--it could not even preview nor display them.
I like the ChromeBook, and I own a few of them, but without an internet connection available, ChromeBooks are a pathetic joke.
For real productivity they make great Remote Desktop clients. I only wish Amazon WorkSpaces would release a proper client for ChromeBooks.
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I've got an Android *desktop* (Minix X5), and it works surprisingly well.
The best thing is the ease of use -that does go hand-in-hand with limitations such as no multitasking-, but the Home and Back buttons work really well for non-techies; and the App selection is excellent.
Many games do have issues with the format (no touch, landscape only, lots of sensors ie gyro... lacking), but all others apps work well, and over half the games do too. Main gripe is the lack of a shortcut to zoom in/out.
It was inevitable (Score:2)
I guess this was inevitable... After this strategy worked for Samsung in differentiating itself from Apple's iPhone, someone was bound to try to see if the same strategy would work against the iPad.
I think that what HP missed in Samsung's game plan was that they built their G-series phones as premium devices... size alone was not enough
Selling a whole bunch of cheap devices will get one more market-share, and very little else.
iPad is a dead product walking (Score:2)
... see if the same strategy would work against the iPad.
iPad was only relevant in one country, and since then even with some distribution chain *wink* stock readjustments...the market is simply leaving Apple behind, who aren't even maintaining growth in a hyper-growth market. Competing with Apple in the tablet market is just stupid...Best just to leave Microsofts Surface part III to have a go. It isn't 2013 anymore.
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the market is simply leaving Apple behind, who aren't even maintaining growth in a hyper-growth market.
Wrong. Tablet sales are down overall [cnet.com], not just Apple's (though a few minor brands are up a little).
ChromeOS spec more stringent? (Score:4, Interesting)
May be the ChromeOS spec is more stringent, but not on the hardware side. May be ChromeOS prevents HP from loading it up with crapware and nagware. Android might allow HP to insinuate itself in the Apps and marketplace more deeply. The HP bean counters would see it as "value" and "potential revenue stream". What the PHBs never realize is, if enough people do not buy that device the revenue stream will be as dry as a wadi in the Sahara.
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It's an Apps thing. Android = lotsa apps.
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The conspiracy minded folks will point out that this is an attempt to test the waters and introduce the intended future of computing.
TPTB want to reign in the free-for-all that is windows and even MAC-os computers. People can run anything and everything. With Android and the google store, the computer is limited to a controlled walled-garden of apps. Same for iOS.
So, if this form factor takes off (or, if it is MADE to take off, wink wink) you have Google, which is a CIA/NSA front, controlling all that the p
All maximized all the time (Score:5, Interesting)
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Developers would need to target it...and as a developer I'm not likely to target it since it's only one android device.
Apps meant for 10" screens will probably function well enough on it, though. So it'll be useful if you've already migrated your workflow to a 10" tablet but want more screen/keyboard estate (I'm throwing out entertainment value since it's a laptop form factor)
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Sure, but can you lie to it? It's an OS made for full screen use on cell phones, applications probably don't have the code to fit arbitrary window sizes or dynamically resize all the assets. You can probably tell the device it's rendering to a 1920x1080 display and then scale it down to 1280x720 or 960x540 or 640x360... or tell it the device has been "flipped" so it should render at 1080x1920 and then scale that down, it wouldn't be scaling as you're used to but you could have tiles of various sizes though
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You can probably tell the device it's rendering to a 1920x1080 display and then scale it down to 1280x720 or 960x540 or 640x360
And need a magnifying glass to read anything.
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How does that square with my MHL capable Xperia Z1 compact? From what I can make out according to my TV video playback jumps to full HD...
Behavior difference for video vs. apps (Score:2)
Yoga 2 w/ Android (Score:1)
I would buy a Lenovo Yoga 2 running Android. Great form factor, but crippled by Windows 8.
192*8*x1080? (Score:3)
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It might be wrong, but it's not a *typo* -- that figure is from the PC Mag article -- "(though the screen itself is a mere 1928-by-1080-pixel resolution)." ...
A slightly unusual resolution number, but by no means crazy: http://www.tweaktown.com/news/... [tweaktown.com]
If that number is wrong, would be happy to update!
timothy
Upgrades... no. (Score:2)
Wait for Tegra K1 (Score:3)
The Tegra K1 has a desktop-like GPU (similar in architecture to the GTX 780) and is supported by both nouveau and the nvidia proprietary driver, so it would be a more proper chip to run real desktop linux in addition to (or in place of) Android.
The article is wondering whether the USB is 2.0 or 3.0. Tegra 4 does not have PCI Express lines, so it's 2.0.
USB 3.0 (Score:2)
oh sorry about that, the Tegra 4 includes USB 3.0 right on the chip.
Under 4 pounds! (Score:2)
Who cares? (Score:1)
No one cares what the underlying OS is anymore, which is WHY Android exists in the first place. Another Linux based laptop? So what? And it will run Candy Crush and Angry Birds? Wow.
Android actually works pretty well on laptops (Score:2)
I've been using Android x86 for a while on an old spare laptop and, generally speaking, it's worked pretty well! Surprisingly many Android games don't seem to like it (swipe gestures don't seem to map well to a mouse), and apps that rely on portrait orientation are annoying, but for general web browsing it's been fine.
Not a fan of "Beats Audio" logo (Score:2)
I recently shopped for laptops for home and for the office and I specifically excluded HP because of that ridiculous Beats Audio logo.
Not only is the logo tacky and unprofessional, it demonstrates that part of my purchase price was taken for something of no value whatsoever.
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Last season's model - you'll most likely see Beats tech only on Apple gear.
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Awesome. I can't wait to start to reconsider considering HP laptops for consideration.
Wish Android Applications Were Better (Score:2)
The question is: why make a better Android machine, when the applications are so needlessly weak?
The only word processor on Android that can make facing quotes, isn't even really native: Androoffice.
I am growing tired of seeing blurry text at the bottom of the page form while I surf.
No, I want to use SD cards for storing data. It's not application data, it's mine!!!
With 2GB of memory, you should be able to paint/edit images that are 3x4 feet @300dpi, but with most paint programs and editors, you couldn't ed