Microsoft To Abandon Windows Phone? 505
symbolset writes "Microsoft has had some trouble as of late getting adoption of their mobile products. Even Bill Gates has said it was inadequate. Despite rave reviews of Windows Phone in the press it has failed to get double digit share of the smartphone market. Now comes reports from WMPoweruser that WP8 will lose mainstream support in July 2014."
Er, that likely means they'll be on WP9 (Score:5, Informative)
Er, that likely means they'll be on WP9. How long will Google update Android 3.x or even 4.0?
Trololol samzenpuss, trololol.
Re:Er, that likely means they'll be on WP9 (Score:5, Insightful)
Probably longer than Windows phones will, but yes, given that the smartphone market is a ~2 year turnaround business that probably means they're freezing anything new for WP8 nowish, and by this time next year they'll be winding up anything WP8 specific and they'll have WP9 out the door (or 8.1 or whatever it ends up being).
Re: (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Er, that likely means they'll be on WP9 (Score:5, Informative)
Er, that likely means they'll be on WP9. How long will Google update Android 3.x or even 4.0?
Trololol samzenpuss, trololol.
Especially since MS has come out and said that all wp8 devices will be upgradable to wp9. It even says as much on TFA linked in TFS. Way to deliberately mislead readers, samzenpus. There's a career in politics somewhere out there for you.
Re:Er, that likely means they'll be on WP9 (Score:5, Insightful)
Well when they dropped windows mobile they said that windows phone 7 would be the new thing going forward...
Before too long they dropped it, and came out with yet another new incompatible replacement.
Who's to say they won't do the same again?
Bullshit story and a Slashdot low (Score:5, Informative)
Wow, I didn't think Slashdot could go lower but it just managed to do that.
Next headline: MS to abandon Windows, because Windows XP support Ends April 8, 2014?
Microsoft will make Windows Phone 9, in fact they even have people working on testing it.
http://msftkitchen.com/windows-phone-9-testing-begins-also-windows-9-gets-a-mention-from-microsoft [msftkitchen.com]
And Windows Phone 8 phones will be upgradeable.
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2416002,00.asp [pcmag.com]
And Windows Phone is growing marketshare:
http://wmpoweruser.com/italy-shows-their-windows-phone-strength-already-15-of-windows-phone-market/ [wmpoweruser.com]
http://wmpoweruser.com/windows-phone-has-a-16-3-market-share-in-poland-one-of-the-highest-in-the-world/ [wmpoweruser.com]
http://www.fiercewireless.com/europe/story/analyst-windows-phone-sees-strong-growth-uk-and-italy/2013-01-23 [fiercewireless.com]
http://www.wpcentral.com/long-queues-china-nokia-lumia-920-sells-out-two-hours [wpcentral.com] [And yes, that's actually picture of people queuing for Windows Phone)
Picking up some loyal users who seem to like it :
http://wmpoweruser.com/pcmag-readers-choice-awards-2013-windows-phone-wins-mobile-os-category/ [wmpoweruser.com]
http://www.ubergizmo.com/2013/01/customer-satisfaction-of-windows-phone-on-the-rise-according-to-survey/ [ubergizmo.com]
And winning some awards
http://www.wpcentral.com/nokia-lumia-920-struts-its-stuff-and-takes-prestigious-innovative-handset-award-2013 [wpcentral.com]
http://wmpoweruser.com/nokia-lumia-920-wins-engadget-smartphone-of-2012-user-vote/ [wmpoweruser.com]
And yet we have this bullshit FUD summary, headline and article? No wonder Slashdot is losing readership fast, with barely a few comments for stories compared to earlier.
The partyline biased moderation, calling people with alternate viewpoints shills and chasing them away into karma hell can only last so long before the echo chamber gets tired of listening to itself and packs it up.
Reminds me of this story http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/02/16/2259257/draconian-drm-revealed-in-windows-7 [slashdot.org]
Even the mainstream tech media noticed that. Interesting read: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2009/02/oh-the-humanity-windows-7s-draconian-drm/ [arstechnica.com]
I doubt any one would care now, with most people having written off Slashdot as the hiding place of anti-Microsoft trolls and zealots living in their alternate reality. Posters like bmo, symbolset, tuple666, Zero__Kelvin, LordLimeCat, Jeremiah Cornelius, UnknowingFool, rtfa-troll, binarylarry, MightyMartian, drinkypoo, pieroxy and a whole bunch of others have ruined Slashdot beyond repair and seem to suffer from this affliction: http://linux.slashdot.org/story/09/07/25/1757253/linus-calls-microsoft-hatred-a-disease [slashdot.org]
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Er did you just criticize iOS over Android for update availability?
For someone who professes to know of business models, you are pretty out of it.
If you want updates, buy Nexus (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:If you want updates, buy Nexus (Score:4, Insightful)
"If you want updates, buy Nexus." Is there a problem with that rule of thumb, other than that U.S. prepaid carriers tend not to carry Nexus phones?
How are people so lacking in foresight that they can't do the *very* simple math of calculating the significant price difference over time between a "free" phone with an ass-raping contract and buying a phone outright with only the plan and features they need?
Re:If you want updates, buy Nexus (Score:4, Informative)
How are people so lacking in foresight that they can't do the *very* simple math of calculating the significant price difference over time between a "free" phone with an ass-raping contract and buying a phone outright with only the plan and features they need?
From what I've seen from most carriers in the US, there is no difference between a plan that is paying for a phone under contract, and one that has no phone under contract. So unless one plans to change carriers before a contract ends, it would cost significantly more to purchase a phone outright and then pay for service. (Note that I'm speaking of major carriers, and this could be different if one were willing to accept a very minor carrier.)
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T-Mobile offers a significant discount off-contract and most of the prepaid offerings with the same/similar services for significantly less money. There's also the MVNO's where you can get great deals, my wife's currently on Virgin mobile @$25/month for 300 voice minutes, 2.5GB of data and unlimited texting, we're looking at republic wireless @$19/month for unlimited everything but are waiting for them to get new phones this summer.
Re: (Score:3)
"If you want updates, buy Nexus." Is there a problem with that rule of thumb, other than that U.S. prepaid carriers tend not to carry Nexus phones?
I love how quickly your narrative changed from
"Google have been pretty good at providing continuous updates for earlier versions of Androids. In fact they will provide updates as long as the phone is good. Their business model covers this. Apple and Microsoft's business model does not."
to
"If you want updates, buy Nexus"
What percentage of Android phones that are being sold are Nexuses? 0.2% ?
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Who licensed it on terms that allowed the carriers to lock the phone?
AOSP is licensed by its contributors under the Apache License 2.0. If you're referring to Google Play Store licensing, which is separate from the free software license of Android proper, Google does require that all devices with Play Store support Android Debug Bridge (and thus allow sideloading through adb install), even if (I admit) not rooting.
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Updates for Nexus phones are independent of the carriers.
Re:If you want updates, buy Nexus (Score:5, Insightful)
As the owner of a Verizon Galaxy Nexus, who bought it believing what you said is true, I can tell you that they are not. At least not on Verizon. I know, shame on me for thinking it would be otherwise, but your statement is still wrong.
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I agree that the original post was in relation to official support but it is a valid point that there is an upgrade option. Projects like Cyanogenmod and XBMC are so slick that official products look amateur in comparison.
I am thankful that hardware that I purchase can reach a couple of years old and still have additional features added, and the firmware refined, due to the open source community. What's not to like?
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
That's odd, because I keep encountering apps that worked on older devices that claim they won't work on my Android 4.2 devices. Maybe that's a certification issue rather than a real compatibility problem, but it shows that upgrading isn't 100% perfect.
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I am an Android developer and am curious about your experience with older apps on Android 4.2. Could you provide some examples? My experience matches the GP in that apps "just work" on when placed on newer versions of Android.
For a while the BBC iPlayer app didn't support newer versions, but that was because it was built on Adobe Flash, which was discontinued in later versions of Android. I think you could install them by installing both apk files manually, but you got a message in the Play Store saying that your version was not supported if you tried to install it through there.
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The only software I've run into so far that won't work on a later version of Android is games. Old games regularly shit themselves on a newer version of Android, on my phone. Which may be because the graphics driver for Adreno 205 differs wildly between GB and later versions, which it does. They never released a driver update for GB, probably to avoid breaking the GB games. Every new game I've tried still works on it though, on GB. My benchmark scores are 20% worse or so on ICS, so I'm sticking with GB. So
Re:Er, that likely means they'll be on WP9 (Score:4, Informative)
But on a related-note, the first jump Microsoft made from Windows Phone 7.5/7.8 to Windows Phone 8 broke compatibility for all existing third party applications.
This is not correct. The framework used on 7.5/7.8 still works on 8, and so applications released for 7.5/7.8 still worked, that framework has just been deprecated for new applications. MS released an additional framework for 8 that was not compatible with 7.5/7.8, so new applications developed with the new framework will not work on older phones. This is not particularly surprising given that I have encountered numerous applications for both iOS and Android that do not work with older versions of the OS.
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But on a related-note, the first jump Microsoft made from Windows Phone 7.5/7.8 to Windows Phone 8 broke compatibility for all existing third party applications. That move really upset the early developers on that platform (especially when they had been told that MS was going to be different and was not going to be fragmented).
From where do Slashdotters get their information? From only other Slashdot posts filled with lies and misinformation?
From http://www.wpcentral.com/microsoft-reaffirms-app-compatibility-windows-phone-8-hints-silverlight-death [wpcentral.com]
"With regard to existing applications: today’s Windows Phone applications and games will run on the next major version of Windows Phone. Driving application compatibility is a function of Microsoft’s commitment to its developer
There were over 120,000 available for WP8 at launch, most of which were WP7 apps.
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You said:
Fact: WP8 was WP7 compatibility with only a few minor differences, and more than 10000 WP7 ran unmodified on WP8, and you said "all existing third party applications"
You did not cherr
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That's like complaining that Android ICS won't run apps written for Android Jelly Bean.
For example see the "breaking changes" http://developer.android.com/about/versions/android-4.2.html#Behaviors [android.com]
Your earlier assertion was that WP7 won't run on WP8, not that WP8 apps won't run on WP7.
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wp7->wp8 jump didn't break all existing third party applications.
it was actually meant to break no app at all... while it breaks some, it doesn't break all.
with 6.5->wp7 they did break everything of course though...
Headline title is sensational (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Headline title is sensational (Score:5, Insightful)
Ridiculous headline title.
And a great example of Betteridge's law of headlines [wikipedia.org].
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Re:Headline title is sensational (Score:4, Informative)
And a great example of Betteridge's law of headlines [wikipedia.org].
Betteridge's law of headlines is mentioned only in the articles that it fits.
Not at all; while in the past I myself have criticised [slashdot.org] Slashdotters who assume that Betteridge automatically applies to *every* headline in the form of a question, this one *is* a case where the writer "knows the story is probably bollocks, and doesn't actually have the sources and facts to back it up, but still wants to run it".
To nitpick, in this case the "story" is actually a (mis-)summary of others' stories that don't actually make this claim- which perhaps is what you meant- but IMHO the spirit in which Betteridge was clearly intended still applies.
Re:Headline title is sensational (Score:5, Informative)
WP8 compatibility - forward and backward (Score:4, Interesting)
While WP7 is different from WP8, WP8 is based on the common architecture of NT 6.2 which will be used as the basis of current and future Windows OSs. So while WP8 may have broken compatibility w/ 7, the same need not necessarily be true of WP 9 and beyond.
I do agree that Microsoft should have had a way to upgrade WP7 phones w/ WP8. Although I wonder to what extent the carriers or OEMs (like Nokia) might have to say about that. For the OEMs, such an ability would simply mean that new phones not be bought, while for the carriers, it could involve unlocking the phones (which in the US would mean that a carrier, having financed a phone, now has to eat the costs while that phone can be used to switch to a competitor).
Re:WP8 compatibility - forward and backward (Score:5, Insightful)
And all you have to do is trust that Microsoft will not abandon their existing customers.
I'll leave the consideration of that track record as an exercise for the audience.
Re:WP8 compatibility - forward and backward (Score:4, Informative)
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WP 7 to WP8 was a major architectural shift. WP8 -> WP9 isn't going to be one.
As for Silverlight, that wasn't good but that was a trauma for developers not end users.
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As for Silverlight, that wasn't good but that was a trauma for developers not end users.
I'm an end user, not a developer... and I really wish Silverlight would finally die. Unfortunately, no matter how many times we hear that it's going to vanish, some web developer decides to implement their brand new website in it. Unfortunately that means that us Linux users are out of luck.
Obviously the people who trained up on Silverlight are making sure to get their money's worth, because I just can't seem to get away from it.
Re:Headline title is sensational (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Headline title is sensational (Score:5, Interesting)
On the other hand the OS support date is reset with any never version of the OS, so a Windows Phone 8.5 or 9 update in November 2013 would bring along its own 18 month of security updates. Microsoft has already promised all current Windows Phone 8 handsets will receive the next major version of the operating system.
8.5 comes this summer. Some of the phones released this summer are already being promised to work with 9.0 which comes out next summer. All windows phones will be able to update to the next version at least which then updates the security updates. Some phones will even go longer. This is not that much different from Android updates. I would speculate 3rd party unlocks will allow updating to 9 on the current 8 phones that the manufacturers don't update.
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There are two kinds of Androids. Nexus, and non-Nexus. Which ones get updates again?
And when we are talking about market share, should we differentiate the two?
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There are two kinds of Androids. Nexus, and non-Nexus. Which ones get updates again?
Asus Transformers?
Mostly seems to be the cheap, crap phones and tablets that don't get upgrades.
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I remember I bought a Sony Xperia Pro because Sony committed to upgrading all of their 2011 phones to Android 4.0. I waited over a year for that to happen, then finally switched to the iPhone a few months after Android 4.1 was released and Sony were still refusing to give any information on upgrades.
Promises of upgrades are something e
Abandoning a platform (Score:2)
All this means is they're going to be moving onto the next version of the OS by then (WP9?). Speculating that they're going to leave the phone market entirely is a little far-fetched at present.
Is that not just the same thing.
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The headline is FUD. I expect MS to sue over patent violation since I'm pretty sure they patented Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt.
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Sorry, no, that's an old IBM patent from 1975 [catb.org]. Of course, Microsoft was able to use it under the business relationship they had with IBM. It seems to have been the main reason for the IBM-Microsoft alliance, since Microsoft ended the relationship when the patent expired in 1992, allowing them to use it freely.
Time for the next major point release (Score:3, Insightful)
Yes, WP8 will be abandoned... for WP8.5 or WP9.
Fixed that (Score:4, Informative)
Yes, WP8 will be abandoned... for WP8.5 or WP9.
Yes, WP8 customerswill be abandoned... for WP8.5 or WP9.
Fixed it for you...they will call it Windows phone 8.8, which they will day is the same as 9 :)
Re:Fixed that (Score:4, Interesting)
Now I know what we all think about actually reading articles around here, but,
Microsoft has already promised all current Windows Phone 8 handsets will receive the next major version of the operating system.
are you a marketing droid? (Score:5, Insightful)
if what you said was true, no one would be stuck on a win 7 phone....but there they are.
Redmond is the FUD factory
Perception is reality (Score:5, Insightful)
Perception is Reality (Score:4, Insightful)
Microsoft is still dealing with the fact that their flagship products throughout the 1990's are almost universally associated with crashes, poor performance, and overhyped marketing. It bit them with the Zune, and now it's biting them with the phones. You know why XBox is so big?
Except the reality is Windows Phone [was] is not very good, [125 REASONS NOT TO BUY A WINDOWS PHONE 7.5 http://my-symbian.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=44034%5D [my-symbian.com]. The harsh truth is it was never a serious competitor which will hurt Microsoft in the future, as its potential customers continue to get burnt....it will end up like the Zune.
Re:Perception is Reality (Score:5, Interesting)
Windows Phone 7.5 still works fine. Windows Phone 8.0 works even better (more features). I don't know anybody with a Windows Phone (myself included) that feels that they have gotten "burnt" from the product. Not that it's relevant anymore, but that link you provided wasn't exactly 100% accurate, either. Your "harsh truth" is really anything but.
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Windows Phone 7.5 still works fine. Windows Phone 8.0 works even better (more features). I don't know anybody with a Windows Phone (myself included) that feels that they have gotten "burnt" from the product.
If your hand has been on the stove since Windows Phone 7.5, you've probably just damaged all your nerve endings so badly that you no longer feel your fingers burning. Do not confuse the absence of a burning sensation with a conclusion that you're not being burned. This is not meant to be a troll against MS, as this can happen in many different situations.
Suggested Tests for Burning
Try your other hand.
Get some fresh air, then check for the oh-so-familiar "fried pussy cat" you smell when your cat chews
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Except the reality is Windows Phone [was] is not very good, [125 REASONS NOT TO BUY A WINDOWS PHONE 7.5 http://my-symbian.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=44034%5D [my-symbian.com].
Referring us to the web site of a competitor's product to convince us that Windows mobile is not good is about as asinine as referring us to Microsoft's web site to prove that OSX is a bad operating system. They're not going to be impartial!
Even if my-symbian.com isn't a site run by Nokia, it's going to be a site run by fanboys who are even less likely to be impartial.
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No, Windows Phone 8 is really good (I like it better than the other Big Two), and all of the reviews for it are almost universally very positive. Windows Phone 8 doesn't crash, doesn't have poor performance, or overyhyped marketing, as you say.
Re:Perception is reality (Score:5, Insightful)
You're misreading the quote you quoted. It doesn't say this is fact, it says this is image. Or, in other words, after the past experiences we've had with MS products, nobody sane would even consider buying a phone from them.
Re:Perception is reality (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm fairly certain the GP was not implying WP8 has any of those problems.
He said Microsoft has an image problem due to previous products, which is very true.
Older MS phones had a bad image, requiring reboots multiple times a day due to crashes and poor performance. Phones locking up when receiving calls, missing alarms, and the stylus interface that attempted to mirror the desktop on a teeny screen were all problems older WinCE phones had.
Windows 95 was famous for not being able to function much longer than a month at a time without a reboot. All of the pre NT series of windows were very unstable, and were very insecure due to the chosen single user design.
Both of those together created an image in the public mind that Microsoft products crash, are flaky, and can not be relied upon.
Now, compare that to today. Windows 7 and 8 are pretty stable, and much much more secure than predecessors (irrespective to any comparison to their competition)
As you say, WP8 has none of those older problems (I am taking your word for that, as I have no experience with windows phones since CE 6 - But at least they didn't stick to the desktop UI!)
Neither of those facts has yet had enough time to change that older image that has been in place for over a decade. They may not until yet another decade has passed.
Peoples purchasing decisions are not based on facts, at least not completely (or even mostly) - so such facts as how great the product actually is, is irrelevant.
The facts from the past have tainted their image so much that purchasing decisions of today are being based on that instead.
It may or may not be fair (which is a whole other discussion) but that is pretty much what is going on, and why sales are so low.
It doesn't matter how great the product is today, what matters is their experience in the past and their personal limit on taking a chance of the same result again.
Personally, if a person or company screws me over and has no remorse at doing so and no indication they want or will change, I refuse to have that person or company as a part of my life.
If a person or company screws me over enough times, even with all the apologies in the world and the best of intentions, after a point I will be distancing myself from them more as well.
It's much easier to convince someone to try something completely new, than it is to convince them to try something they have done before and had a bad experience with.
Re:Perception is reality (Score:4, Insightful)
You know why XBox is so big? It doesn't have the word 'Windows' or 'Microsoft' in its name...
You must be new to the world. Microsoft is still the leader in the desktop market, regardless of your opinion. The world is changing, however, and Microsoft isn't chaging with it as fast, I think this is their bigget problem. They smply weren't fast enough to attach to the moble market, and its bit them, hard. Your thing about crashing, etc... however is just hyperbole. Windows IS the desktop OS. Not too sure where you've been living...
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"They smply weren't fast enough to attach to the moble market, and its bit them, hard"
Um, you mean the Microsoft that's been making smart phones for over a decade? That microsoft has been late to the party? Its not that they were late, its that they made devices that so few people wanted and for so much money, that the market balked at them and Apple / Android absoltely blew past them in a very short order. The iPhone 1 should've been a huge kick in their ass, and if they were as agile as they were in the 9
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Definitely true, but not bullet-proof. I remember not so long ago when Windows had 97% of the desktop market share, Mac had about 2%, and the rest scrambled over the last 1% (Linux clocking in somewhere like 0.5%). Now Mac is more like 10%, Linux is more like 2%. And that's obviously not counting the tablet market, which really is starting to converge with the mainstream desktop market (MS Surface Pro and RT are practically identical to each other, and only spitting distance from an Asus Transformer).
Window
The editors can't read. (Score:3, Informative)
Little Comfort (Score:2)
On the other hand the OS support date is reset with any never version of the OS, so a Windows Phone 8.5 or 9 update in November 2013 would bring along its own 18 month of security updates. Microsoft has already promised all current Windows Phone 8 handsets will receive the next major version of the operating system.
That must bring a great deal of comfort to those Windows Phone 7.x devices that are denied future OS updates...Did they pinky promise.
Did we read the same article? (Score:3, Informative)
The article said they would be updated the system to a new version and that the new version would be pushed to all windows phones. That system would get security updates for 18 months. It sounds like they just want people to upgrade to me.
RTFA (Score:4, Informative)
This posting looks like FUD, if you read the article it says.
All window 8 phone devices will get new version of OS, which will have a 18 month support window.
Re: (Score:2)
18 months sounds like an incredibly stupid length, though, given that most mobile phone carrier contracts are 24 months.
Re:RTFA (Score:5, Insightful)
18 months sounds like an incredibly stupid length, though, given that most mobile phone carrier contracts are 24 months.
That's true, but my experience has been that they let you upgrade "early" after 21 months. In the U.S., the carrier and vendors want the thought bubble over your head to look like this:
They don't want you to get here (which is where I've been for the last 9 months):
oh (Score:4, Interesting)
oh christ was my first thought to that....
I'm not a huge fan of Microsoft but I do feel for Nokia and the bus that their staff were thrown under.
I'd be kinda surprised if this is true though, Microsoft are known for flaunting failed products for years to save face. This would be another reason to add to the list for why metro sucks ... it's pretty sad that the whole windows ecosystem was imho designed from the mobile up rather than an extension of the desktop.
This sounds like FUD though and for once it's not coming out of Redmond.
not just ms, but apple too, and also linux-wth-gnu (Score:3, Interesting)
.
And the sad thing with the latest iteration of the apple OS is that Mountain Lion has turned into an iOS-copy-fest rather than leaving in the features that make a desktop useful like scroll-bars that stay in place, and not having to fucking scroll in order to see the scroll bars in the first place. That is a serious fail, imho, and enough for me to tell my parents not to upgr
Tabloid headline not justified by TFA (Score:3, Informative)
The article discusses dates on which Microsoft will end support for its current product, which is designed to be superseded on (at least) an annual basis. It doesn't mean that Microsoft plans to get out of the phone business, or will delegate software development to Nokia or Google, etc.
BS Article title (Score:2, Interesting)
Seriously? (Score:3, Interesting)
Worst /. headline I have ever seen (Score:4, Insightful)
There is sensationalistic journalism, and then there is blatantly misleading journalism. This is the latter.
Assuming /. wants to be taken seriously, someone's wrist should be slapped for this and/or the headline updated.
Just wait. Surely next year will be... (Score:4, Funny)
...the year of Windows on the smartphone.
520 and 720 (Score:3, Interesting)
Nokia alone is doing
35m for 2012
55m for 2013
85m for 2014
HTC did another 12m or so in 2012 and is expecting growth.
Carriers pushed through huge subsidies all during 2012 and Verizon continues to see Microsoft as key to their business strategy.
What sort of product doing 40% year-over-year growth, good reviews, moderate or better OEM support, so or better developer support, and a good fit for Microsoft strategy gets cancelled?
This article sounds like flamebait to me.
Microsoft is on "rapid release" (Score:4, Informative)
As near as I can divine, Microsoft is no longer going to ship service packs like they did with Vista and prior. Windows 7 is probably only getting service pack 1. Windows 8 basically is SP2. Windows 9 will be SP3. They are on an incremental release cycle, like Apple's OSX, and all those Windows 8 phones might possibly be running Windows Phone 10 by 2015.
Now, they will be nickel-and-diming you for the desktop OS ($40 CHEAP!), but it might not be the case with phones, especially subsidized phones on contract where all the licensing is handled by the carrier. Also something I'm keen to see, Microsoft does not have a great track record with delivering incremental upgrades that don't crater *recent* old hardware, so it'll be interesting to see if they change their ways in that respect.
But the headline and summary is just a FUD encounter of the fourth kind: FUDabduction.
Pure FUD and Slashdot bias... (Score:5, Informative)
Microsoft has already stated that they are moving towards a faster update cycle for all of their software products. All this means is that there will be no new OS updates for WP8.0 after July 2014. They will have 8.5 or 9.0 out before that date.
BTW, Google has the EXACT same upgrade/support cycle for each version of Android (18 months).
I expect more than this from the Slashdot editors!!! After all, they are supposed to at least understand the tech industry which includes software update/support cycles.....
Something about reaping and sowing? (Score:3, Insightful)
Microsoft has abused its locked-in public for far too long; failed to fix things which were important to users, forced "upgrades" onto business. They abused their monopoly power to everyone's annoyance... even the developers, developers, developers.
Is it any wonder why, when Microsoft decides to expand into a market they were too late for, that they couldn't draw any fans (because there are none) or developers or anyone? You can only buy so much, but you can't buy customers ... well you can to a degree, but you can't pay them enough to suffer through more Microsoft than they already have to.
I remember long ago.. Windows95... I was excited. Windows98. Still excited. They were good and popular because anyone could get it... piracy was part of their market share and part of their marketing plan. Once they had full control, the turned on "genuine advantage" and here we are.
Fool me once, Microsoft, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again.
Re:HAHAHAHAHAHA (Score:5, Informative)
Re: (Score:3)
Microsoft has already promised all current Windows Phone 8 handsets will receive the next major version of the operating system.*
*For sufficiently loose definitions of "current".
never, "NEVER", instead of new (Score:3)
.
Here's what the article said:
That is not going to work. (Score:4, Insightful)
it's just part of the push to release everything quicker, more often, and more detriment to the consumer who must constantly re-purchase everything.
I know Microsoft shafted their customers over windows Phone 7 [and earlier versions] sacrificing a 10% smartphone marketshare for 2%, but you can only do so for so long. That 2% they have now they can expect to drop [to nothing] if they continue to abuse its customer base.
More apps != flourishing (Score:2)
But one thing they have done is create a great environment for developers, with tons of tools and a marketplace that takes care of vendors. It appears they learned the from Linux, take care of the developers and they'll build more stuff.
It makes me wonder how Microsoft plans to treat amateur game developers and startup studios on Xbox Durango.
With more applications your platform will flourish.
With more applications the Atari 2600 did not flourish. By sometime in 1983, there were so many me-too applications that retailers couldn't sell them all. That's part of why lockdown became the norm on some platforms: there was a perceived correlation between being able to clear organizational hurdles and quality of the end product.
Re:Good news (Score:5, Interesting)
Not going to believe it until/unless they stop selling the phones (and w/o a new version being offered).
All said, Microsoft likely makes enough money from the Great Android Extortion, so even if they stopped distributing WP8 tomorrow morning, they'd still make money hand-over-fist.
(OTOH, how would you think Nokia would react if such a thing happened?)
Re: (Score:3)
... not the engineers (Score:3)
Nokia won't be around, after all the patents/engineers will be at MS by then.
Nokia's patents may end up in M$'s pocket, but not the engineers
Most of the Nokia engineers I know are self-starters, and most of them can't stand Ballmer's manner
Re:Good news (Score:5, Insightful)
Even the article says that WP8.Next would have its own cycle......so a WP8.5 or WP9 would still get at least 18 months of support. The summary is just FUD. There was nothing in the article and nothing in their source saying that Microsoft was abandoning Windows Phone as a platform......just that the OS support has a time limit.
Re: Good news (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Good news (Score:4, Interesting)
You know, windows phone doesn't need articles in crappy tech blogs to inspire FUD.
Windows 8 is a market place dud. Like WebOS before it. No matter how much tech bloggers like you, if the market doesn't like you, pack it up. It would be one thing if they had a niche and made money. Problem is, they're not making money on windows phone. Microsoft cant afford to keep flushing cash away.
How many windows 8s can they afford? They're not a well oiled machine like Apple, nor are they like Amazon or Google and use other lines of business to keep themselves afloat while they try things in other markets.
The major problem Microsoft faces is that outside of enterprise, who *needs* Microsoft?
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Microsoft Corporation Data Mining Analyst, Senior - ADS
Online Advertising is one of the fastest growing businesses on the Internet today, with $40 billion of a $600 billion advertising market already online. Microsoft is innovating rapidly to grow its share of this market by providing the advertising industry with a world-class online advertising platform and service. The Microsoft Ads Research & Development team is one of the most strategic and growing teams at Microsoft.
As part of a software company with powerful innovations and part media company with global properties, at Microsoft Ads we bring both our technical and creative side to the table. Through incisive analytics, we know who cares - both when and where. We understand how to get in front of the right people at the strongest point of influence. Above all, we love data and excel at interpreting it for our partners. Collecting valuable information from every campaign and mining it for insights
http://washington.jobs/bellevue-wa/data-mining-analyst-senior-ads-817244-job/32762254/job/ [washington.jobs]
Re:Good news (Score:5, Insightful)
I can always choose not to use Google, but where do I turn when my own computer OS is data-mining my privacy back to Redmond?
Linux.
Re: (Score:3)
The typical support channel is through the carriers who, as most experienced customers know, replace the new phone they bought (often on the same day!) with a refurb or used phone if a problem is encountered.
I recall an experience I had with Sprint. Bought a brand new phone. It had some problem with its keypad. They went to replace this new phone with a refurb. I said "hey, wait a minute. I bought a NEW phone. Why am I walking out of here with a used one?!" "policy." "So like if you bought a new car
Re: (Score:3)
it's not totally fud.
for example, if you're a windows phone developer you just had a forced migration to windows 8 on your development kit.
if you bought a windows phone 7 device just few months ago(or today) what good is a 3 year warranty?
it would't be so bad if the api's weren't still incomplete tbh.
but it's ridiculous that a company like MS would stop support before the devices run out of warranty!!!!!!!!!!!!! they want to take back the enterprise? how about they stop fucking around with support like that
Re: (Score:3)
It used to be that all Windows OS got 5 years of support. That was the case for Windows Phone 7. But that was not popular with the wireless carriers as their device warranties only lasted 18 months and did not want the hassle of updating their devices beyond that point.
Microsoft is making this change so that the OS support is consistent with the device warranty.
If you want to complain, complain to the carriers.
Re:Good news (Score:5, Insightful)
Bullshit story and another Slashdot low (Score:5, Informative)
Wow, I didn't think Slashdot could go lower but it just managed to do that.
Next headline: MS to abandon Windows, because Windows XP support Ends April 8, 2014?
Microsoft will make Windows Phone 9, in fact they even have people working on testing it.
http://msftkitchen.com/windows-phone-9-testing-begins-also-windows-9-gets-a-mention-from-microsoft [msftkitchen.com]
And Windows Phone 8 phones will be upgradeable.
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2416002,00.asp [pcmag.com]
And Windows Phone is growing marketshare:
http://wmpoweruser.com/italy-shows-their-windows-phone-strength-already-15-of-windows-phone-market/ [wmpoweruser.com]
http://wmpoweruser.com/windows-phone-has-a-16-3-market-share-in-poland-one-of-the-highest-in-the-world/ [wmpoweruser.com]
http://www.fiercewireless.com/europe/story/analyst-windows-phone-sees-strong-growth-uk-and-italy/2013-01-23 [fiercewireless.com]
http://www.wpcentral.com/long-queues-china-nokia-lumia-920-sells-out-two-hours [wpcentral.com] [And yes, that's actually picture of people queuing for Windows Phone)
And yet we have this bullshit FUD summary, headline and article? No wonder Slashdot is losing readership fast, with barely a few comments for stories compared to earlier.
The partyline biased moderation, calling people with alternate viewpoints shills and chasing them away into karma hell can only last so long before the echo chamber gets tired of listening to itself and packs it up.
Reminds me of this story http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/02/16/2259257/draconian-drm-revealed-in-windows-7 [slashdot.org]
Even the mainstream tech media noticed that. Interesting read: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2009/02/oh-the-humanity-windows-7s-draconian-drm/ [arstechnica.com]
I doubt any one would care now, with most people having written off Slashdot as the hiding place of anti-Microsoft trolls and zealots living in their alternate reality. Posters like bmo, symbolset, tuple666, Zero__Kelvin, LordLimeCat, Jeremiah Cornelius, UnknowingFool, rtfa-troll, binarylarry, MightyMartian, drinkypoo, pieroxy and a whole bunch of others have ruined Slashdot beyond repair and seem to suffer from this affliction: http://linux.slashdot.org/story/09/07/25/1757253/linus-calls-microsoft-hatred-a-disease [slashdot.org]
This place was always anti-MS but reasonable and informative comments used to get modded up a few years ago, not anymore.There are enough things to bash Microsoft with, why make up lies and spread FUD?
Of course, the real blame is on moderators for modding up these kind of posts and marking others rebutting replies to them as troll and flamebait.
Last one out, switch off lights.
Re:Bullshit story and another Slashdot low (Score:5, Insightful)
My mod points ran out yesterday, so I can't mod you up.
But, and this is coming from a linux and android fan, Your post is spot on!
FUD sucks no matter where it's coming from, and this (OP and thread) is totall sheit.
Mod Parent Up!
Bullshit comment (Score:5, Funny)
No wonder Slashdot is losing readership fast, with barely a few comments for stories compared to earlier.
This is absurd. Slashdot's growing at an astounding rate in both the troll and fanboi demographics.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
> And Windows Phone 8 phones will be upgradeable.
> http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2416002,00.asp [pcmag.com] [pcmag.com]
Have you read that article. It was 100% bullshit. They claim WP8 is flexible enough to adopt new hardware components, which WP7 couldn't, because the spec for WP7 phones was really specific.
Well, if WP8 is so flexible, why can't they make it adopt old hardware components like the ones in WP7 phones?
The reasoning in the article would be why WP7 won't run on newer hardware, not why WP8 won
Re:Bullshit story and another Slashdot low (Score:5, Informative)
They changed the kernel in WP7 from WinCE to the WinNT kernel(the same lineage as in Windows 7/8) in WP8, which is a pretty big changes and left the old OEM hardware drivers of WP7 incompatible with WP8. Since the next WP version will be using the same kernel, it's not hard to imagine WP9 working on WP8 devices.
Re: (Score:2)
Exactly, they got the jump on the Desktop after pulling a few strings. And now you got these Mini-Console popping up to further cut into all the big boys profits; and have you noticed there is very little interest in the next-gen consoles? It's like Crickets out there. And their phones are not doing so well, latest numbers say 2%, that's hardly a dent. But there are a lot of apologists out there that will argue until their ears bleed that Microsoft is doing well, whatever.
And now with Linux in a usable stat
Re:Bye, Bye Nokia :-( (Score:5, Insightful)
Pretty much so. They continued with the clunky, sluggish and buggy Symbian for waaay to long.
Uh, no. As someone who actually USED a Symbian phone and wrote code for Symbian phones (for longer that I wanted to), the problem wasn't bugginess. The problem was that it was terrible to write code for. It took C++ and decided to spin it around and around until it made you want to throw up. They had their own notation, for pete's sake. But as far as bugginess goes? Android is FAR buggier and FAR more insecure than even Symbian circa 2006.
Not like this mattered much in regards to the top level story anyway, Nokia's CEO was desperate to push Nokia back into the US market again (they had always been solid in Europe), and figured teaming up with a very US-ish company like Microsoft would give them a market edge (as if they adopted Android, they'd be just another Android blah blah phone manufacturer competing with the rest of them...and Google itself). It turned out to be a bad call...Windows Phone is the latest in a fairly tainted line of mobile OSs and that taint still haunts all of the children of WinCE to this day. Every new regurgitation has something wrong with it that drives its users up the wall. Microsoft just never "got" mobile. And when it was too late, they started paying off bloggers to write good press about their stuff. Instead of doing what Apple and Google did...basically, imitating and building on the successful points and user interaction flow of previous mobile OSs, Microsoft was transfixed on making its users enjoy their own generally jarringly different user experience and flow. They always had to have things work their way, even if their way wasn't very practical. Mobile client OS design isn't easier than desktop client OS design, and there are way too many people at Microsoft that didn't understand this.
That said, if Microsoft decided to drop mobile, their shareholders would be furious. They'd lose a lot of stock value. The press would be terrible, PR damage control would be too much to deal with. They will continue to count on that handful of very headstrong people, typically older people, who have been using Windows for 20 years, refuse to ask anyone else's advice, and just conclude that Windows Phone would be the easiest for them to use. Then they get frustrated and complain about it at me. They may continue to ride that 10% of the market for the next 10 years if they have to, because quitting for them would cost them more than losing cash on it for the next 10 years. Just ask Meg Whitman over at HP about that one.