Cell Phones To Be Allowed On UK Planes 217
Matty the Monkey writes "The British regulator in charge of air travel has approved cellphones for use on airline flights, reports the BBC. Airlines will be allowed to activate base stations in the plane's tail after takeoff, creating a zone of mobile coverage around the plane. 'The services could stop working once aircraft leave European airspace. Initially, only second generation networks will be offered but growing interest would mean that third generation, or 3G, services would follow later, said Ofcom. The cost of making a mobile phone call from a plane will be higher than making one from the ground.'"
Fist fights at 30,000 feet. (Score:5, Insightful)
I am waiting for the smashed phones and fist fights to start happening in response to this.
Re:Fist fights at 30,000 feet. (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Fist fights at 30,000 feet. (Score:5, Insightful)
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The vibration mode thing seems like an essential thing (in ALL public places actually). The sound made by incoming texts is just as annoying as some retard talking on the plane into their phone. It's Pavlovian. The sound of incoming message alert is designed to attract the attention of the recipi
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The vibration mode thing seems like an essential thing (in ALL public places actually). The sound made by incoming texts is just as annoying as some retard talking on the plane into their phone. It's Pavlovian. The sound of incoming message alert is designed to attract the attention of the recipient -- unfortunately this also means everyone else within 40 feet.
Agreed. I wish there was a way to force this on people, but as far as I know there isn't.
As an aside, I'm sure there must be a way of mathematically proving that the altitude of a phone call is inversely proportional to importance of the call.
This on the other hand can be fixed. With pricing. Having the cell on the plane essentially means that people are roaming on the planes net, just as if you were in another country, and therefore you could attach a price to different usages. Voice could be made more expensive (i.e. meant for business use only), and data could be priced lower. I people really wanted to chit-chat they could use IM on their laptop instead
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That would be nice...but, I try not to text msg...as that it costs like $0.10 each, and I pretty much get all the voice minutes I can use in my plan.
But, I understand this is UK...and that maybe it is the opposite...cheaper to txt than to talk on cell phones over there?
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Re:Fist fights at 30,000 feet. (Score:5, Funny)
When other people force me into their conversations in public, where I cannot really move away without significant inconvience, and the conversations are that inane, I generally join in. For instance, you could have said something like, "Oh, you know I hate when I get bitchy looks. You always know that... [I'm not going to continue, but if you talked for five minutes, they'll get off the phone." Alternatively, instead of talking for a long time, you could be uncouth; "She was probably bitchy because she was getting her period. After she's bled out her vagina for a few days, I'm sure she'll be fine."
The important thing is to entertain yourself as you interfer.
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Even the brain-less teenage girl could inadvertantly spill her complimentary drink on you when you pissed her too much.
Fist fights for sure....
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mod parent insightful (Score:2)
Re:Fist fights at 30,000 feet. (Score:5, Interesting)
It will be much worse when the plane is up and flying. Changes in pressure, plus the engine noise, are going to make hearing the tinny little speaker in mobile (since this is the UK) phones very difficult. And when hearing goes, shouting follows. Joy.
Re:Fist fights at 30,000 feet. (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Fist fights at 30,000 feet. (Score:4, Informative)
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Re:Fist fights at 30,000 feet. (Score:4, Funny)
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"Vous retournez chez toi dans une ambulance."
"You are going home in an ambulance."
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Re:Fist fights at 30,000 feet. (Score:5, Interesting)
With cell phones, this doesn't happen, so you feel like you need to speak loud enough to hear yourself. Which is louder than a normal conversation because you're covering one ear.
Why cell phone manufacturers don't feed back your voice to the receiver, I don't know.
Re:Fist fights at 30,000 feet. (Score:4, Informative)
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Re:Fist fights at 30,000 feet. (Score:5, Funny)
1. Incoming Call - Ring ring. Hello, Hi Larry, No, I'm on the bus, I'll call you when I get to the office. Bye.
2. Person gets on bus and calls - Hi, I just got on the bus, pick me up at the bus loop at 5, thanks bye.
3. Person gets on bus (ok, girl gets on bus) - talks loudly, same conversation as the one you quoted. "So she's all like get over it you know and I go like whatever and she goes.......blah de blah
Calls #1 & #2 - no problem, they don't bother me, the person is being considerate of others. Call #3, They'll find her corpse stuffed into a culvert somewhere, and the cause of demise will be suffocation due to a cell phone lodged in the trachea. Not that I'm angry or anything. As long as the jury members are over 30 I'll never be convicted either.
Sure, cel phones on a plane, what could possibly go wrong.
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Apparently some people don't see anything wrong with subjecting fellow passengers to an hour long conversation.
It has always amazed me more so that these people care nothing for their own privacy. Anytime that I'm out in public, I try not to be heard while conversing because it isn't anyone else's business. Of course, in a society that devalues privacy more and more everyday, it isn't entirely surprising. Or are these people just that self-centered and oblivious of their surroundings?
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"Yes mum, I'm on the train, I'l--"
"I can't hear you, can you talk louder?"
"No, I'm on the train. To London. It'll be there in 40 minutes, it won't be late"
and while that's going on I'm trying to still look cool (and probably failing).
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Someone talking on the phone next to me is no worse than them watching hentai on their Neno with the volume turned up to deaf-before-50 level.
Yes, that has happened to me.
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The quality of audio on the phone is much, much, much worse than quality of audio in real conversation, so people have to talk much louder. In real conversation people can whisper. Have you ever seen anybody whispering on the phone?
Tag me Captain obvious, but I am really tired to hear the argument: "What, now I cannot talk?"
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People like to talk. Get over it.
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These people should recognize that not everyone fits into all of these categories. Nor do they
apply all of the time. http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200303/rauch/ [theatlantic.com]
There are plenty of public spaces where there is a reasonable expectation of little noise
(libraries, movie theaters, plays, public meetings, most kinds of stores) and this expectation
has always been implicit for airplanes (the alternative was not an option).
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But after scanning ALL the posts, I didn't see a single one, which said, "oh, if this is a PITA, I'll just explain to my neighbor that (s)he is being obnoxious; please don't invade my space." Nor one, which said, "I'll just ask the attendant to manage the situation, optionally threatening to write the airline explaining that they are forfeiting my patronage, naming the specific crew who caused the difficulty.
Why do ordinary solutions seem extraordinary on Slash
Aaaargh (Score:5, Funny)
Earplugs... £0.15 a pair. (Score:5, Interesting)
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When I used to fly, I would wear earplugs, then ear phones (the big ones) on top. It worked pretty good, and with engine noise and such, wouldn't disturb anyone else. My biggest problem was that cranked to full volume, the battery wouldn't make it for the 8-10 hours of flying.
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I just plug in my Shure in ear phones...open up the laptop, and usually play my Zeppelin DVD or a bootleg Stones DVD I got...and jam with th
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Concert DVD's....I"m jamming to them in concert....watching and listening.
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People have always had conversations in public. It's only become a particular nuisance on cellphones because they talk so loud. There's no reason to talk above a 6-inch voice in a face-to-face conversation on a train or airplane, and no reason to do so on a cellphone either. But because people have a hard time hearing on cellphones and don't have feedback of their own voice through the ea
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This is simply a lie. There are no "unexpected sounds" that it is important to hear on an airplane. You are simply self centered, and think that it is better for everybody to do what you say than it is for you to take care of yourself.
Re:Earplugs... £0.15 a pair. (Score:5, Insightful)
This isn't about unexpected sounds on airplanes (that was probably not well worded, sorry). This is about public spaces in general, and about any sounds that could be useful to hear. It could be on a plane or on a train trying to have a conversation of my own at reasonable volume. Face-to-face, cell, walkie-talkie, whatever. I actually don't fly much, but I ride the L (Chicago subway/elevated trains) pretty often; if I had earplugs in on the L I might miss a change-of-service announcement (sometimes when trains get bunched they'll have the lead train skip stops). And I'd certainly be less aware of people around me trying to board and depart crowded trains. Fortunately not very many people talk loudly on the L, and not many people wear earplugs, because a train full of people that couldn't hear anything would really suck.
I think it's great that someone is finally putting to rest the idea that cell phones will harm plane navigation systems, and is even working out a solution to make in-flight calls work. Go progress! Now why can't people progress (or even just not regress) in their ability to behave conscientiously? You know, take regard for the people around them? You calling me self-centered is fucking laughable.
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That of course breaks the laws of physics...
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That's completely the opposite of what happens. The active noise reduction actually cancels the incoherent noise of the engines, wind, etc. Voices come through just fine, and you're going to be hearing that baby just as clear as before.
More expensive? Why? (Score:2)
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from the summary....
>Airlines will be allowed to activate base stations in the plane's tail after takeoff...
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To deter people from yakking all the way on an 8 hour transatlantic flight.
From what I've read, they'll disable the cells while on the ground and during takeoff and landing.
Practicalities aside, who else thinks that cramming many people into a small spa
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No one talks to each other.
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At peak times you're unlikely to find people talking, probably because they don't know anyone else or haven't woken up yet.
At other times, when there's likely to be friends or families going out together, then there might be people talking.
(This is my experience from living in London.)
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It's more expensive because ... (Score:3, Insightful)
(2) The satellite bandwidth costs money.
(3) The extra infrastructure on the ground costs money.
And, last time I heard, the ground in most places is lower than 3,000m so if you use your phone on the ground what happens is that you'll be just as liable to prosecution as you are today.
Look mate, when there's a phone switched on in my plane I can hear it over the VHF radio - h
just so long... (Score:5, Funny)
9/11 anybody? (Score:2, Interesting)
"Mom, this is Mark Bingham"...
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So I can tell you from personal experience that cell phones do, indeed, work on planes.
Re:9/11 anybody? (Score:5, Informative)
When your phone connects to a terminal, both the phone and the terminal measure the strength of each other's signal and they adjust their transmitting power to give a usable signal. That's why your battery charge doesn't last as long out in the country: your phone is transmitting at full power.
When you're at high altitude in an airplane, your phone will connect to a terminal that might be fifty or a hundred miles away, it will use full power to do that, and it will hit every other cell tower within that range. That loads the system down.
The system described in TFA puts a terminal right in the airplane, where your phone can communicate with it at minimum power. Then the signal goes over a reserved channel from the airplane to a dedicated ground terminal and into the main cell system, without fscking up everybody else on the same channel as your phone.
rj
Can't we make calls now? (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Can't we make calls now? (Score:4, Informative)
A. All but TWO of the calls came from cell phones. The rest were from Verizon Airfones that are mounted to the back of the middle seat that charge like $20/sec. (But ya know, if you're being hijacked, you make the damn call, charges be damned)
B. The plane was about 2,500 feet off the ground when the cell phones were able to connect and then were dropped shortly after as the plane, well, crashed. Abridging the last paragraph in the LINK YOU BLOODY GAVE.
So...yeah. Make a cell call from 30,000 feet and get back to us.
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Up in an aircraft, it's a very different situation - your phone can see plenty of different towers, and it'll register with all of them. The plane is moving pretty quickly too
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The problem for airlines is that in order to do this, the cell phone has to be operating on full power.
When the cell phone is operating on full power, it is highly likely to interfere with the plane's navigation systems.
By installing a mini base station in the passenger compartment of the plane, cell phones on the plane will lock onto the base station on the plane and opera
Security Double Standard (Score:4, Insightful)
Mobile phone jammers (Score:3, Insightful)
This is the Godwin of mobile phone topics. Ok wait for it...
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Re:Mobile phone jammers (Score:4, Insightful)
On an aeroplane? Why would a doctor, needing to receive calls, be on an aeroplane? If the doctor's likely to get calls regarding medical emergencies (I assume that's why you specified that profession) while he, or she, is on an aeroplane that's about to take off, or already in flight, I strongly suspect they wouldn't answer anyway.
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Yay, I can't wait (Score:2)
*I know babies can't help it, but the parents could at least try and comfort them instead of letting them scream their heads off.
All problems have solutions (Score:3, Funny)
But do you know why cell phones are not allowed? (Score:5, Interesting)
The real reason is that cell phone networks are based on a 2 dimensional system. Cell towers grant leases based on which tower has the strongest signal from a particular phone. When the user of the phone moves from one tower's coverage to another, the lease is transferred. If a plane full of people flew over a metropolitan area with 150 cell phones negotiating leases, chaos ensues as the system is not designed to support a 3 dimensional model. Newer networks are but the older ones will be problematic. I highly suspect the British trial will have a special base on the plane which will take all the leases so the ground towers will not be affected.
The last reason is annoyance. I actually used Skype on planes from Vancouver to Frankfurt equipped with Boeing's Connexion internet service. While the trial ended, it was clear that using Skype on an overnight commercial flight could cause a great deal of annoyance to passengers wanting to sleep. ON local flights, it might be acceptable for a few sociopaths to talk the entire time thus ensuring their fellow passengers have full details of their personal lives.
I personally think that it will be less than two days before we see a newspaper article about a cleaning crew finding a passenger duct taped to the planes toilet with a cell phone shoved up his hind side.
Re:But do you know why cell phones are not allowed (Score:2)
Wouldn't a bunch of passengers on a high-speed train have the same problem? Especially the Intercity ones doing 120 miles/hour? From using a wir
On the shinkansen in Japan... (Score:2)
The newer ones all have base stations in the train, so I get a rock-steady signal all the way along the line. At least most people have manners, though, and the most you usually hear is the occasional ring tone (and the tap-tap-tap of email, of course!) and almost everyone leaves the carriage to talk on the phone.
They also now have power, but still no WiFi on the newest trains, but that's another rant...
And people have much wor
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On one line south of England I use there's a cell tower at the end of a long (few miles) straight-ish tunnel, and that's enough for calls to work right through the tunnel (possibly the signal can bounce down the tunnel?).
(PS Take 240mph for the train, since you've taken the speed of a fast passenge
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Trains don't go that fast in regular service. The fastest run is on the Shinkansen between Hiroshima and Kokura, where the average is 165mph, peaking at 190mph. TGV hits faster speeds in record attempts by removing all the passenger carriages (since unlike the Shinkansen the power is not distributed throughout the train), but so far there are no peak speeds in service above 200mph (320km/h), and these are not sustained
Re:But do you know why cell phones are not allowed (Score:3, Insightful)
And you base this statement on what exactly? I'm a test pilot and I am sick of hearing these erroneous arguments every time this subject comes up. Every time we put a new piece of gear in a plane, we have to go through about 3-4 weeks of EMI testing to verify that the new addition doesn't interfere with the electronics of the aircraft. Guess what... the guys in the E3 lab alway
Pilot Killing Waves (Score:4, Funny)
I saw a documentary on it here:
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2006/10/30 [penny-arcade.com]
Oh, I guess that frequency-hopping signals really aren't that bad.
Wrong direction. On a bus in tokyo they say .... (Score:3, Interesting)
"Passengers are reminded that portable telephones should not be used on the bus as they annoy the neighbors!"
Re:Wrong direction. On a bus in tokyo they say ... (Score:2)
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"Coach A is the quiet coach, passengers are reminded that using mobile phones, stereos etc is forbidden in this carriage."
Re:Wrong direction. On a bus in tokyo they say ... (Score:3, Interesting)
As an avid hater of loud mobile phone users, my belief that the whole mobile phone problem lies with people not the technology, was reinforced.
In Other News... (Score:3, Insightful)
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My guess is all calls get dropped; and those two planes don't make their scheduled arrival times.
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Done with planes (Score:4, Funny)
Phones. The latest in a series of moves designed to make traveling on a plane as excruciating as possible. Were I wearing a tinfoil hat I might even think it were a deliberate policy to discourage people from taking planes, in the name of terrorism or whatever this week's Reichstag fire is.
- First there's the awful journey in a car and the cost of parking in the long-term carpark (slightly cheaper than buying your own plane). Or a similar fee in any taxi, should you decide to leave your car at home.
- Next up is the confusing maze of finding your check-in point in a plastic ugly 60s monstrosity designed by the same blind architect who also does all the world's supermarket carparks.
- Then you wait in line to check-in. Usually behind a Mongolian rugby team, who all have visa issues, and who all want to ask very, very detailed questions about their seats.
- Then there's the security check. The hours of waiting, then the removing of shoes, belts, rings, laptops, false teeth, and god knows whatever else. This despite the fact that it's pretty easy to throttle a steward using the shoulder strap on your carry-on.
- Then you have to hang around for hours in the departure lounge (you arrived 3 hours early to beat the lines at security). You fill the time by buying bad coffee which costs about the same as 100 gallons of avation fuel. Tastes like it too.
- Then you get on the plane....
And now some fucker's gonna sit and phone for hours?Screw planes, I'm going by boat. It's probably quicker.
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Screw planes, I'm going by boat. It's probably quicker.
I do wonder if transatlantic boats are due for a comeback. If a trip to the US took a few days, but was comfortable, cheap, and gave you space and bandwidth where you could keep working, it would be a nice alternative to flying. The real problem is the speed. From London to New York is almost exactly 3,000 nautical miles (you could maybe have the port somewhere in Cornwall and shave a few percent off that, but we'll use it as a rough figure). A typical cruise ship gets around 20 knots, so it would take
noise (Score:2)
Crying Wolf? (Score:3, Insightful)
Or wait - perhaps we were being lied to all along? They're not dangerous, but in fact
perfectly safe.
Perhaps the biggest danger is people blocking isles not moving their legs when they are moving their lips. (no jokes please).
C.
They are doing this in Australia too but ... (Score:2, Informative)
The last thing you want on a Red-Eye flight to/from Perth etc is some numbskull blabbering on his phone.
However it will be just like international romaing so its probably going to cost an arm and a leg to use
Take it outside (Score:5, Funny)
Can I pay extra to avoid this? (Score:2)