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Portables Media Hardware

5.5 oz. MPEG-4/Audio Portable From Archos 166

Posted by timothy from the horning-in dept.
An anonymous reader writes "Several manufacturers produce hard drive-based MPEG-4 portables now, but to date they are all big and heavy devices weighing in at around 3/4 of a pound. Archos just announced the Gmini 400, a 20GB video/audio player that comes in at the iPod's dimensions and light 5.6 ounces. Presently shipping, I guess they are ready now for the iPod Video in case that player ever becomes more that a /. myth."
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5.5 oz. MPEG-4/Audio Portable From Archos More

5.5 oz. MPEG-4/Audio Portable From Archos

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  • The iPod looks bulky compared to the flash-based players. That's the future.

    Never send rotating machinery to do an IC's job.

    • Capacity of CF? (Score:2, Informative)

      by tepples ( 727027 )

      The iPod looks bulky compared to the flash-based players.

      Yeah, but can you put your entire CD collection on one CF Microdrive?

    • Your right, it is the future, as soon as prices are low enough on high capacity flash players that they can compete with the ipod

      A the moment they are far to expensive to be feasable, I bought my 20 gigabyte 4g ipod for $490 (CND), a 20 gigabyte flash chip would be unacceptably expensive

    • No, that's the past. Flash players came first, but capacity was (and still is) an issue. Remember?

    • Re:The rotating machinery has got to go (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Jeff DeMaagd ( 2015 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:47PM (#10097083) Homepage Journal
      mpared to the flash-based players. That's the future.

      Never send rotating machinery to do an IC's job.

      The future, but, don't try to leap there too quickly unless you have, and lots of it. 1GB CF card costs $100.

      I think it is useless to consider whether something is "advanced" enough to be cool or something. The right tool for the right job, and while small hard drives are less than ideal, if a 20GB laptop hard drive costs less than $100 and a 1GB Flash card costs $100, which do you honestly think most people will choose for most situations?

      The iPod is fine, no flash-based player at a similar size can store 20 to 40GB of anything yet.

      CF is also pretty slow and has orders of magnitude fewer rewrites.
      • Oops, I forgot the word "money":

        The future, yes, but, don't try to leap there too quickly unless you have money, and lots of it. 1GB CF card costs around $100.

        I think the CF players are too expensive for their limited capacity, and too slow to rotate files through often.

    • When someone comes out with flash-based storage that costs less than $10/GB (I'm being generous here) and has infinite read/write life (or at least on par with a hard disk), let me know.

      Until then, flash-based players aren't ever going to compete with the iPod on price/capacity ratio, and that's obviously (look at the success of the iPod mini relative to the flash-based player market) what consumers want.

      p
    • I don't think so. Flash drives are *not* more dependable that hard drives. They're good for a few thousand reads and writes, which is fine for a keychain device to swap files-- but if you're constantly swapping mp3's you can kill it relatively quickly.

      Anyway, how much less bulky do you need to get than the iPod mini?

  • anyone interested in buying a used av340 (Score:4, Funny)

    by way2trivial ( 601132 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:35PM (#10096999) Homepage Journal
    with 35 gigs of porn, and 4 of music

  • Gizmodo has pictures and bit better of a review (Score:5, Informative)

    by Milhouse_ph ( 538432 ) <paul.n-site@ca> on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:38PM (#10097017) Homepage
    Gizmodo has pictures and bit better of a review:

    http://www.gizmodo.com/archives/archos-gmini-400-e verything-but-a-price-019630.php [gizmodo.com]

  • This looks really nice, but... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Sheetrock ( 152993 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:39PM (#10097023) Homepage Journal
    What kind of lifespan can one expect from these type of devices?

    Given the failure rate of IDE in PC computers, where one imagines they've got more than enough space and manufacturing experience going for them, I wonder how long these mini-HDDs will last even without being subjected to drops.

    Especially at $400, which seems almost a bargain for this technology.

    • Forget life span. What about market span. Isn't the Sony PSP supposed to have some mpeg playback capabiliities? The market is too diluted with these portable devices.

      I own mini-iPod and although it's great... I still don't know if it's worth that kind of money. They should be in the $150 range. Another device now at $400 is a killer in your wallet.

    • Not that it's really comparable, but my roommate has had that bigger Archos player that's been out for a while (I forget the model number) since around when it released... it gets used every day, has been dropped a couple times, still works fine (she even takes pictures with it from time to time).
    • >>What kind of lifespan can one expect from these type of devices? Given the rate at which these things are evolving, they will pretty much be obsolete before they die of natural causes. If it breaks in a couple of years, then it will be a good excuse to go buy the latest 100G disk player, or 20G flash player.
    • The failure rate of discs is nothing compared to the failure rate of batteries. It's usually feasible (although it will void your warranty) to change the HD inside one of those devices since they use fairly standard parts. Batteries can be more difficult and they can be much more exotic. Way less standardization in that field...

      I'm not really fond of this new trend of including the battery inside all those new devices. Batteries still have a fairly short lifespan and I *liked* being able to just pick off t

  • Pounds, ounces, what...? (Score:4, Informative)

    by heneon ( 570292 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:40PM (#10097030)
    Just for the metric people here, the Gmini 400 comes in at the iPod's dimensions and light 0.158757329 kilograms [google.com]

  • Smart move (Score:5, Interesting)

    by fastdecade ( 179638 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:40PM (#10097034)
    Lots of people say "why would I ever need to watch movies". Fair enough, but the new player takes away the biggest reason *not* to have a video player. Not everyone will go for it, but there will now be a lot more people who'll say "why not have video as well, if the form factor is the same".

    People might not think they would use video, but they'd be surprised if they actually had the opportunity, as I do on my Treo. When you can't be bothered reading on a crowded train, or you've got to wait somewhere a few minutes, nothing beats pulling a Simpsons episode out of your pocket. And you're not going to bring a player especially for that, but if it's already there anyway (because you carry your music everywhere), you'll use it.

    • Lots of people say "why would I ever need to watch movies". Fair enough, but the new player takes away the biggest reason *not* to have a video player. Not everyone will go for it, but there will now be a lot more people who'll say "why not have video as well, if the form factor is the same".

      Why not? Well, let's see... price comes to mind.

      This seems like a solution in search of a (non-existent) problem. The screen is as small as an iPod's, so I can't imagine wanting to watch movies or TV shows on it. Hec
    • >People might not think they would use video, but they'd be surprised if they actually had the opportunity, as I do on my Treo.

      Wait a sec... out of curiousity, what are you using to do this? I'm posting from a Treo 600 right now, and wasn't aware such software was available for this.

      • Re:Smart move (Score:3, Informative)

        by fastdecade ( 179638 )
        Wait a sec... out of curiousity, what are you using to do this? I'm posting from a Treo 600 right now, and wasn't aware such software was available for this.

        Check out mmplayer, which does a great job of playing ... wait for it ... native divx! You still need to convert divx so it's small enough, but you can easily store a half-hour cartoon in 20MB, or a non-cartoon movie in 200MB. Since you can get 1GB SD cards now, there's plenty of room left over for backup, mp3s, etc. You can make the movies with virtu

  • WHY VIDEO? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by rampant mac ( 561036 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:43PM (#10097050)
    I keep seeing iPod competitors coming out with video playback devices and I have to wonder... WHY?

    The reason the iPod does so well is because of one principle: K.I.S.S. (Keep It Simple, Stupid) Want to play a song? Mash the huge button on the front of the iPod. That's it.

    Other than people riding a train to work (or other stationary activity), who would actually use their device for video playback? I can't use it when I run, I can't use it when I do household chores (vacuuming, cleaning, etc), I can't use it when I draw or paint... What exactly is the point?

    It would really surprise me if Apple released a video iPod.

    • I've got to agree with you.

      I bought my kids a small (CD walkman-sized) DVD player a year ago. Other than the odd long distance car trip, it really doesn't get used.

      It's really neat

      It's really cool

      It's really hard to enjoy a movie on a 4 inch screen

      stick with your iPod. "near-DVD-quality" on a little screen is neat, but will lose it's charm after a few days...

    • Re:WHY VIDEO? (Score:2, Informative)

      by chaoticset ( 574254 )
      The spirit of keeping it simple works against the spirit of innovation. They both have to win occasionally, and they both have to lose occasionally. It's flexibility versus simplicity, and with only one or the other you lose completely. With both, you have a range of options.

      I, personally, would love to have a video player, even if the interface on it is slightly more complex than "mash the huge button". This is a principle of encapsulation, in that this thing can do what an iPod does and much more if

    • Re:WHY VIDEO? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Chris Carollo ( 251937 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @02:52PM (#10097566)
      What exactly is the point?
      I've got an Archos 340 and I use it primarly when traveling. Any plane flight now includes a selection of my favorite movies and TV shows, paused when I want, with high-quality sound. Plus I can listen to music if the mood strikes me. Yes, I could use a laptop for movie playback, but it's considerably more bulky and has worse battery life.
      • What you call bulk, I call video quality and flexibility
        What you call worse battery life, I call 'four hours of video per battery'

        Yes, to each their own :)

    • Re:WHY VIDEO? (Score:2, Insightful)

      by shepard ( 2304 )
      The stationary activity you mention is a valid market to target this device at. Just having a device that can handle MPEG4 decoding in such a small form factor is a huge step forward. In the generation after this one there will probably be a video output on these devices, allowing any display device. Throw 2 or 3 movies on a 20 GB player and head over to the party. Throw 40 political speeches and interviews on the player and hold a teach-in/rally for local voters. Or use the player as a portable studio

    • Re:WHY VIDEO? (Score:3, Insightful)

      by martinX ( 672498 )
      I'd like the ability to show off baby photos and be able to use video out to a TV. For baby videos of course. There's probably more people like me than there are frequent-fliers-who-want-to-watch-tv-shows-freque n tly, so I think there's a market for this device.

      Having used a video camera with a 3.5" LCD, I think that this would be the ideal size for actually viewing anything meaningful, though.

      Mac guy that I am, the Gmini looks pretty good. If I could connect my digital stills camera to it, we'd have a w
      • Does your digital stills camera use CompactFlash cards? If so, then yes, you have a winner.
    • I agree. I ride the train to work every day, but I'd much rather read and listen to music than zone out to a video.

      Of course, everyone said the iPod was a dumb idea when it came out, maybe one of these video things will take off...

  • My friend recently upgraded his portable DVD (Score:4, Informative)

    by linzeal ( 197905 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:43PM (#10097052) Journal
    He shopped around for awhile and had some pretty specific needs as he was sick of constanly burning DVDs for travel and laptops in the size he wanted were too expensive or flimsy. He wanted a decent screen but something that could still fit in the leather WW2 camera bag, decent battery life, and a mic that can record in mp3. Most of his movies are shots he has done for film classes with the odd south park or simpsons off his pvr. He settled on an archos model the av380 [amazon.com] and the only complaint I've heard about it is that it only has a USB 2.0 interface as he really wanted firewire.

  • SI units please (Score:4, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:45PM (#10097068)
    "5.5 oz" = 0.155922377 kilograms
    "3/4 of a pound" = 0.340194278 kilograms
    "5.6 ounces" = 0.158757329 kilograms.

    woo for google calculator.

  • Review with video at CNET (Score:5, Informative)

    by openSoar ( 89599 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:46PM (#10097074)
    http://reviews.cnet.com/Archos_Gmini_400/4505-6499 _7-31000735.html?tag=cnetfd.sd

  • Been lusting after Archos for a while... (Score:3, Informative)

    by Speare ( 84249 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:49PM (#10097101) Homepage Journal
    I have an ImageTank G2 for field photography. It's basically a CompactFlash-to-Harddrive siphon, trapping your photographs like the GhostBusters ghost containment devices. It has a very rudimentary interface, but that's all you really need in the field to ensure your photos are secure, without the bulk and logistics of a laptop.

    I've lusted after the Archos media varieties lately, especially the newer one that has a CompactFlash slot without requiring a dongle. The units allow image playback to LCD or TV, which is handy when you're visiting relatives who want to see your shots before you go home to do serious prints or processing.

    • Over in the dpreview.com Storage forum, there have been a number of frustrated users of the Archos 220, which for some users has a high degree of file corruption, ruining quite a few pictures. Given photographers uses these devices to backup their media so they can erase it and continue on, it is fairly serious if these devices routinely corrupt files.

      Now Arhos may have fixed the problem in the new version, and they may not have. I suspect I would wait on the sidelines until other people try it out, give

  • still cant get it right ... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by jest3r ( 458429 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:51PM (#10097125)
    Thankfully Archos seems to moving in the right direction; away from the behemoth awkward looking players of the past.

    However, why on earth would they release a portable video player with a display only slightly larger than the iPod's (2.2 inch vs. 2 inch)? Even the gameboy has a bigger screen (2.9 inch). There is alot of wasted realestate on the new Archos which could have been used for a bigger display.

    Sony should add video and audio playback capabilities to the upcoming 4.5 inch w i d e s c r e e n PSP [playstationportable.com]. That would truely be an iPod killer.

  • hideous (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 28, 2004 @01:52PM (#10097128)

    my cellphone (se p900 [sonyericsson.com]) has a bigger screen than this thing and thats right now
    do these other industrial designers even take note of Apples attention to athestics ? are they blind or just stupid ? and yet the wonder why their devices fail (in terms of consumer acceptance) people dont read specs/features first, it has to be good looking enough for them to pick it off the shelf in the first place before even reading what it does, its like Palm , constantly making clunky devices and wonder why the .jp cellphones outsell them 100:1

    oh and does it do Xvid ?

  • Looks like you have to use two hands to control the thing. This isn't a GameBoy, it's an mp3 player, and as such you it needs to be something you can hold in one hand or pocket and operate easily. Plus it still doesn't have iTunes, which is huge.
    • It's set up like that for mohpun games (in otherwords, it is like a gameboy). I'm pretty sure you only need to control it like that when playing games or maybe setting up playlists. I imagine simple things like "next track" can be accomplished with just one keypress and thus you wouldn't have to take it off your belt and stop jogging (lets face it, no one who reads slashdot actualy excercises anyways).
    • "Plus it still doesn't have iTunes, which is huge.

      No, but you will have Media Center [musicex.com], which is way cooler anyway anyhow. How useful would iTunes, currently a non-multimedia software with very limited codec and transcoding support, actually be for a multimedia handheld?

  • The coolest part of the Archos hardware, of course (Score:4, Interesting)

    by AugstWest ( 79042 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @02:01PM (#10097191)
    is Rockbox [rockbox.haxx.se], the open-source firmware for most of their devices, with features out the wazoo [rockbox.haxx.se], assuming you're one the the lucky wazoo-bearers of the species.
    • Does anyone have one to crack open? I'm interested in what chipset it uses for divx/xvid decoding and to drive the LCD. It has to be some sort of existing dedicated chipset, or at least a somewhat affordable programmable setup. I don't think they could have designed their own custom chipset, included a color LCD, used a 1.8" hard drive, and still keep the price this low. I doubt they sell enough units to get the same volume discount Apple gets when ordering parts to build its iPods.

  • Some more details. . . (Score:5, Informative)

    by Cyberllama ( 113628 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @02:08PM (#10097249)
    I've been looking at all the portables coming out for a while and I'm passing on this one -- thought anyone who just wants a music player will probably like it. Here's the things this can do that the ipod cannot:

    1) View photos

    2) Copy photos/movies/music directly off of compact flash (or other formats with adapter) using built in compact flash adapter.

    3) Play movies (Screen is only 2.2 inches, but its pretty) at *FULL* dvd resolution (impressive processing power for such a little guy).

    4) Has a very nice gui for playing music on its color screen -- which of course you'll shut off to save battery life.

    5) Plays Mophun games -- you know, the cheesey little cellphone games. It comes pre-loaded with 5 of 'em. . .

    In otherwords, it can do everything ipod can do, much more, and in the same size. It's a neat little gizmo. Not perfect though, I won't be getting one in fact -- Here's why:

    1) 400 dollars for 20 gigs -- a bit more than a similar featured ipod. This is not a problem for me, but might scare some people away -- though archos is a bit less into the whole "price controlling" thing that apple does so you might actaully find it on sale for less.

    2) 2.2 inch screen only takes up about half the total dimensions of this -- you could theoretically make a larger screen on this unit without increasing the size. My guess is they didn't for costs/battery life reasons. Nevertheless, if I can't read the subtitles on my anime, it's no good.

    3) The real killer for me: No support for Advanced Simple Profile for divx -- this means that most of the files encoded "in the wild" will have to be re-encoded to play them. Archos is coming out with it's AV500 (pda with a harddrive) model soon which is supposed to have support for ASP.

    Since I personally am looking for a video player primarily and music player secondarily, I will wait for the AV500. I don't want to re-encode all my anime. However if you guys were looking to buy an ipod, you should definately consider this little guy. For just a bit more money you get ALOT more features (video, photos, compact flash, pretty color screen, mophun games).
    • 3) Play movies (Screen is only 2.2 inches, but its pretty) at *FULL* dvd resolution (impressive processing power for such a little guy).
      Uh, the screen is 220x176 pixels and 18-bit color (262,144 colors == 2^18). Last I checked that was a bit less than a full DVD... And it doesn't have video out, so you can't get anything more than what's displayed on the screen. Sorry.
      • The resolution of the screen is not full dvd. But the files can be ENCODED in full dvd resoltuion. I'm speaking in terms of processing power, not in terms of what you'll actually be able to see.

        You may or may not be aware that in order to be divx certified, a device need meet two requirements (perhaps others as well):

        Support Advanced Simple Profile, and be able to decode dvd resolution. This device meets the latter requirement but not the former.

        In otherwords, it can easily decode anything that's not
      • Also, who told you it didn't have tv output? Becuase all the sites I just checked that are taking pre-orders seem pretty sure that it does. . .
      • If you look at the specs, it has composite video out.

        I personally would have liked to have seen SVideo or DVI (or Mini-DVI, or what ever that funky new HDTV connector is called).
    • Does it run Linux :)

      Seriously, I have a laptop and have been thinking for quite a while about getting another portable device. If I get a Pocket PC (or say a Zaurus) and a CF drive, I could get all of the functionality you describe plus a fair bit more capabilities without having to carry around yet another device (i.e. could leave my laptop behind at times; and don't need PDA + player)

      Granted, the PocketPC+CF disk solution is probably on a different price league than this player. And the player looks v

      • Re:Yes, but... (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Cyberllama ( 113628 )
        Well, the AV500 definately will. It's the PDA with a hard drive player. Not only will it have all the requirements to be fully divx certified (finally! I won't have to re-encode my files!), but it also runs Qtopia (linux) for all my PDA'ing needs.

        Does the gmini run some sort of stripped down version of this or something else -- I have no idea? But I can tell you that its likely someone will hack it to make it run linux -- they did it with the other archos models that had much less processing power than
    • With more recent LCD technology, such as one that allows 150dpi, you can have a full VGA resolution (not to be confuseed with 480p) on a 5.3" screen. The device would have to be about 4.5" x 3.5" though.

  • It looks like a Game Boy! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by mrchaotica ( 681592 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @02:15PM (#10097292)
    Well, not quite (more like a Game Gear), but still, doesn't it just beg to be a portable gaming system?

  • iRiver H300 Series (Score:3, Informative)

    by Shazow ( 263582 ) <andrey.petrovNO@SPAMshazow.net> on Saturday August 28, 2004 @02:15PM (#10097298) Homepage
    The iRiver H300 Series is also worth a look.
    20 Gigs: http://www.iriver.com/product/info.asp?p_name=H320 [iriver.com]
    40 Gigs: http://www.iriver.com/product/info.asp?p_name=H340 [iriver.com]

    It has a colour screen (so it certainly isn't the first mp3 player with a colour screen) and it also serves as a USB host, allowing people to transfer photos from digital cameras onto the iRiver on the fly. It can view still pictures, and has similar music playing capabilities as the original iriver H100 series (I believe). Still no AAC though. Buuut it does maintain a 16 hour battery life from what I read.

    Maybe someone will come out with a firmware hack to allow playing movies on it? That would be awesome.

    - shazow
  • How do you do your movie ripping?

    I don't advocate video jukeboxes yet because there isn't an iTunes equivalent for DVDs yet. Insert DVD, rip, and catalogue. How do you do this for the Archos? Everyone who seems to rant about them talks about watching movies... but how do you get the movies on the drive?

  • Mpeg 4, huh? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by pldms ( 136522 ) on Saturday August 28, 2004 @02:31PM (#10097402)
    So looking at the specs in the review I see mpeg4 sp video, but in an avi container and no aac audio. Which is misleading, to say the least.

    I was bitten by this recently when I bought and 'mpeg 4' dvd player, which was nothing of the sort. Would it play mpeg 4 files? Nope.

    I'm surprised that mpeg and iso seem to be offering little guidance on this. Is isn't helping them when players badged 'mpeg4' don't seem to be able to play the format.

    (sorry - pet peeve :-)
  • The 20GB iPod weighs the same and has the same dimensions as this device.
  • I don't trust the quality and service of Archos. I had horrible experiences with their jukebox MP3 player. It was a terrible product and their customer service to get you a new one under warranty was also impossible.
    The fundamental problem is that they rush to get out the latest cool product without hammering out the details and practicality and interface. I'd rather wait until a more solid manufacturer like Apple gets everything right from the right transfer speed, charging, UI, software, etc. Sure i
    • I've actually had good luck with my Archos Jukebox. I have the Version 2 Jukebox Recorder, bought from Amazon this past January with a $50 rebate, so the price in the end was only $150 US for a 20 GB MP3 player with USB 2.0. The Jukebox is reasonably durably built (it's survived a few falls and I accidentally flung it the length of my office once), the audio quality is fine and the USB transfer speeds are good, making it an extremely useful portable backup. Also, there is no requirement for song manageme

  • But.... (Score:2, Insightful)

    by beaverbrother ( 586749 )
    How much will it cost? Personally, investing $299 to buy an ipod seems a little pricey. If it costs anymore for all of these additions, it will be out of most people's spending range. Who really wants to walk around with a video in their hands anyways?
    • Why is a $299 iPod pricey but a $274 Sony 400-Disc MegaStorage CD Changer is not?
      Why is a $299 iPod pricey but 50gb of music CDs is not?
      Why is a $299 iPod pricey but a $499 Alpine CDA-9833 car CD Player is not?
      Why is a $299 iPod pricey but a $349 Pioneer 600W 5.1-Ch. Home Theater System w/5-Disc P.-Scan SACD/DVD-Audio/MP3/DVD Player is not?
  • The iPod's success isn't _just_ because it's small and light. Nor is it just because it's the trendy thing. It did two things perfectly right and that's why it's managed to gain so much marketshare.

    1. The interface. It's downright brilliantly intuitive. Especially the click-wheel on the 4Gs. You can't help but feel just how right Apple got the interface every time you use it. Never before has so much functionality been jammed into so few buttons. You look at some of the other players out there and boggle a
    • I'm just talking about smart things like smart playlists, party shuffle, and other ways of easily and powerfully customizing how your music plays.

      Yes yes yes, iTunes is reasonable in these areas, but it's still playing catch up to Media Center's [musicex.com] more flexible, refined and downright powerful implementation of these things, is coming from a long way behind, and has a long way to go. iTunes doesn't even support multimedia, which for a multimedia handheld the subject of this posting, is a bit of an oversigh
  • in the article:

    Of course all of their digital media players (music/still photos/video) since the Archos AV100 series have a color screen, but this time the menu system for selecting tracks is in color. Nice, but no big deal.

    They have had color screens (and video) since the original Jukebox Multimedia player. Then came the JBM 20, then the AV's.
  • While this is close to ideal, it's not great as a video player since you can't use an external monitor with it. RCA out would be a good start.

    The reason: I already keep my DVDs in a travel case. If this gadget can replace that, I'll gladly dump the movies to it and use that instead.

    • It does have RCA (composite; the yellow plug for video channel and the red and white plugs for stereo audio) video out. It's listed in the specs at the bottom of the posted mp3newswire.net link. So you can output any video you've got on there to a television at the least. And while the maximum video quality is slightly shy of DVD, it's only by a small amount (640x400 as opposed to 720x480 for an NTSC DVD) and it'll still look very good on a television.

  • alternative firmware (Score:2, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward
    will they need alternative firmware? see http:/www.donat.org/archos

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