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Wireless Networking Upgrades Hardware

Linksys Shows Off New Products To SOCALWUG 85

Posted by timothy from the cisco's-farm-team dept.
John Hering writes "Last night at the Southern California Wireless Users Group (SOCALWUG) meeting, a representative from Linksys, a division of Cisco Systems, presented several new never-before-seen Linksys products which including a wireless-G range extender, a wireless switch, wireless network attached storage and even a new Boingo co-branded wireless-G router which will serve as an off-the-shelf hotspot solution. It's interesting to note how the new Linksys products continue to look more and more like Cisco products."
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Linksys Shows Off New Products To SOCALWUG More

Linksys Shows Off New Products To SOCALWUG

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  • The one Linksys wireless product I'm waiting for (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Roland Piquepaille ( 780675 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @04:50PM (#9286718)
    ... is the one that won't allow unencrypted 802.11 links to happen. Whenever I go wardriving, half of the hits I get from kismet have SSID="LINSYS", WEP="NO".
    • but of couse none of us ever associate with the network, we just passivly look at them... right?
    • True, but then you have companies that insist on having "open" conference rooms, lounges, lobbies, and so on. Out of the box, IMHO, the router shouldn't start serving up wireless, UNTIL the EU properly configures WEP; or acknowledges having an open network will allow "anyone" in.

    • Why? (Score:3, Interesting)

      by spellraiser ( 764337 )

      If you don't want encryption, why should you be forced to use it? WEP has its flaws anyway, as has been repeatedly pointed out. Personally, I think MAC filtering is a much more hassle-free method of securing a network, especially for small home networks.

      No, an access point that doesn't allow encryption is simply the wrong solution. It is the responsibility of the user to secure the network, and it's not like it's such a great deal of work.

    • Re:The one Linksys wireless product I'm waiting fo (Score:5, Insightful)

      by burtonator ( 70115 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @05:52PM (#9286944)
      Why in the WORLD would you want that?!

      First off...

      We want to ENCOURAGE open wireless networks! If you live in a dense city like San Francisco (where I live) if we had enough open networks we would have a decentralized Internet infrastructure across the city.

      I'm sitting in a coffee shop right now in the Haight district of San Francisco (Waller and Cole actually) and there are 5 wireless networks on the corner.

      The downsize is that 2 of them are WEP and I can't really get decent signal on the others due to lack of decent antenna and LoS.

      Criaglist founder Criag Newmark is nice enough to have an Open AP right up the street but it's too far for me to reach it.

      Second... WEP is NOT secure. What we REALLY need is a decent AP that has ipsec already setup and still allows open connections.

      Of course I've been leading the way here. I've had an Open AP in my last 3 appts. Never had any problem.

      Also.. when the RIAA comes calling I have probable deniability. I can just tell the Judge that it was some random wireless user and I have a Linksys AP and I'm not smart enough to secure it ;)

      Kevin

      • Re:The one Linksys wireless product I'm waiting fo (Score:5, Insightful)

        by secolactico ( 519805 ) * on Saturday May 29, 2004 @06:35PM (#9287123) Journal
        Also.. when the RIAA comes calling I have probable deniability. I can just tell the Judge that it was some random wireless user and I have a Linksys AP and I'm not smart enough to secure it ;)

        That will only work so many times. After a couple of people use that defense, you can bet somebody is going to push some law mandating the securing of wireless networks, either by requiring manufacturers to make it easier or passing a law that says that the network owner is responsible for *anything* illegal that goes thru his/hers network.

        Rest assured, they'll try to convince people it's in the interest on national security *and* to prevent child pornography ("won't somebody please think of the children"). ;-)
    • Dont forget - every spam or virus you recieve goes through more than one Cisco router, and more spam and viruses means more bandwidth, and more bandwidth means more Cisco routers sold. Who benefits most from spam on the whole planet?...

      Why, yes, its CISCO.

      And who could stop all all the spam in the world if they wanted to, with simple, anti spam software?...

      why, Yes, its CISCO.

      Next time you get a spam, thank CISCO for it.

  • More like Cisco? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by CaptBubba ( 696284 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @04:57PM (#9286749)
    I've been very impressed with Linksys lately. There is, however, one thing that they need to not bring over from the Cisco side: boot times.

    Cisco's stuff may be nearly bulletproof, but the damn things take forever to power on. A 350 AP or BR can easily take over 3 minutes to boot. I really hope that they can find a way around boot speed issues. The public at large will not be as willing to wait as a network admin.

    • Well chances are they're not running the IOS, and they don't support anywhere near the functions that a cisco branded device does, so it won't have to do the same checks that the cisco does.
    • When i hit the switch on the powerstrip, by the time my cable modem connects, the wireless router has booted, and is followed shortly after by my computer. Although you shouldn't have to be constantly booting network hardware.
  • I thought that Linksys was a subsidiary of Cisco... So why should it be surprising that Linksys products are beginning to look like Cisco's. I for one would welcome Cisco products at Linksys prices.

  • Linux and Linksys as "disruptive technology" (Score:5, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29, 2004 @05:01PM (#9286767)
    Cringely has an interesting article on how Linksys has embraced Linux in products like the Linksys WRT54G and how the teaming of this technology may well be the next disruptive technology. [pbs.org]

  • hmph (Score:5, Insightful)

    by bmetz ( 523 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @05:02PM (#9286770) Homepage
    Personally, I think the design style that linksys has gone with has built a little mini-brand and I can't see why they're messing with that. By changing that I think Cisco goes a long way to telling customers 'the name might be Linksys, but you're not really buying Linksys products anymore'. They might think it's a good thing, but others might not. The products seem to D-Link-y now.
    • When I bought an 8-port Linksys switch some time ago, the first thing I was impressed by was that it was that these switches were no longer housed in a Mexican blue case made of low grade plastic. IIRC the packaging advertised a New and Improved All Metal Case -- Cisco's way of saying "Hrmph right back atcha" maybe?

      I agree, somewhat superficial, but it's more than probable the change was reflective of an improved quality than a simple design modification. If the reverse had happened, and the All Metal Ca

  • Meanwhile I'm still waiting (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Crypto Gnome ( 651401 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @05:03PM (#9286774) Homepage Journal
    For LinkSYS to support WPA in AP-AP (Wireless Bridge) mode on their WAP54G.

    "Note:WPA does not work in Wireless Bridge mode in this release"

    Dammit people, WHEN will you get it right?

    We don't need no stinkin NEW Products, we need completed features in our firmware for existing products.
    • We don't need no stinkin NEW Products, we need completed features in our firmware for existing products.

      Nobody forces you to buy new products. You're welcome to stick to your older products and download firmware upgrades, as it's a perfectly valid consumer attitude.
    • IIRC the WAP54G version of sveasoft does this.

      Since these products run Linux, just make them do what you want :) It's a pity they're so expensive over here (retail is 120 ($192) for the WAP54G, and the WRT54G is about 90 but is a better product (!!!)). I saw a WAP54G for 50 the today (slightly damaged) which is the cheapest I've ever seen it even on the internet.

      And there's cringley crowing about how they cost around $60 (38) in the US... Baaah.

    • for something to support AODV or DSR out of the box... (might be awhile)

      -jim

  • Missing Product... (Score:4, Funny)

    by roryh ( 141204 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @05:09PM (#9286801) Homepage
    ... the G-spot :)
  • Here it comes the 802.11n and the 802.16. I'm pretty sure I'll start making move toward wireless adjustments then.

    I'm not about to compromise wired ip network with inferior products and standards using 802.11a/b/g
    FYI, Cisco is already on board with 802.16 move toward WISP and WifiMax inititive. It will hit the market as soon as early next year.


    --
    Cisco, the maker of internet device and Crisco, the maker of cooking oil and grease product merged today to create world's first internet greasing device w

  • Wireless switch.. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Junta ( 36770 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @05:25PM (#9286859)
    Sounds like an interesting concept, but I wonder how it will scale...

    Assuming single-channel G/B operation, the best it could do is divide G/B users into three distinct segments (three non-overlapping frequency ranges at best). With this lack of flexibility a switched architecture seems not to yield much benefit... In fact, the alternitive use of overlapping channels to increase the overall 'bus' of the netork (the dual channel 108 mbps devices') seems more beneficial. If the net is only segmented into 3 segments, best case, and any given two hosts on the network communicate, there is a 33% chance they are on the same segment anyway, and the switched benefit isn't had. With dual channel, single segment, sure there is a 100% chance for contention in that case, but far more bandwidth available, and much better performance in wireless to lan communication (which is 98% of usage anyway).

    Of course, it could be different from what I'm picturing, maybe it is more akin to a managed hub, where packets are only retransmitted to each host on 'switch-like' rules, but it remains the standard single-media solution. Perhaps kept very switchlike by different encryption keys per host, but ultimately the media is still shared in a hub fashion, so the typical network performance benefits of switched ethernet networks are not there to be had.. Of course, more intelligently handling mixed B/G devices could be the case, which would be a good thing..

    Anyone know any more details about what they are meaning by a 'switched wireless network'? It certainly could be an interesting concept if the standard had more non-overlapping channels...

  • Wireless Vlan: cool (Score:5, Interesting)

    by rduke15 ( 721841 ) <(rduke15) (at) (gmail.com)> on Saturday May 29, 2004 @05:26PM (#9286862)
    I'm glad to see they seem to have dumped that horrible design they had.

    But more importantly, it looks like this will make what I wanted [slashdot.org] possible:

    Wireless switching with the Linksys WET54GS5 Wireless Ethernet Switch:
    - Managed Ethernet switch
    - Wireless supports virtual LANs (VLAN)
    - Supports up to 69 VLAN users
    - Each wireles suser gets a separate Subnetted IP address
    - Targeted release June 2004

    This should enable you to share your wireless Internet access, without opening up your own network to strangers.

    • Re:Wireless Vlan: cool (Score:4, Interesting)

      by rduke15 ( 721841 ) <(rduke15) (at) (gmail.com)> on Saturday May 29, 2004 @05:34PM (#9286895)
      PS: This post and the parent are precisely coming through the connection of some anonymous neighbour. He's not sharing it on purpose, it seems, and I guess I could easily hack into his machine on the same subnet. But I appreciate this practical Internet access: wihtout this neighbour, I would have no access tonight. I want to offer the same commodity to people, and that wireless vlan switch looks like it would let me do it safely.

  • ethernet 2 USB converter (Score:5, Interesting)

    by j1m+5n0w ( 749199 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @05:54PM (#9286954) Homepage Journal

    The SAN device looks cool - it appears to be a device that makes any USB mass storage device appear as a network drive. I wonder if it shows up as a windows file server, nfs server, or a network attached block device? Can two computers use it simultaneously? Does anyone else make something similar?

    -jim

    • Good question. Just a while ago Tom's Hardware reviewed a product that was a USB->Ethernet converter.

      The idea was you installed a driver on your PC. Then you plugged your USB stuff into this device, which plugged into ethernet. Then any computer on your ethernet network could use that USB device (assuming it had all the drivers/etc).

      It only worked with some things (HDs, printers, etc) and not others (can't think of any off the top of my head, but I doubt that an ethernet adapter or wifi adapter would w

      • Just a while ago Tom's Hardware reviewed a product that was a USB->Ethernet converter. The idea was you installed a driver on your PC. Then you plugged your USB stuff into this device, which plugged into ethernet. Then any computer on your ethernet network could use that USB device (assuming it had all the drivers/etc).

        Do you have a link to this review, a search at Toms Hardware did not provide any thing similar. Just usb devices.

  • Anybody else notice that the network attached storage specifically says it's *NOT* wireless?
    • Anybody else notice that the network attached storage specifically says it's *NOT* wireless?

      GOOD! Why would you want a wireless NAS? ? ?

      WEP, WPA, etc are not 100% secure as a wired connection.

      I am certainly not going to connect a NAS device up wirelessly to my network for it to be a potential security leak of personal or corporate documents.

      May as well throw gasoline on the fire. Thats just tempting wardrivers to see whats on that NAS.

      I dont use my wireless LAN even with 128bit WEP, MAC FILTER,
      • Did you bother reading all of the original story then the article it was linked to?

        The original story says: "... including a wireless-G range extender, a wireless switch, wireless network attached storage and even a new Boingo co-branded wireless-G router ..."

        While the article the story linked to describes a "Network attached storage with the Linksys NSLU2 Network Storage Link for USB 2.0 Disk Drives". One of the features of said device is "Connects to wired LAN (not wireless)".

        While I do agree with
  • So when are Linksys going to support IPv6? That's what I'm waiting for.
  • From the linked article:

    Network attached storage with the Linksys NSLU Network Storage Link for USB 2.0 Disk Drives:
    - Creates an Ethernet network connection for USB devices
    - Supports external USB hard drives and Memory Sticks
    - Connects to wired LAN (not wireless)

    Too bad, because wireless NAS options are few right now.
  • Want to see the video of the meeting? I'll get the meeting video archive online asap. Check SOCALWUG [socalwug.org] within 24 hours or so and you'll see the new Linksys products presented at the meeting.

  • Linksys is Junk! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by matth ( 22742 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @06:24PM (#9287081) Homepage
    Perhaps Cisco will change this... But we've had nothing but trouble with them at work. Those 8 port switches? Forget using them on any network that requires uptime. If you get a little power flicker they are gone, they hold onto the last piece of traffic they had (usually an arp) and just keep repeating it until the network floods and goes down. I've experienced this with no less then 6 DIFFERENT linksys 8-port switches (the 4 ports are fine and do not do this).

    The Broadband routers do the same thing occassionally, they will packet storm on the network and cause traffic problems.

    So far all i've seen says YUCK junk. Our company used to purchase linksys exclusively to use internally (when we didn't need something as powerful as a 24 port DELL switch) and also on our broadband network when customer's needed equipment. We've since switch to D-Link and have had not an issue.
    • I'd have to agree. We've just recently decided to no longer purchase linksys equipment based on, not only the waulity, but the behaviour of Linksys in regards to product releases.

      I wrote a little entry about it on my website. Linksys has lost my vote.
      • I should also add that I once called linksys to find out if there was any way to force the ethernet port on their broadband routers for 10/Half (Alvarion Wireless Radios like to be forced for some reason).. and their tech was like.. wa huh? Like dude you wanna do what?
        • Thats why we suggest a cisco 831 to our clients. We even offer to set them up for free, including ACL's and so forth. I have a number of people that have gone thru one or two routers, and finaly decided to buy a cisco. I have yet to have one of our custmors call us with problems that can be fixed by a reboot of the router while running a 831. Nice too beacuse they can be setup for dial backup in case our netwok goes down, not likely, but I like to give as many options as i can to people.
    • "If you get a little power flicker they are gone, they hold onto the last piece of traffic they had (usually an arp) and just keep repeating it until the network floods and goes down."

      I can confirm that this is absolutely true, I have 1 linksys 8 port switch that is connected to my router. My router does not like what the switch does when the power flickers. It does not like it to the extent that i have had to reflash the firmware 4 times because of the switch going into 'retard mode'
    • I agree. I used to recommend and install LinkSys WAP's and their 'Routers' to all my SMB clients. Interestingly, when Cisco bought them out, I figured quality could only go up. NOT!

      Hours spent trying to get one of these WAP's working does not bode well when you're charging by the hour. If anything, since Cisco stepped in, quality has suffered. Why would any vendor use Winblows' built-in wireless config over their own utilities by default? Blech!

      I'd rather pitch the Airport series at a lower profit m

  • Ever since Cisco purchased Linksys the frequent firmware updates for my router has dropped to zero!

    An email to tech support about the subject yields troubling information about the company. Not one person can tell me if development on the router firmware has stopped or if the router is being discontinued or when/if a new one will be released.

    My next router will not be a linksys. I am going into IT work soon and that equipment will not be linksys either!

  • SCWUG (Score:1, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    There's actually a "Southern California Wireless Users Group"? Wow. And they thought us Linux guys were nerds.

  • a little quality control would help.. (Score:3, Informative)

    by mr. methane ( 593577 ) on Saturday May 29, 2004 @11:05PM (#9288096) Journal
    Linksys has been really good at innovating for a while now, and they have always been good at getting the price down.

    My big concern is quality. Looking back, almost half the access points we've gotten from them have been DOA or died shortly afterward. Two out of three GigE switches had bad fans in them, one of the replacements did as well. One BEFSR41 power brick melted.

    On NICs, I can't fault them; they're 100% reliable and install with zero issues. I'd reccommend them as easily as Intel or 3Com. But their external hardware has been really spotty. Compared against the rock-solid reliability I expect from even low-end Cisco gear (1600-series routers or even ATA's) I think they're taking a big gamble putting the Cisco label on it.

    That said, I want one of those usb-to-ethernet storage gizmos.
  • Did they by any chance say what they were going to use to replace their now-pulled WSB-24 signal booster?

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