If they wanted a secure phone OS that has access to a wide variety of applications without strings tied to "big corporations", then they should have just forked Android.
Their emphasis is not strictly on the OS, but also the hardware. Their goal was to get hardware that isn't locked down wherever they could find it. That is why they also offer a USA supply chain version of the phone.
There is a need for a phone which 1. Has kill switches for any data it is equipped to collect 2. Has auditable code base. Ideally all code would be auditable in code, realistically some binary blobs may exist for some time but they could still be reverse engineered and audited for back doors so long as the blobs are small. Not free software, not OSS, the minimum need is for just auditable software layer. 3. Has the ability to autodetect when an external monitor and power are connected and to run desktop applications in that context while running phone apps in the phone screen context at the same time.
Benefits: 1. Ability to carry your computing device on you at all times. Helps any time you need physical security and do not trust access controls at home. Most common example - you are cheating on your spouse and do not want your computer accessible when you are not home.
2. Eavesdrop security via kill switches. The benefit is obvious
3. Confidence that you will not be served ads via your OS and will be able to install ad blockers and filters at will. This includes easy access to etc/hosts or equivalent
4. An upgrade and maintenance plan for older hardware if you can get a community around it.
This is just the obvious stuff that comes to mind. Right now you can get most benefits of Librem 5 and PinePhone from almost any LineageOS phone by compiling MaruOS on top of it. That gets you Debian running in a container on an external monitor. However the MaruOS community is small, phones already supported are few, and the polish is lacking severely. The big deal with PinePhone and Librem 5 is that they have some hope of sustainable development. And kill switches dont hurt either.
#1 is the problem here. If you want your phone to be your computing device then you need it to run desktop software. The practical ecosystems are linux, mac and windows. So you either need AOSP with a compatibility layer (e.g. in MaruOS the compatibility layer is Linux access via a container) or full Linux on the phone. Another option would be to port all desktop software to Android. That seems like more work somehow. There is also an option to run an OS like linux via virtual machine or in an app. This is te
by Anonymous Coward writes:
on Monday November 23, 2020 @05:13AM (#60756190)
It's not that simple. Librem 5 is first of all about open hardware: the idea is that every component of the phone can operate without closed-source proprietary binary blobs. It's more about trust than security. Achieving this is becoming increasingly difficult: for example, the most recent laptop that fully supports open firmwares is a Thinkpad from 2009. For phones it's even worse (basically impossible)
Librem admittedly succeeded only partially in this feat: the GSM module for example is still closed. But they engineered the phone so that the main CPU is isolated from the GSM CPU (usually it's shared). So you're only running a black-box for the GSM stack, which is at least a good start.
Purism's marketing campaign was aggressive and, according to many observers, dishonest. They advertised a phone 100% free as in freedom, but they knew this could not be accomplished completely because it's still impossible nowadays to fully liberate modern hardware components. Companies like Pinephone or Fairphone adopted a more nuanced stance and focused on other things such as sustainability of raw material or hardware modularity (which I think should just be MANDATORY in consumer electronics even if it requires compromises in design, sorry for your feelings dear hipster)
Another product that is a bit more under the radar right now but I think it's cool is Shiftphone. Don't hear many talking about this, unsure why.
My main concern with all these phones is that they are freaking BIG. Especially the Librem 5, it's like a brick. I am one of those increasingly rare people who prefer a small phone. My current one is a Samsung Galaxy S4 mini. I would sell my soul to have a small and "modern" smartphone with fully open hardware able to run LineageOS. With replaceable battery and SD card slot. Sigh.
(Daily reminder that Android OS is *not* free. A good compromise is Lineage OS without Gapps)
Companies like Pinephone or Fairphone adopted a more nuanced stance and focused on other things such as sustainability of raw material or hardware modularity
I've said this before, if you're the type to upgrade your own desktop computer, you already know where this leads. You'll end up with a really old, beat-up phone with new innards. Modular design makes sense when a few components age out significantly faster than the rest of the device (as in the early era of PC 3D graphics accelerators, where you practically had to buy a newer model for each release of a new game), but for smartphones that's not really the case. By the time you need more RAM, or a faster
My main concern with all these phones is that they are freaking BIG. Especially the Librem 5, it's like a brick
I can't find any size specifications at all. Sure, it has a 5.7" screen but that doesn't give me width or height, or screen ratio, or bezel depth, or how thick the phone is.
I think I'm ok with a phone a bit larger than the one you're using but I hate the trend of making phones too big to fit safely in trouser front pockets.
Seems to be mostly german-language, and not focused on mainline kernel support.
>they are freaking BIG
Ya, part of the issue being the need a huge battery to even consider being an everyday main device. Maybe future revision and silicon will make a librem 4 possible.
For who? (Score:3, Informative)
Who is this for? Who is asking for this?
If they wanted a secure phone OS that has access to a wide variety of applications without strings tied to "big corporations", then they should have just forked Android.
Re:For who? (Score:5, Interesting)
Their emphasis is not strictly on the OS, but also the hardware. Their goal was to get hardware that isn't locked down wherever they could find it. That is why they also offer a USA supply chain version of the phone.
Re:For who? (Score:5, Informative)
There is a need for a phone which
1. Has kill switches for any data it is equipped to collect
2. Has auditable code base. Ideally all code would be auditable in code, realistically some binary blobs may exist for some time but they could still be reverse engineered and audited for back doors so long as the blobs are small. Not free software, not OSS, the minimum need is for just auditable software layer.
3. Has the ability to autodetect when an external monitor and power are connected and to run desktop applications in that context while running phone apps in the phone screen context at the same time.
Benefits:
1. Ability to carry your computing device on you at all times. Helps any time you need physical security and do not trust access controls at home. Most common example - you are cheating on your spouse and do not want your computer accessible when you are not home.
2. Eavesdrop security via kill switches. The benefit is obvious
3. Confidence that you will not be served ads via your OS and will be able to install ad blockers and filters at will. This includes easy access to etc/hosts or equivalent
4. An upgrade and maintenance plan for older hardware if you can get a community around it.
This is just the obvious stuff that comes to mind. Right now you can get most benefits of Librem 5 and PinePhone from almost any LineageOS phone by compiling MaruOS on top of it. That gets you Debian running in a container on an external monitor. However the MaruOS community is small, phones already supported are few, and the polish is lacking severely. The big deal with PinePhone and Librem 5 is that they have some hope of sustainable development. And kill switches dont hurt either.
Re: (Score:2)
Every single one of those things can be done with a forked version of Android.
Why reinvent everything just because?
Re: (Score:2)
#1 is the problem here. If you want your phone to be your computing device then you need it to run desktop software. The practical ecosystems are linux, mac and windows. So you either need AOSP with a compatibility layer (e.g. in MaruOS the compatibility layer is Linux access via a container) or full Linux on the phone.
Another option would be to port all desktop software to Android. That seems like more work somehow.
There is also an option to run an OS like linux via virtual machine or in an app. This is te
Re:For who? (Score:4, Interesting)
It's not that simple. Librem 5 is first of all about open hardware: the idea is that every component of the phone can operate without closed-source proprietary binary blobs. It's more about trust than security. Achieving this is becoming increasingly difficult: for example, the most recent laptop that fully supports open firmwares is a Thinkpad from 2009. For phones it's even worse (basically impossible)
Librem admittedly succeeded only partially in this feat: the GSM module for example is still closed. But they engineered the phone so that the main CPU is isolated from the GSM CPU (usually it's shared). So you're only running a black-box for the GSM stack, which is at least a good start.
Purism's marketing campaign was aggressive and, according to many observers, dishonest. They advertised a phone 100% free as in freedom, but they knew this could not be accomplished completely because it's still impossible nowadays to fully liberate modern hardware components. Companies like Pinephone or Fairphone adopted a more nuanced stance and focused on other things such as sustainability of raw material or hardware modularity (which I think should just be MANDATORY in consumer electronics even if it requires compromises in design, sorry for your feelings dear hipster)
Another product that is a bit more under the radar right now but I think it's cool is Shiftphone. Don't hear many talking about this, unsure why.
My main concern with all these phones is that they are freaking BIG. Especially the Librem 5, it's like a brick. I am one of those increasingly rare people who prefer a small phone. My current one is a Samsung Galaxy S4 mini. I would sell my soul to have a small and "modern" smartphone with fully open hardware able to run LineageOS. With replaceable battery and SD card slot. Sigh.
(Daily reminder that Android OS is *not* free. A good compromise is Lineage OS without Gapps)
Re: (Score:1)
Companies like Pinephone or Fairphone adopted a more nuanced stance and focused on other things such as sustainability of raw material or hardware modularity
I've said this before, if you're the type to upgrade your own desktop computer, you already know where this leads. You'll end up with a really old, beat-up phone with new innards. Modular design makes sense when a few components age out significantly faster than the rest of the device (as in the early era of PC 3D graphics accelerators, where you practically had to buy a newer model for each release of a new game), but for smartphones that's not really the case. By the time you need more RAM, or a faster
Re: (Score:2)
My main concern with all these phones is that they are freaking BIG. Especially the Librem 5, it's like a brick
I can't find any size specifications at all. Sure, it has a 5.7" screen but that doesn't give me width or height, or screen ratio, or bezel depth, or how thick the phone is.
I think I'm ok with a phone a bit larger than the one you're using but I hate the trend of making phones too big to fit safely in trouser front pockets.
Re: (Score:2)
>Shiftphone
Seems to be mostly german-language, and not focused on mainline kernel support.
>they are freaking BIG
Ya, part of the issue being the need a huge battery to even consider being an everyday main device. Maybe future revision and silicon will make a librem 4 possible.
Re: (Score:3)
Android Apps do not run on Linux. Despite the "fact" that Android is Linux.
Re: (Score:1)
Anbox.