Operators: Nokia Would Sell Better With Android 439
nk497 writes "Mobile operators are complaining that Nokia's Lumia line of handsets would sell better if it ran a different OS — or if Microsoft was more willing to put marketing money behind Windows Phone. 'No one comes into the store and asks for a Windows phone,' said an executive in charge of mobile devices at one European operator. He said Microsoft's software worked nicely with PCs and allowed you 'to do tons of cool things,' but few customers knew this. 'If the Lumia with the same hardware came with Android in it and not Windows, it would be much easier to sell,' he said."
False choice (Score:5, Interesting)
The bet thing ms / Nokia can do right now is take their lumps, invest in advertising, and have faith that they have a great product on the shelf. Build it and people will come.
The only concern is that while ms has deep pockets to take a bath for a while, Nokia is more precarious. Acquisition, anyone?
As Steve jobs said, "real artists ship."
A true story (Score:5, Interesting)
This week an employee got a Nokia Lumia 900. He brought it in for us to help him get the e-mail set up. It won't accept self-signed certs. It's a pain in the ass to get set up. He took it back and got an iPhone.
We have people running iPhones, Blackberries, and Android phones all connecting without problems. But you got a WP7 device? Sucks to be you.
DIY (Score:4, Interesting)
Android? (Score:5, Interesting)
The N9 was an unknown home run. Really. They killed it and used most of the parts for the Lumia, but Nokia could have knocked one out of the park with Maemo / Harmatten.
Fools.
Current Lumia couldn't run Android (Score:0, Interesting)
The current Lumia 900 probably couldn't even run Android. It is a single core CPU with 512MB of RAM.
I personally find it funny the Smartphone market is the inverse of the PC market. Android is a resource hungry, WP7 is not. Windows 7 is resource hungry where Linux isn't.
Slashdot community bashes Windows 7 and praises Linux. Slashdot community bashes WP7 and praises Android. Odd.
Wait a bit (Score:5, Interesting)
Wait till October. WP8 will come out and you'll see so much marketing your eyes will bleed. At least that's what my sources say.
Oooh, smart. (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm sure Nokia wants to become Just Another Android maker. That'll sure fire them up.
They're gambling. If they go Android, they'll be dead in 5 years, nothing really differentiates them there. With Windows, they may be dead in 5 years (or 2 ;) but they may also hit a home run and come out way ahead.
Contrary to what neckbeards and fanbois would have you believe, Windows Phone 7 is very nice. The only thing holding me back from WP7 is the shit, circa 2010 hardware. That they need to get a handle on, and soon.
More importantly, the convergence Windows 8 would have with an Atom based phone is very huge. You could buy a phone that could be your phone, but you could then slot into a tablet and have the same phone be your tablet. Then you could slut it into a laptop "shell" and have it be your laptop. Then plug in a keyboard and mouse and use it as your desktop. Same machine, just a little phone you plug into different "shells". For 90% of the population a dual core Atom running at ~1.6Ghz with 4Gigs of memory will be able to handle all their computing needs.
If Nokia can get in on that shit, they're golden.
They're *partially* right, see the *Meego* N9. (Score:5, Interesting)
The Linux based (!=Android) N9 outsells the Windows phones despite being geographically hobbled. Microsoft's Elop is just in the way of letting it happen.
That, and despite having Aegis, the N9 is far more open out of the box. You can do all the "cool things" that the operator is thinking about as well as the things that the operator doesn't want you doing - unlike the more easily boxed-in Android platform.
I work for Orange UK (Score:3, Interesting)
I work in the upgrades department, which means that people buy phones from me. I can tell you from personal experience, no one ever comes on the phone and asks "You got any of those windows phones?" My current ratio is 20 iphones for every 17 android devices to every 1 windows phone. Nobody buys them, and here's the reason: they're all inferior, by a long shot. HTC released the one series of phones a couple weeks back, android to the core. Where are the quad core phones for windows? I dont see them.
Re:A true story (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Customers don't know about windows? (Score:4, Interesting)
hmm...My mother (very non-technical) bought an iPhone as a PC replacement. All she does is e-mail, and she was tired of what a PITA her windows machine was to maintain.
This iPhone just works. credit where credit is due.
In other news... (Score:4, Interesting)
In other news the Lumia 900 is topping the charts at Amazon, selling out there, and selling out at AT&T stores and online. AT&T recently stated that the launch is exceeding expectations, which couldn't have been very low given the giant marketing blitz behind the device. Further, TFA states: "Rival operator T-Mobile says the Lumia 710 is among its most popular phones."
So where's the disconnect? Right here: "Microsoft's software worked nicely with PCs and allowed you 'to do tons of cool things,' but few customers knew this." So wait, you're telling me that people don't know about Windows Phone, so they don't ask for it, so it won't sell, so you don't want to sell it? It's circular. How about you tell people about it, maybe they'll like it, and then maybe it will sell, then maybe you'll want to sell more? People buy what they know, and as AT&T and T-Mobile are showing, if you advertise a device, it will sell. This doesn't say anything about the relative merits of the operating system, unlike what this summary is trying to imply.
Re:Nokia would sell better with Android software? (Score:3, Interesting)
I'm sure that's completely astroturf-free as well. MS has been putting a lot of effort into astroturfing reviews, pimping their phone on developer sites, and even shilling here as far as I can tell. They may be able to buy their way into being a viable mobile OS, but they'll need to get a bit more subtle about it. Like many of heir previous marketing, the current efforts are a little embarrassing.
Re:Android? (Score:5, Interesting)
The N9 barely sold more than the Lumias have. So, no, it wasn't a homerun.
Considering it was dumped on by the CEO of Nokia, had next to no marketing budget compared to the Lumia line, wasn't sold in the biggest markets like the Lumias were/are, and out sold multiple phones, I'd say it wasn't a home run either. It was a freaking miracle and the fact that Nokia isn't running with it is a mistake of legendary proportion.
True choice (Score:5, Interesting)
...but is ultimately a false choice. You can't have android on the Lumia because it doesn't exist that way. [It] is like saying, [the] iPhone would be better with android on it.
Why can't I? The Nokia N900 and N9 both have Android ported to them, I see no reason the Lumia could not be blessed in the same way.
Android has been ported to the iPhone as well, and there are groups working on porting it to the latest iPhone hardware.
I would have loved to have the iPhone 4 hardware back two years ago with that 960x640 screen running Android, it would have been better.
I am not sure how stable the ports are, but it is not a false choice, it is a choice that Nokia made and operators are saying it was a bad choice, fix it.
Nokia Anssi Vanjoki said something to the effect of adopting Android is like Finish boys who "pee in their pants" for warmth in the winter.
Well it seems Windows Phone is like taking some money on a dare from another Finish boy for defecating in your pants...
The bet thing ms / Nokia can do right now is take their lumps, invest in advertising, and have faith that they have a great product on the shelf. Build it and people will come.
The Windows Phone advertisements have been great. I loved the one with the people so distracted by their phones, especially the chick in the black nighty.
Even better is the latest one with Dr. Spaceman telling everyone their previous smartphone was a beta.
The advertising is very clever, the problem is the Windows brand is tarnished, who wants a phone running Windows? Everyone loathes Windows.
On the other hand the iPhone and Android advertising campaigns are fairly blah, but the brands are hot. Everyone wants Apple and knows what the iPhone is. Everyone also knows there is something they call "Droid" despite that being the Verizon brand. If you do not want an iPhone, you get a "Droid" phone, those are the cool ones.
Microsoft should have used the xBox brand, brought out the Phone-X or Mobile-X or something cool. Windows branding was just a bad choice.
As you said we know Microsoft can continue to dump tons of money into Windows Phone.
Android despite being superior seems poised to piss all over itself with confusing hardware releases and crippling skins.
Steve is dead and Apple seems poised to follow.
I am praying Nokia will wipe itself, leverage the Microsoft funds, and use MeeGo excrete some other bodily fluid on the competition.
Re:Nokia rolled the dice (Score:4, Interesting)
I will go out on a limb and say I know. It is going to fail.
They have spent half a billion in advertising in the last 3 years and Windows Mobile has gone from 12% of the smart phone market down to about 4 1/2%. You have seen the commercials. They are dreadful. Do you really think Microsoft is going to put out an ad that makes a phone with WP8 on it the MUST HAVE device?
They have striped off most of the enterprise features, the market they have always sold the strongest in. Now they are going after the consumer market. A market which uses windows, but expects bugs and crashes. The market which has rejected the poop-brown Zune and the laughed the Kin off the market in less than 60 days.
Then the carriers like AT&T will sell the phone with a crappy service plan that will make iPhone, Android, and two tin cans with a piece of string between them all look like better deals.
Then the sales people who want their commissions will do them in. When a customer comes in and asks for an iPhone or an Android, they can sell it, get them out the door, and move onto selling another phone to someone else. They fear having to try and convince a customer that they really want a Windows phone, taking twice as much time to do that. Then the next day when they come back and want an iPhone or an Android, they have to waste their time doing that. So in the time it takes to handle one windows phone, they could sell two or three iPhones.
YMMV but every power user I know that had a WP6 phone and swears by Microsoft Products, have moved onto Android. Any normal person who was convinced to buy a WP7, has returned it within 24 hours demanding an iPhone or Android.
What would make anyone think that Microsoft or Nokia will have a success on their hands?
Re:Invest in advertising? It's free until the 20th (Score:4, Interesting)
Maybe the problem is no one wants a Windows phone?
I was due for an upgrade on my phone (Verizon Wireless HTC Ozone). Walked in to my Verizon store that I've been dealing with for years with the intent on getting a HTC Trophy with Win Mo 7, $29, it was steal and the reviews I saw on the phone were great. When I asked to see the phone (it wasn't on display), the rep literally started laughing and said, "There's a reason you don't see it on display, it's crap and I don't sell my customers, crap."
When I asked him why he thought it was crap, he told me that people only ask for Windows phone due to either, a work requirement or to have the ability to use XBOX Live features on the phone. I stood in neither camp. I just wanted to try something other than Android or iOS.
Needless to say I walked out with a Droid Bionic (I know, I know, I should have stood my ground and asked to see the phone and judge for myself).
If manufacturers and Microsoft have to rely on representation like descrcibed above, they're doomed.
Re:False choice (Score:4, Interesting)
> a hardware AND software package that are differentiated from the competition in some way other than "it's a different color."
Ahahaha, you're a funny one!
Here, check all this WP7 diversity [amazon.com]. Now contrast it with all these identically looking UIs and shapes of Android phones [amazon.com]. Err, wait...
Android has worked so well for.... (Score:4, Interesting)
HTC:
http://www.businessinsider.com/htcs-shares-tumble-cfo-change-samsung-launch-weigh-2012-4 [businessinsider.com]
Motorola
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/01/26/us-motorolamobility-idUSTRE80P23W20120126 [reuters.com]
LG:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-07-28/lg-electronics-profit-falls-33-after-company-falls-behind-in-smartphones.html [bloomberg.com]
and
Sony:
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/btl/sony-ericsson-posts-surprise-loss-in-its-final-quarter/67399 [zdnet.com]
The only mobile company making real money from Android is Samsung.