narramissic writes "When Lenovo's new IdeaPad 'S' series netbooks hit stores in October, U.S. buyers will only be given one option: Windows XP on the IdeaPad S10 (making it not so much a series as a single offering). Meanwhile, people in most markets Lenovo serves, including Singapore, China and the U.K., will be offered both of the company's new IdeaPad netbooks (the S10, which has 10.2-inch screen, and the S9, which has an 8.9-inch screen), and the choice of either Microsoft Windows XP or a Linux OS. Before you start feeling too sorry for yourself, consider the price tag: the S10 will sell for £319 (US$629) in the U.K., but in the U.S. the starting price is $399." Liliputing (a cool site for anyone interested in sub-notebook computing) has posted a few bits on the IdeaPad, including some short videos.
Reading through the summary, at first I thought that the fact that it was only available with XP was supposed to be a good thing. Then I got further and realized it was being compared to XP + Linux, not XP + Vista.
People in countries with higher wages pay more for products. Who would've thought? Maybe that price comparison should factor in the two countries' average incomes.
In other news, rice costs more here than in India. They must think we're stupid.
People in countries with higher wages pay more for products. Who would've thought? Maybe that price comparison should factor in the two countries' average incomes.
In other news, rice costs more here than in India. They must think we're stupid.
Yes, you may be rich, but you are stupid. (And the dipshits that modded you up even more so.) Many hi-tech goods are much cheaper in the US than in most third-world countries. It's about markets, competition, trade barriers, monopolies. Businesses don't calculate what would be a "fair" price related to wages, they just charge what the market will bear.
More likely they think consumers in the US are too stupid to know that both versions of Windows are a POS with respect to something that "just works" without constant diddling or calling your computer friends to set right again. Then there are built in discounts for all the junkware likely to be installed on the US edition.
Actually it's half and half between the greedy company and the greedy government in this case. UK VAT is 17.5%, so taking the figure of $629 means the tax will be $110, leaving a base price of $519. That's still $120 extra for Lenovo, as well as $110 for the government.
The Linpus distro has been around for more than 10 years. I ran it when I was in Taiwan. You can get the install dvd or live cd here:
ftp://ftp.linpus.com/dists/LL96/iso/ [linpus.com]
Pretty shit name. Pretty much the only worse name for a distro I can think of would be "Smegmux", which is horrific - except for the fact that Linpus is real.
Do people still do this with Linux? I have FreeBSD on my ThinkPad, and everything Just Worksâ - all of the drivers are in the tree and I've never had to look for any third-party ones.
Until Dell releases their E series netbooks [slashdot.org]. The specs are promising (please include a 6-cell battery), they look very good, and the price point reflects a "race to the bottom" that I fear Asus's EeePC series has forgotten.
Of course then the dual cores will start coming out later in the year, but I doubt I can wait until then, especially at these prices.
I'm in the same (or a similar) boat, awaiting the rising tide...
The used-to-be-ThinkPad background of the Lenovo laptop line is probably the biggest reason this one is high on the list -- I'm hoping the keyboard on this will be more tolerable than for instance that on the early EEE (I will *not* tempt fate to say it could hardly be worse); the Acer Aspire One is very similarly specced / priced, but I read yesterday that Acer's planning to sell a 6-cell battery for (ack!) $130, which strikes me as a poor ba
The Lenovo 3000 (their first 'consumer' notebook) line does not really reflect the ThinkPad heritage, and as far as I can tell, the intent of the IdeaPad is to make a similarly consumer oriented notebook, but to leave out all of the clunky that they built into the 3000s (mediocre speakers, boring-as-possible design, etc.), so don't be surprised if this offering falls short of ThinkPad-based expectations.
Dell has removed the top line of function keys and tied them as alts to the number row, which should allow them to have slightly more space in the keyboard region and hopefully make for a more pleasant typing experience. I know Wind users and some EeePC users complain about cramped keyboards.
Battery life/cost is absolutely the key issue for me, though.
My netbook purchase is also on hold, but it is more due to the fact that I am still waiting for:
a netbook that will take a mobile phone sim card for web access.
to know if Asus actually brings the SplashTop [engadget.com] to the Eee line,
IMHO both the Dell's and this Lenovo look much better than the Eee's, but that SplashTop would (for me) be the killer feature.
But given the speed with which these new models seem to reach Europe. I'll probably won't be actually getting one before December (when the West celebrates th
I'm looking casually at the netbooks, but would really like one that runs linux and will also serve (maybe with a plugin headset) as a cell phone. Then I could abandon my cheezy att cell phone which has no software worth mentioning on it and run a system where I have the controls, not whatever marketing company has paid the most to the cell companies.
Why is this, does it cost more to ship it to Europe or is it we're supposed to subsidise the US market?
No, its because they think they'll make more profit in Europe charging more, either because Europeans have more money they are willing to throw at this kind of tech, or because its a narrower, richer segment of the market willing to consider the product at all in Europe; its simply a matter of segmenting the market and charging as much as the market will bear in each segment.
Add to that the fact that the European web-market for bargains is terribly fragmented due to:
The different languages;
the fragmentation of the delivery market that makes prices for shipping across many national borders much higher than what it should, say in the US you often get single fee for continental US, but here you get single fee for... Belgium or The Netherlands!
No, its because they think they'll make more profit in Europe charging more, either because Europeans have more money they are willing to throw at this kind of tech, or because its a narrower, richer segment of the market willing to consider the product at all in Europe; its simply a matter of segmenting the market and charging as much as the market will bear in each segment.
Cost probably has next to nothing to do with it.
So this is what Europeans claim these days? Electronics cost more in Europe for decades, even when their economies were in the collective dumper.
From my experience in selling things to people in European countries, it costs quite a bit more to get things from Asia to Europe than compared to North America, not to mention the mountain of languages needed to advertise for a smaller market. Blame your politicians and many languages.
- we're willing to pay more (i.e. we value stuff more) - more regulations (apparently) - tax included in the price (17.5% for the UK price) - company has to pay recycling charge (WEEE) - longer warrenties (by law)
It doesn't cost more to ship TO Europe, it costs more to ship WITHIN Europe. European postal, shipping, and trucking rates are MUCH higher than in the US. So while it costs about the same to get it to the dock on the container ship, it costs a lot more to truck it from the dock to the store.
For electronic products, there are also internationalization costs. Those costs are reduced for very popular languages, like Chinese and American English. Everyone else pays a premium.
While that's basically true for "must have" things, it certainly means I'm less inclined to buy as much stuff. For instance I'd buy a damn sight more games on impulse if they weren't £40-50 ($80-100) on release. As it is I think a lot longer about it and more often than not just decide I've got enough play left in the titles I've already bought. I'd probably spend more money total if games were twenty quid a pop.
Yes, sometimes much cheaper, especially with Amazon marketplace (for CDs anyway, I don't play video games). I feel a bit guilty not supporting my country's/the EU economy though, especially as a UK online record store went out of business because all their customers bought everything from the US.
Please fix your economy:-)
(Although the UK one isn't much better right now...)
Here in Aus, I noticed that just recently, the sub-notebooks for sale in the general electrical shops have had linux removed and now you can only see XP. This has happened in the last couple of months. I'll go with plot.
I feel lucky, having read your post and the sibling posts, that I noticed when the Linux version of the 901 hit shop catalogues in NZ last week (thank you pricespy.co.nz). However, it's kind of conspicuous that any shop that has announced they have any in stock is out of stock the following day. Even the WinXP models seem to sell very quickly. I would like to think that the same thing has been happening in NL and Oz; it may even be true. But Asus' heavy emphasis on the WinXP line is certainly not just bad l
To buy an Asus EEE PC. Not that IBM has a bad reputation with respect to being Linux compatible, but it was nice to have it come installed and just work out of the box.
Ehhh...Lenovo had a chance of replacing ridiculously small touchpads found in all netbooks with a trackpoint, ending up with THE best netbook on the market.
You sound surprised. I've seen so many people praise the Thinkpad "nipple" on my old laptop as an astounding development, yet still buy a Dell instead because they double the RAM for free...
Most of the business class notebooks I've used at my employer - All dells, a few ibms - every one has a trackpoint style device.
To be honest though - the IBMs seem to work better. The ones on the early dells (c600/610) had a manufacturing problem in the keyboard that would make the mouse fly all over the screen after the keyboard heated up from normal use and warped the sensor underneath.
The T42 I'm using now has an awesome trackpoint - and I used to swear by these and never use the touchpad. Since the im
When is someone going to release a laptop with a Cortex A8/9 CPU? If you build it from the same sorts of components as the Pandora console, but a better keyboard, a bit more RAM, and slight bigger screen then you could keep the power consumption and cost really low. Of course, it wouldn't run Windows, but since hardware manufacturers are starting to remember a time when software allowed them to differentiate their products, maybe this isn't a bad thing...
anyone know why they charge so much more in the UK?
I think the level of health and social services provided by the UK government compared to what is provided in the US will give you a clue.
Robert Heinlein created the acronym TANSTAAFL, "there ain't no such thing as a free lunch". I would add NFHCASSE, "no free health care and social services either".
XP (Score:5, Funny)
Re:XP (Score:5, Insightful)
Actually it seems that they think the UK consumers are stupid, given the price hike they are imposing.
Parent
Re:XP (Score:4, Insightful)
In other news, rice costs more here than in India. They must think we're stupid.
Parent
Re:XP (Score:4, Informative)
Yes, you may be rich, but you are stupid. (And the dipshits that modded you up even more so.) Many hi-tech goods are much cheaper in the US than in most third-world countries. It's about markets, competition, trade barriers, monopolies. Businesses don't calculate what would be a "fair" price related to wages, they just charge what the market will bear.
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
More likely they think consumers in the US are too stupid to know that both versions of Windows are a POS with respect to something that "just works" without constant diddling or calling your computer friends to set right again. Then there are built in discounts for all the junkware likely to be installed on the US edition.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Actually it's half and half between the greedy company and the greedy government in this case. UK VAT is 17.5%, so taking the figure of $629 means the tax will be $110, leaving a base price of $519. That's still $120 extra for Lenovo, as well as $110 for the government.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Ignore the Anonymous Coward. He was dropped on his head a lot as a child...which was last week.
not linux (Score:4, Funny)
It *is* Linux (Score:5, Informative)
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Pus: sticky creamy bodily fluid that oozes from sores and spots.
Re:It *is* Linux (Score:5, Funny)
Agreed. I can see it now: Open Sores Linpus
Parent
Re:not linux (Score:4, Funny)
Pretty shit name. Pretty much the only worse name for a distro I can think of would be "Smegmux", which is horrific - except for the fact that Linpus is real.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
this is the distro used in acer low end notebooks, no X, just a black screen. Great for presenting a Windows alternative!.
and I would take that anyday instead of paying for XP / Vista.
Please, note that Dell is only selling Linux pre-installed in "selected" markets...
Black market (Score:5, Funny)
I foresee a black market in Linux system restore discs...
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Re: (Score:2)
My netbook purchase is on hold... (Score:3, Interesting)
Of course then the dual cores will start coming out later in the year, but I doubt I can wait until then, especially at these prices.
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
I'm in the same (or a similar) boat, awaiting the rising tide ...
The used-to-be-ThinkPad background of the Lenovo laptop line is probably the biggest reason this one is high on the list -- I'm hoping the keyboard on this will be more tolerable than for instance that on the early EEE (I will *not* tempt fate to say it could hardly be worse); the Acer Aspire One is very similarly specced / priced, but I read yesterday that Acer's planning to sell a 6-cell battery for (ack!) $130, which strikes me as a poor ba
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
The Lenovo 3000 (their first 'consumer' notebook) line does not really reflect the ThinkPad heritage, and as far as I can tell, the intent of the IdeaPad is to make a similarly consumer oriented notebook, but to leave out all of the clunky that they built into the 3000s (mediocre speakers, boring-as-possible design, etc.), so don't be surprised if this offering falls short of ThinkPad-based expectations.
Re: (Score:2)
Dell has removed the top line of function keys and tied them as alts to the number row, which should allow them to have slightly more space in the keyboard region and hopefully make for a more pleasant typing experience. I know Wind users and some EeePC users complain about cramped keyboards.
Battery life/cost is absolutely the key issue for me, though.
Re: (Score:2)
IMHO both the Dell's and this Lenovo look much better than the Eee's, but that SplashTop would (for me) be the killer feature.
But given the speed with which these new models seem to reach Europe. I'll probably won't be actually getting one before December (when the West celebrates th
Re: (Score:2)
I'm looking casually at the netbooks, but would really like one that runs linux and will also serve (maybe with a plugin headset) as a cell phone. Then I could abandon my cheezy att cell phone which has no software worth mentioning on it and run a system where I have the controls, not whatever marketing company has paid the most to the cell companies.
US Europe price differential .. (Score:3, Insightful)
Why is this, does it cost more to ship it to Europe or is it we're supposed to subsidise the US market?
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
No, its because they think they'll make more profit in Europe charging more, either because Europeans have more money they are willing to throw at this kind of tech, or because its a narrower, richer segment of the market willing to consider the product at all in Europe; its simply a matter of segmenting the market and charging as much as the market will bear in each segment.
Cost probably has next to nothi
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:US Europe price differential .. (Score:4, Funny)
in the US you often get single fee for continental US, but here you get single fee for ... Belgium or The Netherlands!
Of course it's a single fee for Belgium and The Netherlands. Belgium is a province of The Netherlands.
On the other hand, I had expected a single fee for Germany and the two above, since The Netherlands is
one of Germany's Bundeslander.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Re: (Score:2)
No, its because they think they'll make more profit in Europe charging more, either because Europeans have more money they are willing to throw at this kind of tech, or because its a narrower, richer segment of the market willing to consider the product at all in Europe; its simply a matter of segmenting the market and charging as much as the market will bear in each segment.
Cost probably has next to nothing to do with it.
So this is what Europeans claim these days? Electronics cost more in Europe for decades, even when their economies were in the collective dumper.
From my experience in selling things to people in European countries, it costs quite a bit more to get things from Asia to Europe than compared to North America, not to mention the mountain of languages needed to advertise for a smaller market. Blame your politicians and many languages.
Re:US Europe price differential .. (Score:5, Informative)
- we're willing to pay more (i.e. we value stuff more)
- more regulations (apparently)
- tax included in the price (17.5% for the UK price)
- company has to pay recycling charge (WEEE)
- longer warrenties (by law)
At least, that's what /. came up with last week :-)
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Ahhh...so that explains why my cell phone company keeps tacking on extra charges, they know I'll value their service more.
Re: (Score:2)
It doesn't cost more to ship TO Europe, it costs more to ship WITHIN Europe. European postal, shipping, and trucking rates are MUCH higher than in the US. So while it costs about the same to get it to the dock on the container ship, it costs a lot more to truck it from the dock to the store.
For electronic products, there are also internationalization costs. Those costs are reduced for very popular languages, like Chinese and American English. Everyone else pays a premium.
And remember, that's MSRP, not the w
UK getting charged more? There's a shocker... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
You can switch out "end up paying" for "are perfectly willing to pay"...
Re: (Score:2)
While that's basically true for "must have" things, it certainly means I'm less inclined to buy as much stuff. For instance I'd buy a damn sight more games on impulse if they weren't £40-50 ($80-100) on release. As it is I think a lot longer about it and more often than not just decide I've got enough play left in the titles I've already bought. I'd probably spend more money total if games were twenty quid a pop.
Re: (Score:2)
Yes, sometimes much cheaper, especially with Amazon marketplace (for CDs anyway, I don't play video games). I feel a bit guilty not supporting my country's/the EU economy though, especially as a UK online record store went out of business because all their customers bought everything from the US.
Please fix your economy :-)
(Although the UK one isn't much better right now...)
Not just US and Lenovo (Score:2)
Do I see a trend or is it a plot?
Re: (Score:2)
It seems they've been having problems shipping them out. I noticed around a month delay before the Linux version showed up on NewEgg.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Here in The Netherlands it's impossible to get the Linux version of the eee pc 901.
Did you actually found the Eee 901 for sale in the NL already? (Just asking because I haven't seen it anywhere).
Re: (Score:2)
Others show pre order or 6-10 days delivery.
And contrary to last weekend (when I last checked) they are now offering the 20GB Linux version!
I'm pretty sure I saw them in the Tweakers.net price watch but they are not there right now, looks like a container got rerouted :)
Re:Not just US and Lenovo (Score:4, Interesting)
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
So I guess it was a good idea... (Score:3, Insightful)
To buy an Asus EEE PC. Not that IBM has a bad reputation with respect to being Linux compatible, but it was nice to have it come installed and just work out of the box.
Re: (Score:2, Informative)
Lenovo != IBM
No clit?! (Score:5, Insightful)
Ehhh...Lenovo had a chance of replacing ridiculously small touchpads found in all netbooks with a trackpoint, ending up with THE best netbook on the market.
Instead...they're only average/good... :/
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
You sound surprised. I've seen so many people praise the Thinkpad "nipple" on my old laptop as an astounding development, yet still buy a Dell instead because they double the RAM for free ...
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Most of the business class notebooks I've used at my employer - All dells, a few ibms - every one has a trackpoint style device.
To be honest though - the IBMs seem to work better. The ones on the early dells (c600/610) had a manufacturing problem in the keyboard that would make the mouse fly all over the screen after the keyboard heated up from normal use and warped the sensor underneath.
The T42 I'm using now has an awesome trackpoint - and I used to swear by these and never use the touchpad. Since the im
ARM Laptop? (Score:2)
So XP hasn't been discontinued (Score:3, Interesting)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
VAT and basic marketing principles. They can sell for more so they do.
Taxes? (Score:2)
I think the level of health and social services provided by the UK government compared to what is provided in the US will give you a clue.
Robert Heinlein created the acronym TANSTAAFL, "there ain't no such thing as a free lunch". I would add NFHCASSE, "no free health care and social services either".