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64-bit Laptops Reviewed 222

Posted by timothy from the little-fiddly-parts dept.
prostoalex writes "ExtremeTech reviews current mega-notebooks, which are powerful enough to become a desktop replacement. Among the laptops reviewed there's one with 64-bit AMD Mobile Athlon 64 3200+ (2.0GHz clock rate) - the Voodoo Envy m:855."
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64-bit Laptops Reviewed More

64-bit Laptops Reviewed

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  • Somewhere in Cupertino (Score:5, Funny)

    by Jesrad ( 716567 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:03PM (#7552767) Journal
    ... Steve Jobs is choking and fuming because he wasn't able to fit G5s in PowerBooks and sell the "first 64-bit laptops".

  • SparcLE (Score:4, Interesting)

    by mlk ( 18543 ) <michael.lloyd.le ... NoSpAM.gmail.com> on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:03PM (#7552768) Homepage Journal
    I'd really like one of these [corder.com].

    • Re:SparcLE (Score:3, Informative)

      by Qwell ( 684661 )
      Very nice. Sun 64 bit Laptops...I'd buy one too, however, look at the rest of the specs. 500mhz and 256mb RAM hardly makes it worth $3,000.

      • Re:SparcLE (Score:2, Informative)

        by nomadlogic ( 91566 ) *
        the real selling point (at least for the spooks amoung us )is the magnesium case....
        • Um, doesn't every decent laptop have a magnesium (alloy) case these days, or close enough? I mean, I know sony's moved away from there towards carbon fiber (weight over heat conduction), and apple's in aluminum mode (better heat conduction, needs to be thicker)... but other than that, who uses anything else? Dell?
    • Yeah, but I've used their desktop systems. These wouldn't be any faster than my 400 Mhz PII.

      Maybe if they put Linux on it and sold it for $500..

  • First Thought (Score:4, Funny)

    by dirkdidit ( 550955 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:04PM (#7552770) Homepage
    I saw the name Voodoo and about shit myself thinking that 3DFX had come back from the dead. Thankfully, it's just another company using the Voodoo name for their product. However seeing 3DFX come back only to enter into the laptop market, or computer market for that matter, would be humorous. One CPU for adding, one CPU for subtracting.
  • Hate to tell them this, but even my Pentium II 433 laptop is plenty powerful to replace a desktop. The only difference between any laptop and any normal desktop is form factor.
    • And the hard drive. 2.5" hard drives are miserably slow. That's one of the big factors in the laptop machines I've owned, especially for disk-intensive apps.
    • even my Pentium II 433 laptop is plenty powerful to replace a desktop

      Well, that depends on what you're using your machine for, doesn't it? I'd hate to try to play any modern (3d) game on a P2 (or a laptop, really...), or do any serious number crunching, develop in Java or .NET, etc - basically, 90% of the stuff I do for fun. Email and web surfing, sure - almost everything else I want to do with a PC, forget it.

      YMMV of course, but me, I'll take all the power you can throw at me and still complain that it'
      • it's all semantics. Most people use a desktop to surf the internet and write school papers. A gaming box or a development workstation are other subjects. for mom and pop's computer that runs "the internet" and quicken, any laptop will do. you're talking specialized boxes that us geeks take for granted.

    • Guess you don't do the sorts of things I do (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Sycraft-fu ( 314770 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:41PM (#7553057)
      I find even powerful laptops a poor second to my desktop. One thing is 3d agmes. The laptop I have does ok, but still nowhere near what my desktop can do. Of course, there are now better laptops that are as good or better than my desktop, but likewise there are better desktop cards. However the biggest thing is audio work. I finally have audio interfaces that will work with a laptop (firewire and usb), however the drives are still damn slow. So that means it's either a lot of wating, or bringing an external drive. Oh, and you can never have too much CPU for that sort of thing.

      Now to try and use a P2 433? Thanks but no thanks. It'd be faster to save the data, walk it to a real comupter, render it, and walk it back than wait on a complex rendering on that. And forget about games.

      Look, I appreciate that there are people out there who do very little with their computers resource wise. That's great, I'm happy for you. However this silliness of "Well X old box is great and all you need" every time a story comes out on new hardware ought to stop. There are plenty of people who DO use lots of power for work or pleasure and so it is relivant to them.

      The point of a "desktop replacement" laptop means one that is powerful enough in every respect to compete with today's high end desktops. For those that want lots of power, this is of intrest.
      • I can't say i agree with your verdict. A gaming box is not the same as a desktop, and laptops will never be on a par with top of the line desktops since whenever it catches up they come out with newer desktops. Laptops aren't ever likely to be price-competitive in the top of the line range, and will always lack some nice features like SMP and the ability to have a billion drives in there at once. But I'm still sticking with the fact that the majority of users out there (non-geeks) don't need a very burly
      • ATI has a mobility Radeon 9600 Pro, that is enough to play most any game available right now. No need for a 64-bit laptop to play games when you can get one of them.
      • However the biggest thing is audio work. I finally have audio interfaces that will work with a laptop (firewire and usb), however the drives are still damn slow. So that means it's either a lot of wating, or bringing an external drive. Oh, and you can never have too much CPU for that sort of thing.

        I have a desktop replacement notebook P4-2.6GHz (desktop processor) that I use for both 3PS games and audio recording.

        It has a ATI 9000Pro mobility graphics chip and a 17inch widescreen display, so games are

      • GPU (Score:2)

        by phorm ( 591458 )
        Even with a 64-bit powerful CPU, it won't hit the multimedia/gaming market as hard as a desktop PC due to the lack of a comparable GPU (video processor). I have seen some laptops that game decently, but neck-on-neck with similar desktop systems the laptops always seem to fall a bit behind... particularly when you can't upgrade the video hardware easily. Why can't laptops come with a more easily replaced video board (easy like RAM), or perhaps a slot for something akin to the old accelerator cards and keep
      • Unless you have a desknote with a desktop hard drive lappies also have much slower and smaller hd's.

  • huh (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Graspee_Leemoor ( 302316 )
    They keep saying "Oh, these flashy notebooks are now good enough to be a desktop replacement! You don't need a desktop any more! You're FREEEEEE!"

    And then nobody replaces their desktop with them, they just swan round office meetings and expensive cafes with them to show off.

    In 6 months, desktops are even more powerful and laptops have fallen behind again.

    Yawn

    graspee

    • Laptops with desktop chips... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Goonie ( 8651 ) * <robert.merkel@be ... g ['ra.' in gap]> on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:15PM (#7552859) Homepage
      The deal with these "desktop replacement" notebooks is that they are quite large and heavy, with desktop CPUs and physically larger (and thus cheaper and sometimes faster) hard disks and such. 3D graphics aside, they are as fast as desktop machines - much faster than the "thin and light" notebooks that cost similar amounts. They are also fitted with big LCD screens (16 and 17 inch LCD's in some cases) However, they weigh a ton and have batteries that don't last very long at all.

      Personally, I think these things are like road-biased SUVs - overpriced hybrids that by being adequate for two tasks are not very good at either. Gimme a real desktop machine, a thin-and-light (or, better still, an ultralight), and rsync and you've got a much better solution.

      • I've seen some which do nicely by simply getting rid of the battery. I think some are here [desknote.com].For those that really need it, you can buy an optional external battery, but for those just looking for a portable PC+monitor option, these do very nicely.

        No battery means less weight, room for a fullsize processor and/or hard-drive, as well as other components.

    • Bunch of other considerations, too (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Sheetrock ( 152993 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:19PM (#7552887) Homepage Journal
      Cons:
      • One's less likely to drop a desktop.
      • Replacing or adding on components is less of an option.
      • It costs two to three times as much for a feature in a laptop as it does in a desktop.
      • Laptop stuff always seems to fail or act substandard at some point. Desktop stuff does too nowadays but you can replace it.
      • 64-bit is still experimental.

      Pros:

      • A laptop is portable.

      I don't know why people drop serious cash on these things. It's something like $700 for a low-end Dell laptop, which gives you everything you need except serious gaming potential. I'd never make a laptop my main system just because of the reliability factor alone.

    • Re:huh (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      They pack so much power into notebooks and skip out on what's important..the keyboard. The notebook keyboards are smaller than the "standard" size so if you're used to touch typing on a normal keyboard, it's a pain to use a notebook, and they will never be a desktop replacement.

      I find the apple powerbooks to be the most pathetic because the 17" has plenty of space for a normal keyboard and yet it has the same tiny POS. The price difference is huge and I really couldn't care less if my screen is 12" or 17
      • How is that "insightful" - really? It does not take ANY "insight" to form an opinion, about a keyboard...

        But I actually *prefer* laptop keyboards. The shorter keystroke and closer keys is much nicer to me, and I type faster and my hands get less tired. To each his own I guess.... And if the 17inch powerbooks had larger keyboards, you'd pay even more because then Apple would have to have a completely new keyboard manufactured just for that model. As it currently stands they can share between that model
      • That all depends on what laptop you buy.

        The Tecra 9100 that I use full-time has a close to full-size keyboard (around 99% of the IBM desktop keyboard on my desk). Make the machine a bit of a beast that barely fits in my laptop bag as a result at 12.25" W x 10.25" D.

        Touch-typing is pretty easy on the larger laptops. Plus with the little nubby mouse in the middle of the keyboard, I rarely take my hands off the home row. (I do have an external USB mouse, but find it rare that I need to resort to it.)

  • General summary (Score:2, Informative)

    by rf0 ( 159958 ) *
    Basically it looking like this are some kick ass machine in the power area with fast CPU's, Inbuilt RAID good graphics. However they get a bit to warm for comfort and way a tone. Would like to have one, need to be a little bit cheaper.

    Rus

  • desktop replacement (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Martin65 ( 166012 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:07PM (#7552800) Journal
    Hasn't almost every notebook that has come out in the last 10 years been touted as a "desktop replacement" ??

    • Re:desktop replacement (Score:5, Funny)

      by rf0 ( 159958 ) * <rghf@fsck.me.uk> on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:36PM (#7553014) Homepage
      Yes and these are the first to be physically strong enough to replace the desk

      Rus
    • Hasn't almost every notebook that has come out in the last 10 years been touted as a "desktop replacement" ??

      Yeah but they keep getting lighter and smaller, so how am I supposed to fit all the crap on my desk into it? It doesn't even have legs!

    • A lot of them are like that. You can do this or get some P4 3.05GHz notebook but they really aren't all that mobile compared to notebooks that have chips intended for mobile use. I really don't consider putting desktop chips in a laptop much of a good laptop computer, for heat and power consumption reasons.

      I think putting desktop chips in a laptop is often known as a "desknote" and often aren't meant to be used unplugged for very long, not that they could. The assumption is that it is an easy to move ma

    • Re:desktop replacement (Score:3, Insightful)

      by wfrp01 ( 82831 )
      Yup. My laptop replaced my desktop quite a while ago.

      I think there are only two reasons laptops have not completely usurped desktops already. Horsepower isn't one of them. (1) Cost. (2) Ergonomics. The physical configuration of today's laptops doesn't put the screen at the right height, or the keyboard in the right position. I deal with it, but since this is what I do all day long, I do start to worry about being hunched over in such a bad posture all the time. Someone really needs to come up with a

      • I know a number of people who have replaced their desktop with a laptop. Those that don't travel 100% (ie spend most of their time at an office) have a monitor, keyboard and mouse on their desk. Desktop replacement works great when you realize that what you really get is a harddrive with all your junk on it that goes with you, and includes everything you need to use it someplace else.

        A desktop replacement doesn't mean replace all the parts of the desktop. It means you replace some of the parts.

        • Yeah, I know people who do that. I just have a pile of computers plugged through a KVM switch into a 21" monitor - but that's a different story. (My main computer is still my laptop.) I don't really want all the accessories, though. I like my desk space. I don't want to spend the money. I want the same ergonomics at home as I have in the office. IBM has built some prototypes [pcworld.com] that pretty much capture what I'd love to have.

  • More like attack of the power hogs (Score:5, Insightful)

    by TheRedHorse ( 559375 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:08PM (#7552807)
    The Voodoo Envy laptop makes such promises as "3 + hours of battery life(when running real world apps like MS Office and the internet)". It also weighs in at 8 pounds.

    No thanks, I'll pass on that.

    My idea of a laptop is a good mix of power to get things done and portability. I doubt users will be carrying around their 8 pound Voodoo Envy for long.

    Add that to the $3500 price tag and you have an expensive and unusable "laptop".

    • Re:More like attack of the power hogs (Score:5, Informative)

      by Txiasaeia ( 581598 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:27PM (#7552956)
      Right on. Centrino notebooks (like IBM's T40 even) are able to for 5-6hrs without breaking a sweat -- and the T40 is a full-fledged desktop killer.
      • Right on. Centrino notebooks (like IBM's T40 even) are able to for 5-6hrs without breaking a sweat -- and the T40 is a full-fledged desktop killer.

        I use my T30 as a desktop replacement. The only thing I ever use my desktop machine for is as a server. Seriously if you *need* a 64bit CPU as opposed to just gotta have the latest kewl toy you probably need more than this particular laptop provides.

        At this point raw speed is much less interesting to me than aesthetics and integration. If someone would make a

        • So you own a T30 - have you actually picked up an iBook? I could probably use a T30 as a lethal weapon, whereas an iBook is far too dainty for the task. I haven't used a TiBook.

          Can you tell that case longevity is extremely important to me? :)

  • Won't happen (Score:5, Insightful)

    by benja ( 623818 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:08PM (#7552811)

    Come on, there are two reasons to prefer a desktop over a laptop. First, ergonomics: some people just prefer to have a big keyboard and a big monitor and being able to move the two independently of each other. Second, hardware capabilities-- you can fit more into a desktop, and you can upgrade it easily. (Oh, and you don't need to optimize for size or battery lifetime, so things can be cheaper and more powerful.) Neither of these is going to go away. Even if there are some really powerful laptops out there now, there'll be some even more powerful desktops coming up soon.

    That said, there's no reason why laptops can't replace desktops for many kinds of people today. I haven't had a desktop in 3 1/2 years -- nothing new there.

    • Also there's multi display folk. Sure, I could plug another monitor into my laptop, but then the displays won't be the same and one will be a (inferior) laptop display.

      I have three large identical high viewing angle TFTs on my desk (that cost less than half of just one of those laptops) - just couldn't easily be done around a laptop based setup.
    • Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • Re:Won't happen (Score:5, Interesting)

      by mantera ( 685223 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @09:14PM (#7553243)

      Okay; there are big advantages to a "desktop-replacement" laptop over an actual desktop; I now have my second desktop-replacement laptop and I doubt I will ever buy a desktop again.

      First of all, a laptop doesn't take as much space as a desktop; just try to fit a desktop computer into a dining room or a living room, or even a bedroom, it's just damn unsightly and unweilding, let alone unportable, a laptop will fit into these with no trouble at all, and if you wish to you can unplug it in throw it into the drawer.

      A laptop can easily become a portable DVD player. My Sony Vaio has TV out, so I can plug it into the scart to watch movies on the TV. Or, if I watch those foreign or independent movies that no one else wants to see, I switch off the lights, lie comfortable on my side or back, and either unfold the laptop and rest it on its side so it has an angle that'll keep it up, or rest it on my stomach with an empty A4 sized folder attached to it with a thick rubber band, amazingly they're exactly the same width, and the folder both gives it a good angle and sheild the heat from my stomach, and it weighs almost nothing. From this close distance, it feels so much like watching a movie in the cinema, sizewise!!! Now try watching a movie on a desktop... argh, it's an ordeal.

      Then, you can take a laptop to work or with you to a hotel room.

      As for ergonomics, the full-size screen of a sony vaio is immensely comfortable, and a 15" screen is quite generous.

      Any modern laptop will have a processing power that'll last for years. I've upgraded my memory to 400mb. As for upgradeability, I have a Belkin 7-port USB hub, and i can daisy chain that to have 127 USB ports if i want to. I'm quite happy with this combo, the memory upgrade and the USB 7 port hub completely transformed my usage. I downloaded a virtual desktop utility from sourceforge, and now i keep my commonly used Apps running at startup, and my cybershot cam and clie handheld, and wireless gamepad, always plugged into the USB hub.

      What more is there to ask for.
    • but maybe not for everyone ....

      I switched over to only using laptops when my tendonitis became unbearable ... as a result I was able to throw away my wrist brace for the first time in 5 years .... for me at least there's no going back.

      I buy the biggest, fastest laptop around, beautifull 1600x1200 screen, runs linux like a charm - sure I could get something that's 20% faster ... but what would keep my lap warm at night ....

    • First, ergonomics: some people just prefer to have a big keyboard and a big monitor and being able to move the two independently of each other.

      Is this really a big issue? I have yet to see a laptop computer that you can't attach an external display and keyboard to.

      Sure, you have to buy those devices in addition to the computer itself, but that's what, $200-300 more? You bought a laptop, so you can obviously afford to pay above rock bottom for your computer components.

  • Cooling? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by BWJones ( 18351 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:09PM (#7552813) Homepage Journal
    Wow! Pretty impressive. This could be the next ultimate LAN gaming machine, but will I ever really be able to run it on batteries for more than 15 minutes? I know they claim 3+ hours, but.....

    What about cooling? I thought my 12in Powerbook got pretty warm on occasion, but this might have to come with a warning.

    • How often would you run it on batteries? My laptop lasts a little over an 1.5hr, but I've never really had to run off batteries at all except when relocating while running, or once when I was waiting for a kernel compile to finish.

      Mostly, these things just end up being a "portable desktop." You might use them in the car, in which case there are car-kits, but generally most other places you can find power to jack into.
      • How often would you run it on batteries? My laptop lasts a little over an 1.5hr, but I've never really had to run off batteries at all except when relocating while running, or once when I was waiting for a kernel compile to finish.

        I routinely need 3 hrs of battery life on cross-country plane flights. I have looked at Wintel laptops and have owned two in the past, but the Apple Powerbooks seem to give me the best possible battery life so far.

  • If they can fit 64 bit tech (why couldn't they before?) into a laptop, I'd love to see something modular come of this. Get a keyboard that can detach from the thing. A small wireless mouse that hooks on the side. A dock for the screen.

    That way we can have our cake and eat it too. I want a laptop that PAINLESSLY becomes my desktop when I take it home, without having to plug a bunch of crap in.

    When are they going to get it right? Must we do everything ourselves? I mean seriously...look at some of
    • Number one, they already have docking stations, if you don't mind having a separate Keyboard, Mouse, and display (etc). Put it in, good to go. And for the few with Bluetooth enabled laptops, they have bluetooth mice and keyboards, in which case you just plug power and a monitor in and it is good to go.

      Second, when you start talking about a system where the keyboard and display fold out to more friendly desktop dimensions, I think I remember seeing a Thinkpad prototype at some point that did just that, th

  • Still called "laptops", huh? (Score:5, Funny)

    by Frac ( 27516 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:10PM (#7552824)
    The feeling of actually placing an Athlon 64 notebook on your lap is probably not too different from placing an upside-down George Foreman grill on your lap.

    No kids for you!


    • You need something like this [webshots.com] if you want to rest a laptop on in your lap while sitting in a sofa or on a couch. It's a simple do-it-yourself and it doesn't get any better than this. Amazingly my Sony Vaio is the exact width to a standard A4 folder. The folder adds hardly any significant weight, and it will sheild a significant amount of heat from your thighs, as air and carboard, which is still tough enough and durable if good quality, are poor conductors of heat. Also, as long as you don't rest your wr

  • benchmarks not very good (Score:3, Insightful)

    by nomadlogic ( 91566 ) * on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:12PM (#7552840)
    while this is a pretty interesting article, the benchmarks are dubious at best. most, if not all of these apps, are 32bit apps. the OS seems to be win2k, which last time i checked is not a 64bit OS. altho i'd have to admit they are comparing the notebooks themselves and not the chips. in any event they both look like monster "laptops".

  • old news.... (Score:5, Informative)

    by epicstruggle ( 311178 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:15PM (#7552858)
    Anandtech has had a review for a week or so:
    part 1 [anandtech.com]
    part 2 [anandtech.com]
    their conclusion:

    "We recommend this beautiful notebook to those looking to tackle the best of desktop gaming, high-end multimedia users, and even those looking for an alternative to the very popular Pentium 4 desktop replacement notebook, like those that are ODM through Clevo (Sager/Eurocom/Hypersonic). At the moment, this is the only notebook on the market to use a processor from the Athlon 64 family, and we are sure there will be more to follow. We are particularly excited to hear about AMD?s upcoming mobile Athlon 64 processor, which should breathe a breath of fresh air that mobile systems have yet to fully appreciate"

    later,

  • Stupid 1GB memory limit (Score:5, Interesting)

    by X ( 1235 ) <x@xman.org> on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:16PM (#7552872) Homepage Journal
    I have to bitch about the low memory limits on these AMD64-based laptops. All the ones I've seen so far max out at 1GB (actually, many of the desktops also max out in the 1-2GB range, but at least a few are cluefull). This pretty much kills the point of having a 64-bit processor (I guess you still might get a boost with properly tuned integer code).

    Word to the wise: 64-bit apps actually take up more memory, if for no other reason than all the pointers are now 64-bit instead of 32-bit. So your 1GB laptop is going to feel a lot more memory constrained than if it were running 32-bit code. The Intel systems have better power management, and they typically will let you go to 2GB, so for most folks they will actually perform significantly better.

    Methinks this first generation of laptops is essentially for folks who want the bragging rights of saying they have a 64-bit CPU, without really understanding the implications.
    • Um, you may not get the advantages of >4GB physical memory, but you get the advantages of a >2GB virtual address space, which many of us consider a much bigger deal.

      • Re:Stupid 1GB memory limit (Score:3, Informative)

        by X ( 1235 )
        Well, you can get >2GB virtual address space with Intel already (you can get up to 4GB with the right kernel options). Heck, with x86 you can already get >4GB physical memory. That being said, if you are in it for the virtual memory, than you probably don't want to be using a laptop anyway, as the disc performance will be brutal.

        The large virtual memory address space is nice, but your code will likely actualy perform worse than 32-bit code that cleverly uses smart pointers to manage your IO.

        Still, y

  • Ha Ha (Score:4, Insightful)

    by timeOday ( 582209 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:18PM (#7552879)
    From the article:
    (Voodoo specs the unit at 8 lbs, but our test unit weighted in at 9 lbs, 4 oz.).
    Advertisers are such liars. They really have no shame.

  • Wow! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Dark Lord Seth ( 584963 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:21PM (#7552906) Journal

    Useless graphs, over-emphasis on gaming, lots of flashy buzzwords and "benchmarks" that involve nothing more other then running the latest games... Did someone screw up the DNS records for extremetech.com and reroute all traffic to tomshardware.com? No? Damned!

    Seriously, all of that is fun but laptops are usually sold for two reasons*, one being the size and the fact it's easy to hide then. ( really nice if you don't want a desktop case in the middle of your living room ) The second reason is that they are mobile ( really! ) and thus can be lugged around by business people who seem to value their email more then their own lives. What about important factors to people who want a laptop for those two reasons? What about size, weigth, heat during use, screen brightness, stability, etc etc? 98% of the people who buy a laptop care more about the damned thing being lightweigth instead of being able to cram out 0,2543 fps on Halo. If you're going to buy a laptop for gaming you're a bit dense to start with. You can buy a state-of-the-art laptop and before you left the story it's ancient already. Try upgrading the proc or graphics card of your shiny new laptop to run HL3 or Doom4. Try playing for more then six hours without the system stalling due to overheating. Try to install an extra HD or something.

    There, simply put; laptops are nice but aren't made to be used for gaming. Hence why putting a bunch of laptops through a series of benchmarks, aimed at gaming and set up by some people who most likely consider this [alienware.com] to be the most arousing thing on the internet, is very useless. At best.

    * = Working in computer retail business, ( kill me please ) so I unfortunately know what I'm talking about here.

    • In case you haven't noticed companies are working very hard to put out high end components for laptops. Seems to me they'd not be doing this if they did not see a market.

      Let's see: Dell is currently willing to sell me a laptop that has a P4 3.2ghz processor (faster than my desktop by 2x), 2GB of ram (2x more than my desktop), a 1600x1200 monitor (higher rez than my deskop), a GeForce FX Go5200 64MB (less ram but more features than my desktop), a 60GB 7200rpm harddrive (less space but equal speed to my desk
      • ... a GeForce FX Go5200 64MB (less ram but more features than my desktop) ...

        So tell me how this system isn't designed for games ...

        Well, for starters, that shitty GeForce FX Go5200 graphics card really sucks for games. All of the benchmarks say that it performs about equal to a GeForce MX 440, which was lousy at best. So go with the Dell and see how good it is at gaming. If you really want a laptop for gaming at least get an ATI 9600 which should play most current games, but not Doom 3 or Halflife 2

  • Desktop replacement? (Score:5, Funny)

    by djupedal ( 584558 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:23PM (#7552920)
    My desktop is almost 2 meters long and 1 meter front to back. It holds a 24.1" LCD and a 17" CRT (G4 is underneath), an iBook along with a set of speakers and subwoofer. You can also find the normal suite of accessories, external harddrives, digital cameras, hubs, coffee mugs, remote controls, shrunken head pencil holders, etc.

    I seriously doubt all this stuff can fit on top of a laptop, no matter that it is 64-bit. Besides, I can get a new, larger desk if I need, it for a lot less than the price these things are liable to bring.

    You guys are pulling my leg, right? Right? sheesh...

  • I call bullshit on all these 'firsts'. (Score:5, Informative)

    by Cecil ( 37810 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:29PM (#7552966) Homepage
    I've been drooling over Hypersonic's Laptops [hypersonic-pc.com] for quite a long time now, and I find it very hard to believe that either of these companies have the first Athlon 64 laptop (which Hypersonic has had basically since the Athlon Mobile 64 was announced) or the first RAID array in a laptop, which Hypersonic has had for a long time in their Aviator GX8 series.

    Way too many "journalists" see something like that and go "whoa, that must be the first time that's ever been done." without ever looking into it.

  • The real test... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by 47Ronin ( 39566 ) <.glenn. .at. .47ronin.com.> on Monday November 24, 2003 @08:55PM (#7553136) Homepage
    Take these power laptops from all the makers and run them on batteries.. see how fast they can complete their tasks and if how fast they run out of juice. Imagine a Photoshop contest with the Athlon laptop, some other 64-bit laptops, and the fastest 32-bit G4 Powerbook.. UNPLUGGED. Turn off all power-saving features and see which ones actually get work done without dying.

    That's the true test of a mobile desktop replacement.

  • Desktop replacement is a misnomer (Score:3, Funny)

    by GotAnMP3 ( 721156 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @09:00PM (#7553173)
    The advantage of a desktop computer is the ability to open it up and futz with the innards. Want to call your laptop a desktop replacement? Give it an AGP slot so I can upgrade the video card.

    So what if it'll be bulky and power hungry as hell? I want that high speed 3D rendering goodness to last and last.

    At the very least, a desktop replacement laptop needs to synthesize the roar of 8 miniature fans turning. Without that sound, it just seems like an aspect of desktop-ness is missing.

  • there is a market for these things (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Gutzalpus ( 121791 ) on Monday November 24, 2003 @09:56PM (#7553697)
    People who are saying there is no market for these things are people that take their extra space for granted. I live in a very small one bedroom apartment. I have no room to have multiple desktop machines. However, being a computer geek, having more than one computer is an absolute necessity. Given the choice between having 1 desktop or 4-5 laptops in the same amount of space, I'll take the 4-5 laptops.

    A laptop like this is ideal for me - I can finally have a relatively high powered machine and actually play some of the newer games out there instead of having to find the games that are 3 years old because that's the most my laptops can handle...
    • IMO you should be getting one of the rackmount enclosures used for music equipment and a bunch of 1U systems, then. Laptops have a bunch of crap you don't need, like multiple flat panels. A KVM, and one set of input peripherals completes your system. The only tricky part is finding a system with an AGP riser and a video card that will work in a case that small to go with it.

  • Some things the Review Screwed up (Score:4, Informative)

    by Ænertia ( 96622 ) <aenertia@aenertia . n et> on Monday November 24, 2003 @11:00PM (#7554274) Homepage Journal
    1: They didn't do ANY 64bit tests 2: The A64 was running on winxp pro not winxp 64. This would have been a much better comparison. 3: The memory bandwidth description is WRONG. the via k8t800 chipset actually has support for 2 hypertransport busses from the DDR to chip, because the chipset was designed for the opteron not the a64. Meaning that it's chip dependant how much memory pipeline there is.(I wonder if the laptop would handle a64fx chip which would mean an 800MHZ pipeline, the chipset does) This is glossed over (the nforce3 150 on the other hand has only one, because it's designed for the a64).

  • Oh yeah, that's what every guy wants. A laptop that only has enough battery power for 60 minutes (power consumption) and second-degree burns on his member.


  • I don't know how many bit they were, but in the movie "Twister" they had product placement by SGI that featured a supposed SGI laptop. It was ridiculous. They actually had some regular laptop, but they ran a piece of masking tape across the name and hand-wrote 'SGI' on there. Additionally, when a big hail storm hit and they were running for cover, the guy with the laptop held it over his head to shield himself from the falling chunks of ice.. uhh.. how real is that?
  • Sure takes the edge of 64-bitness when big memory addressablilty is stifled by a platform that only takes a MAX of 1Gb of RAM.
    No, Virginia, 64-bit systems aren't faster unless they can use big memory (more than 4GB).

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