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Is Anyone Buying T-Mobile's Googlephone?
Posted by
timothy
on Thu Oct 23, 2008 02:37 PM
from the maybe-one-day dept.
from the maybe-one-day dept.
Hugh Pickens writes "Laura Holson writes in the NY Times that she 'wandered down to the T-Mobile store at Ninth Ave. and 43rd St. in New York City to see what kind of crowds — if any — were lining up to buy the new T-Mobile G1 which went on sale Wednesday' and saw no lines out the door, no crowding at the counter, and a complete lack of crowds. The iPhone appears to still be the gold standard and Etan Horowitz writes that the G1 'doesn't do a great job showcasing its potential. It isn't as intuitive as the iPhone, and it may take average users a while to figure out basic and advanced shortcuts and features' and 'may appeal more to techies who value open-source products and don't mind a somewhat steep learning curve.' Part of the reason for slow interest may also be that T-Mobile's 3G high-speed data network won't be up and running in many cities until the end of the year."
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Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
Probably because T-Mobile and Google don't have the Apple hype-machine/blogosphere/rumor sites going insane over unreleased products?
Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
Probably because T-Mobile and Google don't have the Apple hype-machine/blogosphere/rumor sites going insane over unreleased products?
Yup, because google doesn't know anything about advertising ...
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:4, Insightful)
My point is that it is beyond advertising. Apple doesn't need to anything (like not comment on a rumor) and it's the talk of the world.
Plus I've never seen an ad the Googlephone...
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Re:reputation (Score:5, Funny)
They don't do mondain and they don't do what's been done before.
I fail to see what the villain from Ultima I [wikipedia.org] has to do with this...
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Re:reputation (Score:5, Funny)
And that's his greatest strength.
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Re:reputation (Score:5, Funny)
I think the average person, when they hear the expression "Google Phone", are going to think "innovative" and "creative".
I think they're going to think "Beta".
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:4, Insightful)
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
Yes but Google releases everything as beta first, and limits the rate at which people start using things (see: gmail invites). I suspect this is the "beta" gPhone, which will be continuously refined for a while until they are ready with the real deal. That's when the ad blitz will start.
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
Probably because T-Mobile and Google don't have the Apple hype-machine/blogosphere/rumor sites going insane over unreleased products?
Without a doubt. However, it's not like these phones have reviewed exceptionally well.
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Interesting)
I thought Walt Mossberg [allthingsd.com] was pretty positive about it, and the gyst was that this really is a handheld computer. I have neither a G1 nor an iPhone, but I'm watching them closely. I'm a math teacher, and I would love to have a handheld Wifi-equipped computer to just slide under an overhead projector and demo stuff to my students. (Yeah, as if they don't all already have iPhones! Actually, only a few do.) The G1 lacks enough storage for me, but the data plan is more attractive. The iPhone has the storage but the data plan is a potential nightmare. Maybe an iPod Touch... Anyway, I'd expect the G1 and iPhone to converge in terms of features and data plans over the next few releases.
At any rate, I love seeing real competition in this space, AND neither is Microsoft. I expect the success of the iPhone and G1 to show my students and colleagues that there are alternatives to Windows.
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Insightful)
The G1 lacks enough storage for me, but the data plan is more attractive. The iPhone has the storage but the data plan is a potential nightmare.
Actually I prefer that the G1 has less storage and a microSD slot. MicroSD cards are very inexpensive so it's easy to increase the storage capacity of the device. When flash capacities have doubled (as they have been every year), it's easy to buy a new microSD card for $30, but it's impossible to increase the storage on your iPhone. This only works if your hardware and firmware support the larger microSD sizes, but the G1 supports SDHC cards and firmware updates so it's fairly future proof.
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Funny)
They claim it two posts above yours.
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Needs a better name (Score:5, Funny)
A better name would probably help, too.
Customer: "What do you have to compete against the sexiness of the iPhone?" ...
T-Mobile: "We have just the thing... a GOO-Phone!"
Customer:
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Informative)
Maybe it's also because instead of buying it from the store a lot of people bought it online?
In fact take a look at this [androidcommunity.com], where G1's were sold out when T-Mobile let people order it online.
I ordered one from T-Mobile, and a lot of my friends have as well. Granted, we're developers, but now that my other non-developer/non-geek friends and family have seen my phone, they want to get one as well.
And honestly, I don't even know where this guy came up with the "steep learning curve" and the "basic and advanced features". People I gave the phone to play with didn't seem to have a hard time figuring out how to get around. It's not like you need to be a rocket scientist to figure stuff out. Yeah, it's geared to the developer community but that's only reflected in the openness of the OS and the SDK, and not the phone or the interface itself. It's not like you don't need to drop into the commandline to work this phone.
I also think that instead of relying on hype and drooling at the mouth fanboys, Google is just relying on people buying the phone, using it, and talking to their friends and family about it.
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Interesting)
My point is that Holson is missing a lot of background information.
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Re:Because they're not Apple (Score:5, Interesting)
Checking around here, most dealer stores had their initial orders pre-sold, and I could have bought one yesterday at 5pm. But, they warned me, they epxected to sell out today. Company stores were different.
And just so you know, I think iPhone fanboyz and G-Phone freaks are different. I'll be buying a G-Phone, and I don't need to stand in line for three days, bring a solar-powered cappuchino machine, or have my picture taken for Gizmodo. There's a Starbucks next to the T-Mobile store, I have a day job and can't take the time off, don't need to be 'first', and hey, it is really just a FREEKIN PHONE, OK???
whew.
ps- I hope someone will make an SSH client for it. I could dig a real keyboard to compile a kernel while I'm in the car...
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probably because it's not *innovative* (Score:4, Insightful)
Probably because T-Mobile and Google don't have the Apple hype-machine/blogosphere/rumor sites going insane over unreleased products?
Er...or it could be that the G1 just isn't innovative or unique.
Seriously, what's unique about it?
Apple slowly wedged their foot in the door with iTunes and Quicktime and has built upon each success. Meanwhile, Google has been the 500lb gorilla, but given away every product they offer (and made it work on every other cell phone) and there's no compelling reason to buy a Google phone.
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Re:probably because it's not *innovative* (Score:5, Informative)
Um, no. The G1 has a touch-sensitive (capacitative) touchscreen just like the iPhone.
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Re:probably because it's not *innovative* (Score:5, Insightful)
I believe it's not multi-touch however. I think that was the intended criticism.
Where the hell do you get that? No, the intended criticism is that isn't sold by Apple, that's all that matters to these people.
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Re:probably because it's not *innovative* (Score:4, Insightful)
The target of Android is technically not the end-user. The target are the phone-makers. Google wants to ensure that there is something out there that will always be able to run Google Apps.
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Why would they hype it? (Score:4, Insightful)
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I love it (Score:5, Interesting)
I pre-ordered my G1 and I love it. It's a marriage of a Blackberry and the iPhone and while it's true that there are some differences and a few quirks at first...you get over them real quick. It really is pretty easy to use.
I've started playing with the SDK too and they have it integrated nicely with Eclipse and it's really a very nice set up.
I'm a big fan.
Re:I love it (Score:5, Funny)
The important question for you is this: Why do you know what your ex-girlfriend did yesterday? It's time to move on.
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Re:I love it (Score:5, Funny)
Because she wasn't his ex until yesterday when she dumped him for the phone. That's why I'm not getting one; I just know my computer would do the same. Oh fickle love.
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T-Mobile's network is useless (Score:4, Interesting)
I don't care how good the phone is. T-Mobile's coverage is too sparse to make it attractive.
No wonder it's not selling (Score:5, Funny)
Check out this story where Neil Gaiman tries to buy one [neilgaiman.com]. Indeed it literally doesn't seem to be selling. As in: you cannot obtain one even if you wanted to.
so would you prefer thousands of complaints? (Score:5, Informative)
Check out this story where Neil Gaiman tries to buy one [neilgaiman.com]. Indeed it literally doesn't seem to be selling. As in: you cannot obtain one even if you wanted to.
He was turned away because the vendor was in an area where TMobile decided there wasn't strong enough coverage.
Yes, he's able to fire up Gmail in the store, but that doesn't mean coverage is good enough for their metrics, or the G1 might have a worse antenna. Or maybe Google said "we don't want you to sell this phone where people won't be able to get adequate speed."
Company decides where to market phone for best reception, film at 11.
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My co-worker got one (Score:5, Informative)
My co-worker and I shot out to the T-Mobile store on 6th ave and 46th street (or around there somehwere) in Manhattan yesterday and although the place wasn't crowded, every person in there was buying one (about 4).
We got a unit at work to play with a couple months ago and I was pretty impressed with it even though it was a little buggy (touchscreen doesn't always register and sometimes registers in the wrong spots) and flimsy feeling. the problem is the hardware feels like a shitty toy. The screen is great, but the keypad and trackball don't feel nice and the sliding mechanism doesn't feel solid. Handling it, I feel like I'm gonna break it.
The thing about the iPhone is that it's not only has a very shiny UI, but the hardware is made of metal and feels sturdy and reliable. It doesn't feel like a toy like the G1 does.
I'm waiting for an android phone that's compatible with the AT&T network to be released before I make the switch. I haven't been fully satisfied with the iPhone (mostly, I don't like the calendaring application AT ALL), but it beats the AT&T Tilt and the blackjack2 in terms of usability, in my opinion.
Re:My co-worker got one (Score:4, Insightful)
In reality, every phone feels like a toy if you don't like it.
It's 100% subjective, and reflects on nothing. Some people with big or small hands or fingers feel certain phones feel like a toy. Does that mean they do to the other 99% of the users of said device? No. Does that mean it "feels cheap?" no.
Meanwhile, the apps on this thing alone motivate me to want to get it. I'm trying to sell off my E61i to get a G1.
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gee, what could the reasons be here? (Score:5, Insightful)
1. People don't even know if they'll have jobs next week, would they really be taking on an expensive new phone and plan?
2. There's no absolute media saturation and frenzy over the G1. Apple is very adept at building their marketing campaigns into beasts like self-sustaining fusion reactions that produce more energy than they consume, like firestorms sucking all the oxygen out of the city. Media that doesn't even want to report on tech will end up reporting on the craze surrounding the tech.
3. The G1, while building on the success of Google, isn't coming with quite the same mac/ipod buzz that the iPhone had going with it. Again, this goes back to 2, Apple is building upon the wave of successful hype of previous products.
I hear that RIM is trying to improve upon their berries given all of this competition from Apple and Google. To that I say GREAT! The more competition the better. The last berry I used was a hell of a product but RIM has been floundering for a while now. I want to see them recapture the mojo instead of flaming out like Palm.
Personally, I don't know which phone I'll end up getting. I'm no longer working in a capacity that requires a company phone so I'm not likely to have another berry unless I change jobs. The iPhone is incredibly seductive but the data plan sucks and I don't like it being closed-architecture. I don't yet know enough about the G1 to know whether it'll be a good fit but I like what I've seen so far.
I know why I won't buy it (Score:5, Insightful)
It isn't available here in Finland, so... Yeah.
But well, I've never understood that culture in USA... Comparing products based on the day that they come out. Just like with movie theatres there, the most used way to determine if movie is successfull seems to be how well it sells during the first weekend: Before anyone has had the chance to see it and tell others if it is good or not.
I wouldn't think much based on just these days. Also, the "Steeper learning curve" and "Shortcuts might take some time to get used to..."... WTF? Does ANYONE think of those things when buying a phone? "I would buy that but the learning curve is too steep..."? I would understand if it was "The user interface is horrible" but this?
Poor Service (Score:5, Interesting)
I won't be buying one, because any phone from T-Mobile is no longer in the running for me. They are my current provider, but (unlike every other provider) their service area near me has been shrinking rather than growing. Places I had service last year are now consistently "emergency call only" areas. We're talking about a good quarter of the state. On top of that, they had the nerve to send me advertising text messages telling me how they've expanded their coverage. I am currently contract free, so if another provider comes out with a good Android phone, I'll look into it, but who cares how good it is if it has no service.
Got mine.... and love it! (Score:5, Interesting)
Battery life doesn't seem to be stellar, but the great aps and easy installation make up for it.
Love the smooth keyboard -- which includes a number bar!
The integrated GPS is kick ass.
The only downside is that the network is a little spotty -- but I knew that when I got it.
Prior to the G1, the only options were to continue pining for an Iphone to replace my Blackberry or pay the termination fee with my existing carrier and then switch. Now I'm glad I made the switch and didn't blow the money on terminating my existing T-mobile service.
No months of hype == no long lines (Score:4, Interesting)
Google didn't hype the G1 for months, unlike Apple. And, Google didn't have a launching pad product, aka the iPod.
No lines??? (Score:4, Insightful)
Of course not, if you ordered one a couple of months ago you would already have it. Instead of madly lining up at some retail shop to buy your new piece of hip candy (and then still have to take the damn thing home to activate it), you can order it and wait for it to be delivered to your door.
Apple does make good products, but they also are very adept at engineering a crowd to harness for marketing purposes.
1.5 Million Pre-orders (Score:5, Interesting)
Marketing Problem? (Score:5, Informative)
I was in line during the day of the pre-release, where the only place you could get one in the world was at the T-Mobile store in the SoMa area of San Francisco. The release was set at 6:00pm on Tuesday, October 21, 2008.
When I got there at 6:10pm, the line only extended down the block. It took me approximately two hours before I got to the front of the line. In the mean time, I held a few conversations with the others by me, and it appears that the consensus was: there's not enough apps for the G1 right now - maybe it'll take off in a year or so, but there will be better phones for the platform by then.
I met a large number of *NIX users there who might have very well been other slashdotters. It appears to be that the G1 is in a niche market right now. People don't seem to care that it can be modified, but rather that it has less features and apps compared to the iPhone. Instead, most of the people in line wanted one because of its relatively cheap cost and stability.
Also, the lack of lines may be attributed to how well T-Mobile has handled the release compared to Apple. People were processed in less than three minutes, and there were eight CS reps working at the same time. In fact, the line moved at approximately the speed of a security screening. If the process was done similarly at other stores, there wouldn't have been much of an opportunity for a line to form.
I was an iPhone user (Score:5, Informative)
Pros of the G1:
1. Usable QWERTY keyboard - texting heaven
2. 3G speeds in my area are ~900kbps
3. The browser feels faster
4. I can upgrade/replace the battery
5. I can put in an 2/4/8/16 gig micro SD
6. Speaker sounds louder
7. Free wifi at T-mobile hotspots
8. Voice activated dialing works decently
9. It's from T-Mobile and I don't have to deal with the evil pricks that are ATT/Cingular (was an ATT customer for almost 7 years)
Cons:
1. The battery life sucks at the moment
2. Dearth of apps (naturally)
3. The phone gets warm after a few minutes of usage
4. Not a con for me but no stereo bluetooth
5. Complete lack of accessories from T-mobile
6. Gmail goes down, you might have issues from the tight integration (forgot pattern to unlock phone? input your gmail info)
7. The phone has a cheap plastic feel and doesn't feel as solid as the iphone (especially when opening the back panel).
8. 3G coverage is spotty
Both weigh and measure about the same (comparison with a first gen iphone). Both are quad-band.
Re:I was an iPhone user (Score:4, Interesting)
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I bought it (Score:5, Insightful)
Not sure what they mean about a non-intuitive interface. What more freakin' intuitive than a physical keyboard?
Is "pinching" intuitive before somebody shows it to you. But I guess it's just an article of faith that anything not done by Apple must, by definition, be less intuitive than the Apple version.
On the useless but cool front - I made a skype-out call from the G1 over my wifi network today. Try that with an iPhone. Granted, it's a phone, so sure, what's the point. But it's good to know that even if I terminate my cell plan, the phone isn't a useless brick.
Re:I bought it (Score:4, Insightful)
By the time the iPhone actually went on sale, everyone in America had seen the commercials showing them the pinch and other basic features that once you think about them they feel natural and you just 'know' how to do other things you've never been shown. If I didn't read slashdot (and google news), I wouldn't know what the G1 is, and I still have no idea what it looks like or how it works. Mind you, I don't care about Android, but its not suprising that no one else does either, no one else knows about it outside the tech world.
And seriously, Skype ... on your cell phone ... are you fucking kidding me. You've got a phone with protocols that are FAR better than the crap Skype uses for talking, the cheap bastards who want to use Skype on their cell phone are probably too cheap to buy a phone that can run it. Using Skype on a cell phone is about the silliest thing I've ever heard of, cell minutes are cheap, stop being such a techie that you look like a dumbass to the rest of the people in the world. If you terminate your plan you're worried about having a use for your phone? Do you not realize how silly that sounds?
'I'm gonna buy a cell phone, then terminate my phone plan, but thats okay because I can also run this app that makes my phone act like a phone when I'm around certain radio signals, and the price difference is great because in 8 years I'll have saved up the money from using skype to pay for the phone.' Just think about that before you respond.
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Id buy it (Score:4, Insightful)
Stop calling Apple products intuitive (Score:5, Insightful)
The iPhone is NOT any more intuitive than any other phone. It is not intuitive to use two fingers spreading in and out to zoom in and out. It is not intuitive to change the screen orientation by rotating it if it only works when holding the unit somewhat vertical. (That drove my daughter nuts until I explained how gravity works with the phone.)
The iPod is NOT any more intuitive than any other music player. It is not intuitive to have to return to the now-playing screen to change the volume. It is not intuitive to run your finger around a circle to change volume or select items. And not being able to edit play lists is just inexcusable.
The Apple was NOT any more intuitive than any other computer. Dragging the CD to the trashcan to eject it was not intuitive. People exposed to Windows did not deal well with the lack of right click and that silly Apple key until shown what they were for.
Intuitive means directly apprehended or instinctive. Something is not intuitive if basic features require demonstration or having to read the manual. Apple products have some cool features that once exposed to can make them easier to use. That isn't intuitive, it's user friendly.
Re:Stop calling Apple products intuitive (Score:4, Insightful)
Yeah, the "intuitive" meme for interfaces bothers me a lot these days. Apparently now it means, "This works the way (the market dominator/my other stuff) works." It's got nothing to do with whether or not the interface is usable out of the gate for an arbitrary user with arbitrary experience.
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Re:Stop calling Apple products intuitive (Score:5, Insightful)
A better term might be "discoverable". If you can play with it and figure out what it does without consulting the manual or asking someone else, then it has high "discover-ability". Combine that with "consistent": knowledge of one part of the system helps you to use other parts of the system that you haven't tried yet. Those terms together get at what many people mean when they say "intuitive"
From the time I've spent playing with demo iPhones and Touches the interface was pretty easy to understand. When you turn the phone sideways, it goes into landscape mode and it pretty much does that everywhere, so it is consistent. It is also consistent with what I would expect in the real world; if I'm orienting the screen sideways, I probably want to use it so the long edge is the top now. You can also learn that pretty easily just by trying it, so it is also discoverable. When the iPhone breaks consistency, like the lack of a landscape keyboard in some apps, people complain, which indicates that consistent behavior is part of what we think of as "intuitive".
Zooming in and out works by pinching and pulling, which isn't very discoverable, but it makes sense a certain amount of real-world logical sense ( I'm stretching a photo to make it bigger, squishing it to make it smaller). Once you learn it, you can try that same action in other places and it will do pretty much what you expect (discoverable and consistent). Of course, you can get away with some of those things on a media player because many operations aren't really destructive; you can play with the device to see how it works. If stretching a word processing document ripped it in half and deleted it, that would probably be a different story.
I've tried the Android emulator a bit, so I have some familiarity with the interface. I think I could pretty much figure out how to do most things I'd want to do with it, but it definitely has the feeling of a computer interface shrunk to fit a phone. I think it is discoverable, but from playing with it and reading the reviews, it isn't consistent, so it ultimately isn't as discoverable as the iPhone is.
The iPhone software, on the other hand, feels more like it is purpose-built for the phone; like a part of the device as opposed to running on it. Even the main screen evokes a keypad layout like a touch tone phone rather than the desktop metaphor that Android shoehorns in.
Ultimately, I think that is Android's major challenge. It can't easily become part of a device out of the box because it could run on a range of hardware, while the iPhone software only has to support the iPhone and can blend smoothly with the hardware experience. This is in some ways more important than the relationship of Windows and OS X to their various hardware since we have certain expectations about how a phone should perform that PC's don't have. There is potential for Android to become more discoverable and consistent; personally I'm going to wait for the next Android phone to see if it has improved.
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Re:Stop calling Apple products intuitive (Score:5, Insightful)
Obviously the user interface bothers you. But really, you think there is a better phone interface out there? I guess everyone who owns an iPhone must be a fanboy cause the only ones I have heard who don't like them are techies who want a shell prompt for their phone, everyone else seems to love it.
Running your finger around a circle to change the volume is not intuitive? So ... is rotating a number to change the volume not intuitive?
Everything you are ranting about is because you've been trained, poorly, by some other piece of software to do something silly. Except maybe the CD to the trash can, I'll give you that one, but the rest of your arguments are just silly, the fault is your expectations based on other bad designs.
Most of the rest of the non-techie world, and now days a very large portion of the techie worlds seems to think Apple does a pretty good job on UI design, while I realize a lot of these people are what you would probably consider 'stupid', as a general rule when you disagree with everyone else, its generally (not always, but generally) and indication that you have it wrong, not them.
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Re:Yeah well... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Mini Review (Score:4, Funny)
but how can you screw up SSH?
Ask Debian.
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