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Wireless Networking Hardware Technology

Irrigation Controller Stolen, Wirelessly Rescues Itself 160

wooferhound sends along an amusing piece about thieves who got run over by technology and never knew what hit them. "A Rain Master Eagle-i Irrigation Controller recently stolen out of a housing development just outside of Tucson traveled nearly 80 miles before rescuing itself. The smart controller is now back in place on the wall where it was originally pinched... In this day and age, something that may look passive like an irrigation controller may not be so passive. The thieves didn't realize they were removing equipment that features 2-way wireless communications via the Internet. Three weeks later, the unexpected happened. The Maintenance Supervisor noticed a signal coming in from the stolen controller. He thought it was kind of odd that it was up and running... Whoever had stolen it had plugged it back in."
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Irrigation Controller Stolen, Wirelessly Rescues Itself

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  • by belthize ( 990217 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @08:52AM (#24057785)

        Phoned home.

    Belthize

  • Product Info (Score:5, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 04, 2008 @08:59AM (#24057831)

    For those who are wondering WTF this thing is, here's the product page. [rainmaster.com]

    "The RME Eagle combines evapotranspiration (ET) technology with its already intelligent design providing a variety of ET-based scheduling features that will reduce water usage, save time and money, and optimize the efficiency of water resource allocation for any irrigation application. Additionally, an optional communication card provides central control capabilities via The Internet!

    "The "RME Eagle" can measure flow and take corrective action for station breaks, main line failures, or unscheduled flow. It supports either normally open or normally closed master valve operation, pump operations independent of the master valve, cycle and soak or conventional programming, and a flow totalizer to monitor total water used. The "Eagle" watches your prestigious landscapes 24 hours a day, 365 days a year, providing insurance and protection from catastrophic field related failures."

    All it doesn't do is yell at the kids to get off your lawn.

  • by alohatiger ( 313873 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @09:02AM (#24057843) Homepage

    Any electronic device that cost several thousand dollars will be expected to be wireless and have GPS. You'll be able to login and check to see that your air conditioner, refrigerator and water heater are still at your house.

    Instead of being caught with incriminating lock picks and bolt cutters, crooks will have their anti-GPS and anti-wireless equipment trip them up.

    • by jamesh ( 87723 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @09:14AM (#24057917)

      Any electronic device that cost several thousand dollars will be expected to be wireless and have GPS.

      And for devices under several thousand dollars, i'll make a fortune selling fake antennas and stickers that say "this device is protected by gps and will alert the authorities if it is moved", and "smile for the camera" :)

      • by rjstanford ( 69735 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @09:31AM (#24058067) Homepage Journal

        Any electronic device that cost several thousand dollars will be expected to be wireless and have GPS.

        And for devices under several thousand dollars, i'll make a fortune selling fake antennas and stickers that say "this device is protected by gps and will alert the authorities if it is moved", and "smile for the camera" :)

        Actually, that's not a great idea. At least down here (and if this flies in Texas I'm sure it flies everywhere in the US), you can be held seriously liable for claiming that you have surveillance video when you don't, if a crime occurs on your property. It may sound odd, but it actually makes sense, since businesses were basically creating a false sense of security for their customers.

        • by jamesh ( 87723 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @09:59AM (#24058255)

          you can be held seriously liable for claiming that you have surveillance video when you don't

          Ah. You need one of my other stickers then... try one of the following:

          "These labels were not placed here by the owner of this equipment"

          "By reading this label, you agree not to bring any action against the owner of this equipment for any claims, false or otherwise, made by this or any other label on this equipment."

          "This label and any others attached to this equipment is void in Texas and any other state with stupid laws."

          "this device is not protected by gps and will not alert the authorities if it is moved"

          "smile for the fake camera"

        • That's the stupidist thing I ever heard to sue someone over. It can't possibly be illegal to put up fake cameras - they do this all over the world.

          In London where they have a number of cameras monitoring the streets, many of the cameras are fake and look exactly like the real cameras. It's simply not financially possible to have real cameras everywhere, but the appearance of cameras keeps the idiots in line.

          Only in Texas could you possibly be held liable when some other person is the one committing a cr

          • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

            by nomadic ( 141991 )
            That's the stupidist thing I ever heard to sue someone over. It can't possibly be illegal to put up fake cameras - they do this all over the world...Only in Texas could you possibly be held liable when some other person is the one committing a crime. Geez.

            I think you're missing the point; first of all, civilly liable is not the same thing as criminally liable, so it's not "illegal." And you're only going to be civilly liable in circumstances where there's some sort of duty existing between the person wh
            • I fail to see how the tenant could successfully sue the apartment building owner. What grounds? Sure he created a false sense of security *maybe* but he certainly didn't create an unsafe condition. It's no more unsafe than if the fake camera was not there.

              If a corner store gets robbed do the customers sue the owner if there was no tape in the machine to record the crime? No. Next you'll have cops suing victims for wasting their time because they shouldn't be living in the high crime area in the first plac

              • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

                by punissuer ( 1036512 )

                I fail to see how the tenant could successfully sue the apartment building owner. What grounds?

                False advertising. The tenant may have chosen to rent from that landlord based partly on the assurance that the cameras provided some security, but the landlord bought fake cameras to save money. The landlord failed to provide a service for which the tenant paid every month.

                • by Dan541 ( 1032000 )

                  False advertising. The tenant may have chosen to rent from that landlord based partly on the assurance that the cameras provided some security, but the landlord bought fake cameras to save money. The landlord failed to provide a service for which the tenant paid every month.

                  Since when are landlords responsible for security systems?

              • by nomadic ( 141991 ) <`nomadicworld' `at' `gmail.com'> on Friday July 04, 2008 @12:57PM (#24059919) Homepage
                fail to see how the tenant could successfully sue the apartment building owner. What grounds? Sure he created a false sense of security *maybe* but he certainly didn't create an unsafe condition. It's no more unsafe than if the fake camera was not there.

                Well the difference if the fake camera was not there is that the tenant would not have relied on it in that case. Anyway to show negligence you have to show a duty existed, the defendant breached that duty, the breach was a proximate (which doesn't mean only) cause of the injury, and the injury caused damage to the plaintiff. The law mandates that landlords take a reasonable effort to ensure the safety of their residents. In a high crime area, a fake camera might not be considered "reasonable," especially if a similar crime happened before and the fake camera didn't do anything to prevent it.

                You can't just open up a building, advertise for tenants, and then assume your sole job is to collect the rent.
          • by Firethorn ( 177587 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @11:32AM (#24059153) Homepage Journal

            I think the idea is sort of like the laws against false advertising. If I'm in trouble and run to where I've 'seen' a camera, so actions against me can be witnessed, I'd be pissed if it turned out to be fake and there's no video evidence of my being assaulted.

            But, approach it from a different angle - the very appearance of security cameras deters crime, maybe. On the other hand, odds are fake cameras will eventually be found out, then the public will be operating on a false sense of security. Not good.

            Oh, and going by crime statistics, the cameras in London don't do much good - you're worse off than NYC! I've read that cameras, at most, shifted crimes. Many times the perp would commit the crime right in front of the camera counting on the fact that a random cop or victim looking at the camera isn't going to be able to identify him - there's just too many faces. Thus the push for face recognition software. Then that gives you hurdle 2- you now know who perp Y is, but now you need to find out where he's living this week and actually send an officer around to arrest him. Police departments everywhere seem to fall down a lot on the second one. As studies have shown, actually following through(even if you 'don't have enough resources') tends to disproportionately reduce crime - after all, that purse snatcher, burgler, or mugger is very likely have committed crimes in the past, and commit more in the future if he's not caught and subjected to an effective correction*.

            *Chosen over punishment. I don't care as much about the retribution portion as the 'make sure they aren't going to do it again'.

            • I think the idea is sort of like the laws against false advertising. If I'm in trouble and run to where I've 'seen' a camera, so actions against me can be witnessed, I'd be pissed if it turned out to be fake and there's no video evidence of my being assaulted.

              Not disputing that you would be dissapointed or upset, but that's not grounds for suing someone.

              If you were mugged by a guy with a fake gun, do you sue him for giving you a false sense of peril?

              • by Detritus ( 11846 )
                Maybe not, but the criminal law treats it as armed robbery, even if the gun is a fake. This actually happened to me. I was robbed by a group of thieves armed with a gun designed to only fire blanks. They ended up facing the same charges as if they had used a real gun.
              • If you were mugged by a guy with a fake gun, do you sue him for giving you a false sense of peril?

                legally speaking, there's no difference in the charges between robbing a bank with a fake gun rather than a real one.

                So I imagine that I could.

                That's why, in order to protect the effectiveness of security cameras, you want as many of them real/operational as possible.

        • by merc ( 115854 )

          Seriously, what the HELL is wrong with Texas and all the stupid laws. The legislature there must have their head firmly injected into their rectal cavities.

          I thought the recent Texas law enacted that requires PC repair shops to have PI licenses was the stupidest law I'd heard in a long time but this is about just as stupid (albeit not quite as impacting).

      • It's funny, but these things ARE computers.
        Just look at it: http://www.rainmaster.com/eagle_description.htm [rainmaster.com]
        Anything that looks like that ought to have internet, GPS, and a tractor beam.

        Secondly, TFA is a PRESS RELEASE from Business Wire.

        The only real news here seems to be the bumbling apathy of the Cochise County police department.
        It might have been a funny story, but they never caught the thieves.
      • And for devices under several thousand dollars, i'll make a fortune selling fake antennas and stickers that say "this device is protected by gps and will alert the authorities if it is moved", and "smile for the camera" :)

        No, no. The right approach is that mastered by numerous PC manufacturers: add a slot for the GPS, but don't include it, and then mark it as GPS ready. The poor sod who buys it, is then left to discover that the marketing department does not have the same definition of 'ready'. Because of t

        • by jamesh ( 87723 )

          I see this with customers pabx systems all the time. They are sold as 'VoIP Ready' so the customer thinks all they have to do is attach a few handsets to their network, but 'VoIP Ready' means that the PABX will accept a VoIP card, which will cost a whole heap of $$$, and the salesman does nothing to enlighten them before the sale.

      • Phony alarm signs are just stupid. A few years back, I was walking by a house near me and saw water coming out of the garage, down the driveway, and into the gutter. Nobody answered the door. They had a big sign for an alarm company, so I called the number on the sign. The alarm company told me they'd never had service there. One window had a sticker for a different alarm company. That, too, was phony. They even had a "Protected by ELECTRONIC alarm system" sticker, the one you can buy at Radio Shack.

        • Phony alarm signs are just stupid.

          If the house had recently been painted and there was one of those little "painted by" advertising signs in the yard, would you have called them too?

          Do you know what would have happened if they really had an alarm monitoring contract?
          As soon as you were done talking to them, they would have called the water utility too.
          Just because a phone number is posted on a sticker in a window doesn't mean the owner of the phone number has ultimate responsibility for the house.

          • Do you know what would have happened if they really had an alarm monitoring contract?
            As soon as you were done talking to them, they would have called the water utility too.

            Well, that would accomplish what he was trying to do. It's not likely the people put a sticker on the house with the water utility's phone number, and that's not something most people have memorized or programmed in their phones either.

            • Well, that would accomplish what he was trying to do. It's not likely the people put a sticker on the house with the water utility's phone number, and that's not something most people have memorized or programmed in their phones either.

              And if there were no stickers at all, he would have been in exactly the same situation.
              At least this way, the home owners gain some benefit.

        • by jamesh ( 87723 )

          I'd be pretty unhappy if my security company revealed over the phone to an anonymous stranger that I did or didn't have service with them... even if the caller did claim to be standing out the front of my property and claiming to see water pouring from the garage.

    • by Dareth ( 47614 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @10:10AM (#24058355)

      Say for instance your grandfather has a pacemaker with wireless.

      $>ping grandpa
      No Host Found.

      Oh no, GRANDPA!!!!

    • by SuperKendall ( 25149 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @11:21AM (#24059037)

      Brings a new twist on the old "Is your refrigerator running?" prank call:

      "Running? Let me check... why yes, about 30MPH it seems on 6th avenue. Thanks for the heads up!"

      • Frink: Why it's the AT-5000 Auto-Dialer. My very first patent.
                      Aw, would you listen to the gibberish they've got you
                      saying, it's sad and alarming. You were designed to alert
                      schoolchildren about snow days and such. Well, let's get
                      you home to Frinky. Hope your wheels still work, bw-hey.

  • by jollyreaper ( 513215 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @09:08AM (#24057887)

    Thieves will now have to block the antennae of their purloined plunder. But how's this for an idea: geo-locking hardware like this? "Here's your GPS coordinates. Stray outside of this area, you stop working." Thieves will soon learn that taking something like this will brick it.

    I also like the idea of equipping cars with wireless stuff like this. The owner reports it missing, the car starts reporting its location to the cops and they can nab the perps.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Satnavs already do this. Turn the device on, enter the PIN. If you don't know the PIN, you can't use the device. If you forget the PIN, you can reset it, but only at the device's home location.

    • I also like the idea of equipping cars with wireless stuff like this. The owner reports it missing, the car starts reporting its location to the cops and they can nab the perps.

      They already do. Most traffic police cars in the UK now have a device that can home in on a stolen vehicle that's transmitting it's location, allowing them to track it down again.

    • by u38cg ( 607297 )
      OnStar? This chain of thought is all very well, but what about when the cops decide to track your movements - just because they can? Or what about the bad guys learn how to work it, then use it to track down expensive vehicles in places where they can carjack with impunity?

      This sort of risk should be mitigated with insurance, not technology. The insurance industry is well placed to figure out what kind of technology actually works and which doesn't.

      • by olyar ( 591892 )

        OnStar? This chain of thought is all very well, but what about when the cops decide to track your movements - just because they can? Or what about the bad guys learn how to work it

        And what if they decide to start using their guns to shoot people - just because they can? Or what if the bad guys get guns?

        This sort of risk should be mitigated with insurance, not technology.

        The same goes for this case. People just need to get better life insurance policies.

        BTW, I am aware that this argument is a prime example of several logical fallacies. I'm honestly not trying to argue with your point - the parallel just struck me as funny.

      • by jamesh ( 87723 )

        but what about when the cops decide to track your movements - just because they can

        You don't work for the recording industry do you? They use the same sort of argument all the time. Just because something can be used for illicit purposes (be it tracking devices in cars or p2p filesharing software on your computer) doesn't mean that that's all it will be used for, and doesn't mean that it should be made illegal.

        If the cops or the bad guys want to track your movements they'll covertly stick their own tracking

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by phillymjs ( 234426 )

      "Here's your GPS coordinates. Stray outside of this area, you stop working."

      Shopping carts at some of the supermarkets around here work kinda like that. They have some kind of invisible fence thing around the perimeter of the parking lot, and if you cross it with one of the store's shopping carts, the wheels lock up.

      Like a previous reply to you mentioned, some GPS units do this... unless they are powered on in the 'home location' they require a PIN.

      I also like the idea of equipping cars with wireless stuff

      • Shopping carts at some of the supermarkets around here work kinda like that. They have some kind of invisible fence thing around the perimeter of the parking lot, and if you cross it with one of the store's shopping carts, the wheels lock up.

        Big deal. Where I shop one of the cart's wheels is always locked up.

      • by Sponge Bath ( 413667 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @10:39AM (#24058629)

        ...cross it with one of the store's shopping carts, the wheels lock up.

        Nothing to worry aboot.
        Bubbles will just get Julian and Ricky to shoot the wheels out of that dirty cocksucker.

    • They can just remove the battery or hit the reset switch to remove the Wireless reporting.

    • GRM? (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Comboman ( 895500 )
      But how's this for an idea: geo-locking hardware like this? "Here's your GPS coordinates. Stray outside of this area, you stop working." Thieves will soon learn that taking something like this will brick it.

      GRM...Geographic Rights Management.
    • "Here's your GPS coordinates. Stray outside of this area, you stop working."

      Deep within the bowels of the European Union, the century-long plan to destroy American Air-Conditioning is abandoned as the conspirators realize that the U.S. will destroy their own A.C. units in large numbers as GPS hiccups.

    • by Rudolf ( 43885 )

      I also like the idea of equipping cars with wireless stuff like this. The owner reports it missing, the car starts reporting its location to the cops and they can nab the perps.

      It's already done:
      http://www.lojack.com/ [lojack.com]

  • by IronWilliamCash ( 1078065 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @09:14AM (#24057921)
    If he could control the thing remotely, I would have sent a signal to flood the crops during the night, that way the next morning the theives would have had a nasty little suprise :) Then you go in and get it back.
    • by 0xygen ( 595606 )

      Yes, however that would be just like sending e-mail back to the return addresses on spam.

      Chances of the owner being involved with the theft? Slim to none.

      In fact, if you RTFA, this is actually pointed out.

      • Yes, and if you RTFA, when the cops questions the owner who *claimed* to know nothing about it, the device suddenly dissapeared from that house. Obviously she contacted who she bought it from and they removed it.

        Unless you are really stupid, most people who buy highly discounted expensive stuff should at least suspect it is stolen. Like who really thinks that guys selling speakers out of a van are a legitimate business?

      • Buying stolen goods is often an illegal act regardless of the level of ignorance in the buyer.

        "Gee, I just bought this great stereo for half price from that nice man in the white van." Most buyers know that what they are buying is hot.

  • by v1 ( 525388 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @09:18AM (#24057957) Homepage Journal

    how they will visually identify the stolen property, call it in, and then leave and expect it to just stay there until they get back with more badges.

    I've read about this scenario repeatedly, though this is the first time I've heard of it being voluntarily returned later. Being that stupid about it they didn't deserve to get it back.

    Putting on the "wild speculation" hat, I'd say that since they were obviously tipped off, that it was likely whoever was sent out to identify the item was told to leave by his commanding officer, who then tipped them off "we're coming back in 30 minutes and it better not be there when we return". Gotta love how things like that work in rural towns. Any competent law enforcement would have left the stolen property under observation until the badges showed up.

    • by gfilion ( 80497 )

      how they will visually identify the stolen property, call it in, and then leave and expect it to just stay there until they get back with more badges.

      I guess that they actually waited to get a warrant for entering the property. The only evidence that they had was that some dude said that the controller was his, that's not enough to make probable cause [wikipedia.org], IMO.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by rjstanford ( 69735 )

      Any competent law enforcement would have left the stolen property under observation until the badges showed up.

      This sounded like a rural county law enforcement division. These guys often have very limited resources - sometimes only a few officers for an entire county. Tying one person down to keep an eye on a few thousand dollars of stolen merchandise seems like a pretty poor decision, IMO.

      For that matter, its entirely possible that someone noticed the cop getting close and panicked. Or, as you say, was

      • Putting the value of the equipment aside, I would say that having an officer remain on site for a few hours in order to bring a thief (grand theft, remember, not just petty theft) to justice would be worth the use of his time (barring another priority or emergency situation that required the county's full resources).

        That said, I suppose if you replace "irrigation controller" with "laptop", it does sound unlikely that police would try too hard to catch the culprits. Still, if it were my laptop, and I knew w

    • by Migraineman ( 632203 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @09:50AM (#24058195)
      I was totally let-down by the end of the story. This was a perfect example of amateur sleuthing, which should have resulted in a thief being apprehended at the bottom of the hour, only to mutter "And I would have gotten away with it too, if it hadn't been for you pesky kids and your ubiquitous ad-hoc wireless networking."
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by catmistake ( 814204 )

        You can expect this kind of quality detective work from any police department. This is why Justice wields a sword and not a scalpel.

        • This is why Justice wields a sword and not a scalpel.

          Wow, just where do you live?

          Our officers of the peace went to firearms ages ago. A scalpel?

      • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

        My money is that the story is a fake.
        It reads like a fluff piece and mentions the company by name too many times. Even better, since the story does not talk about any arrests, the alleged crime is untraceable. No one can go around and ask questions if no police records exist.
        My guess would be that someone decided to disconnect a controller for a few days, filed a missing report , then connected it back and then went out and wrote this story up about it.
    • by jamesh ( 87723 )

      Gotta love how things like that work in rural towns.

      Would you expect it to be any other way? Being a cop in a rural community must be a really tricky job - having to book the same people that you'll probably be sharing a pub with at the end of the day.

      • I dunno, they probably get ostracized anyway, what with their cranberry juice predilections and all.

    • Putting on the "wild speculation" hat, I'd say that since they were obviously tipped off, that it was likely whoever was sent out to identify the item was told to leave by his commanding officer, who then tipped them off "we're coming back in 30 minutes and it better not be there when we return". Gotta love how things like that work in rural towns. Any competent law enforcement would have left the stolen property under observation until the badges showed up.

      It is infinitely more likely that the controller w

      • by v1 ( 525388 )

        That it was returned, and not simply disposed of, indicates the thieves felt they were as good as caught. Otherwise why risk returning it which would seal the case. Voluntarily returning something you've stolen is an act of desperation.

  • by RichMan ( 8097 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @09:22AM (#24057999)

    What concerns me is that someone knew the police were coming for the unit. This was almost a petty theft case, sure significant to some but not really a major crime issue.

    What if it were a more serious case? The police here should be really concerned about their information leaks and integrity of their investigation system.

    • by dfm3 ( 830843 )

      This was almost a petty theft case, sure significant to some but not really a major crime issue.

      What if it were a more serious case?

      Actually, according to TFA the unit was valuable enough that this case was considered to be grand theft. IIRC, in the US theft of an item over $500 is usually considered a felony.

  • Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • by speedtux ( 1307149 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @09:59AM (#24058253)

    Stolen equipment gets recovered via cell phone signals all them time. The whole thing sounds like a PR fluff piece.

    The real tidbit of interest here is this:

    Smart controller 'internet' technology, first patented in 2003 by Rain Master, automatically adjusts water usage via a 2-way wireless communication system.

    The company has a patent on controlling the sprinkler system remotely. This kind of patent is stupid and evil.

    • by digitig ( 1056110 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @10:19AM (#24058419)

      The company has a patent on controlling the sprinkler system remotely. This kind of patent is stupid and evil.

      You're only jealous because you didn't have the idea of taking out a patent on remotely controlling a sprinkler system by means of a manually operated rotary or other valve within the fluid delivery system at a position other than the sprinkler apparatus itself (=a tap at the other end of the hosepipe).

  • ad (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Tom ( 822 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @10:27AM (#24058483) Homepage Journal

    Anyone else read the article and thought it smells a lot like it was written by the PR department of the company that manufactures those things? Lots and lots of talks about the great and unique features of the device, very little details on the alleged crime.

    If this were ZiiTrend, I'd vote 70:30 that the story is fake and PR.

    • by ashitaka ( 27544 )

      Sounded like that to me as well. I was instantly reminded of the incessant Alarm Force ads on the radio promoting their "Patented Two-way Voice Communication".

      Manly-sounding voice: "This is the Alarm Force Central Station. Identify yourselves immediately!"

      I can imagine the usual response:
      "Piss off. By the time the cops get here we'll be long gone."

  • Viral Marketing (Score:3, Insightful)

    by ICA ( 237194 ) on Friday July 04, 2008 @10:53AM (#24058781)

    I'm surprised I only saw about one other comment pointing out that this whole thing is most likely fake. At best, it was a real story that was published by marketing department for the parent company.

    I hope it was at least something real that they chose to embellish and propagate. In either case, it all feels rather sleazy.

    If you have doubts - read the story again and notice how many times the article has to mention the company that makes it by name, and how often they have to tout the various features of the device.

  • From My Fake Version Of The Article:

    The Maintenance Supervisor of of the Moisture Farm noticed a signal coming in from the stolen controller. Interestingly it was coming from the Sandcrawler of the Jawas who had just sold him a bum R2 unit...

  • Small World, x2 (Score:3, Informative)

    by cmholm ( 69081 ) <cmholmNO@SPAMmauiholm.org> on Friday July 04, 2008 @05:36PM (#24062137) Homepage Journal

    I lived in Continental Ranch for 5 years in the late '90's. The developer previously used solar panels to power the irrigation controllers for the common areas, but most (panels and controllers) were stolen by the time I moved on. I moved to CR from Simi Valley. I had no idea Rain Bird had a plant there. Prolly after my time.

    BTW, belated kudos to thousands of screwed senior citizens for the fine Continental Ranch flood control system Charles Keating [wikipedia.org] built with your nest eggs, before his house of cards fell down.

He has not acquired a fortune; the fortune has acquired him. -- Bion

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