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Asus To Phase Out Sub-10" Eee PCs
Posted by
Soulskill
on Sun Nov 02, 2008 02:16 PM
from the taking-the-sub-out-of-subnotebook dept.
from the taking-the-sub-out-of-subnotebook dept.
jeevesbond writes "The Register reports that Asus president Jerry Shen has revealed his company will be phasing out all sub-10" Eee PCs. According to Shen, the 'standard' netbook next year will be a 10" model with a hard drive running XP. Shen also said XP is outselling GNU/Linux on netbooks by a ratio of 7:3. This is somewhat contrary to news from the UK earlier in the year that GNU/Linux units were out of stock while XP machines sat unsold. Are Brits more open-minded than the rest of the world when it comes to choosing an OS?"
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Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:5, Interesting)
Rolling two stories into one post, my friend bought an Asus Aspire with linux. The other day she asked me what the NewEgg return policy was. It took me a while to pry it out of her that she couldn't get on her university's VPN in Linux. I installed the linux client for her. Point is, her first impulse was to return it rather than attempt the learning curve.
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Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:5, Interesting)
Small, light and efficient, eh?
I decided to revitilize my grandparent's old Celeron 500 w/ 128MB of RAM with Xubuntu. I couldn't install it with the live CD, but I got it on there. And it ran like crap. Very, very slow and sluggish...I was kind of suprised So I was about to throw it out, and figured, what the hell, and put XP on it. I turned off the Fisher Price UI, and it ran a HELL of a lot better than Xubuntu. Enough that it turned from unusuable to usable. I was stunned.
So I see no reason for XP to be any slower than a modern version of desktop Linux, unless the UI is REALLY stripped down. But any Atom-based computer will handle XP as well as Linux without a sweat.
And MS did do a deal..but it was very front door, not back door. They slashed the cost of XP for netbooks to something like $30-$40. Linux was used first because of cost, but the cost advantage is much smaller now. And the manufacturers and retailers believe that XP will produce fewer support calls and reduce return rates (whether or not they are correct is up for debate), justifying the extra cost. I'm sorry, there is no secret MS conspiracy here for you to be paranoid about. They did their normal thing...they saw Linux gaining marketshare, figured out why (cost), and they compensated.
Also, it's Acer Aspire. Asus's netbook line is the Eee.
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Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:5, Informative)
Ouch. I have a machine with those exact specs here, and there's no way on earth I would try Xubuntu on it. In my experience, Xubuntu is faster and lighter than the "normal" Ubuntu desktop, but it's not really a "legacy PC" distro to me. My normal choice for legacy PCs has been Puppy Linux, and it has *never,* *ever* let me down in that capacity. It's always fast, does a wonderful job supporting dialup modems, old video cards, and has "wizards" included that help you do common setup tasks.
It works well on modern machines, too; When I couldn't get Renoise working without JACK on my Ubuntu laptop due to high CPU use, I booted into Puppy and it ran fine.
In my experience, Xubuntu gets mentioned here a lot by people who have just heard of it, and not tried it.
With that said, the web is a different place now, with high demands. An afternoon's worth of footwork should net you a *much* better used machine for grandma and grandpa, for free or $10. Try Craigslist, local mailing lists, doctor's offices, etc.
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Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:5, Insightful)
Xubuntu is a joke of a lightweight distro. It's Ubuntu with Xfce and Gnome. (yes, effectively both)
What you needed is something like a Debian install designed for it (think LXDE) or something like Ubuntu-lite. I think PCLinuxOS has an LXDE-based edition.
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Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:5, Insightful)
Don't take this the wrong way, but if you can't get Linux to run on a legacy PC, it's almost certainly a lack of effort on your part.
People seem to get confused by the fact that it's technically possible (and IMO relatively easy) to strip down Linux and make it run on old crap hardware. They seem to get the idea that Linux distros are aiming for that old crap hardware, so Linux will run on them out of the box. That's not true, and with few exceptions all of the popular distros are aiming for the relatively new PC market. So yes, you CAN strip them down to run on a given machine, but it's not likely to work well out of the box. You're going to have to do a little work. There are distros where the base install is meant for old hardware, but Xubuntu isn't one of them.
Trying to run Ubuntu or Xubuntu on an ancient crap machine is like trying to run the latest greatest version of Vista on it. I'm sure you can do it, but you'll need to spend some time tweaking things. The advantage of using Linux for old machines is that Linux makes that tweaking easy and offers more tuning knobs than Windows.
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Xubuntu requirements (Score:4, Informative)
http://www.xubuntu.org/get
ie wrong distro. Xubuntu is a medium-weight desktop. Not quite as bloated as gnome/KDE/Vista. Try DSL?
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Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:4, Funny)
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Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:4, Insightful)
Yeah, it's really weird. The whole net book thing was appealing to me because of the tiny form factor. The 8.9 is perfectly useable as a travel machine. Any bigger and you may as well buy a standard notebook.
Not least because you can get one with better specs for not much more cash. The size is a major selling point.
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Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:4, Interesting)
As mentioned in another post I originally wanted a 901 with Linux but since it wasn't available I did end up - against my better judgment - buying a 1000H. At the time I was fairly convinced I would regret this since before I had a 7 inch version and loved it for it's tiny size. But I have got to admit that - as it turned out - the 10 inch version is pretty much ideal. I think it's got more to do with keyboard than with display. The 9 inch versions simply have a keyboard that is too small - whereas the 10 inch is just exactly a size where you can type without having to readjust a lot coming from a normal laptop. Anyway - I do love my 10 inch "netbook" even though I consider it more like a real laptop and do just about anything I would have done on my trusty old thinkpad before.
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Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:5, Insightful)
.
It could never be because the screen is too small, the keyboard is too small, and the Linux OS is unfamiliar and unwanted.
I installed the linux client for her. Point is, her first impulse was to return it rather than attempt the learning curve.
Of course it was.
Most of us don't have an all-knowing geek to call on for free, on-site, support. The Google search that returns 15,000 hits is of little help to the novice.
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Insightful? Bull shit. (Score:5, Insightful)
There's nothing insightful about your comment. In fact, as near as I can tell, it's completely wrong.
Allow me to summarize the original post.
1. Attempted foreign language install. Never worked.
2. Installed Blackberry charging drivers - never worked.
3. Found out customizing shell involved editing text config files.
4. Got VPN working - turned out to be unstable.
5. Old issue - installing Ubuntu on 2GB flash dive. Failed with indetermine problems.
And so, here you come with your "insightful" reply, and claim that his whole post is that linux isn't Windows, and that apparently he doesn't want to know linux.
The only way your post makes any sense is if you think he's an idiot because he wants linux to work, and that just isn't "linux".
Moderators: Please don't drink and moderate.
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Re:Well "Works With Linux" is a feature to me (Score:5, Interesting)
Don't forget:
3. Being told that to get foreign language support, you need to purchase yet another package called "Microsoft Office Proofing Tools" and/or "Microsoft Office Multilanguage Pack", depending on what version of Microsoft Office you have. If you have a mix between different office versions, you may need both. And if you want the UI language changed too and not just the ability to use the language in your documents, you need Single Language packs in addition to the multilanguage pack.
Language Packs (Office 2007+) are $25 for single languages or $200 for the multilanguage pack.
Proofing Tools (Office 2003-) are $30 for single languages or $120 for the multilanguage pack.
Per user.
Not only is it costly, but it's a jungle to figure out exactly what you need.
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Or... (Score:5, Insightful)
... did they overship Linux pcs by a ratio of 6:4?
Linux on Netbooks (Score:5, Insightful)
How many people buy the XP models and subsequently install Ubuntu or some other Linux distro though? For reasons of better RAM or Drive or battery option availability in the XP bundled version of the machine.
Re:Linux on Netbooks (Score:5, Informative)
I bought the Linux version partly for the sake of supporting the Linux product, and partly for the sake of the slightly lower price. But now I'm starting to kick myself, wishing I bought the XP version and installed Linux. It's kind of a Catch-22. The best Linux netbooks available have XP installed on them.
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Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
You have to be a complete tool to buy the XP model and then install linux. In a few of their models you get a worse spec machine for paying the windows tax. 8GB less solid state storage.
It's a shame they are phasing out the sub 10" models though. I feel the 8.9 was the sweet spot for netbooks because it's small as possible, but has a "modern" screen resolution without which websites are too cramped these days.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
I also made it dual boot and spend most of my netbook time running Linux.
Re:Linux on Netbooks (Score:5, Insightful)
.
Not enough to make a difference.
Never enough to make a difference.
The OEM system install has been the gold standard in the home and SOHO markets for thirty years.
You have a warranty.
You have a service contract.
If anything goes wrong, it is someone else's problem.
The geek thinks like a hobbyist. Everyone else is simply out buying a small appliance - and no more interested in installing an OS than in building a bread machine from a kit of parts.
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news not contrary (Score:5, Insightful)
Who'da thunk the ratio would be so close?
Re:news not contrary (Score:4, Insightful)
Lets be real here, all a ratio better than 1/10 Linux to Windows says is the devices are attractive to geeks. That's cute and all - give Asus a cookie, but it doesn't speak for consumer acceptance of Linux.
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Good idea (Score:5, Insightful)
XP outsells Linux, guess why (Score:5, Informative)
I sat posting this on my XP-equipped EeePC 901. Why XP? Because I can't find the Linux version at any store around my area. Whenever I ask whether they'll offer the Linux versions, store managers invariably answer "we won't offer them, they won't sell, people are afraid of non-Windows machine". Can you say chicken and egg?
Oh and yes, and another thing, the Linux GUIs offered on netbooks are designed for retards. That's also perhaps geeks don't buy them. When I have a minute, I'll install Debian on mine, but even if I had managed to find the Linux Eee, I'd have zapped the original distro.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Can you say chicken and egg?
Chicken and leg. That was easy.
http://dotancohen.com/heb/wallashops.html [dotancohen.com]
Re:XP outsells Linux, guess why (Score:5, Interesting)
Oh and yes, and another thing, the Linux GUIs offered on netbooks are designed for retards. That's also perhaps geeks don't buy them.
I have an eee PC 901 with Linux. First, the 20 GB SSD is a sweet deal compared to 12 GB with Win XP. Second, the Asus has made excellent job with Xandros Linux to provide easy-to-use, usable-with-everyday-tasks operating system. When I bought my eee PC, I was confident that I'll install Unbuntu eee immediately to it, but now, after a week of use, I actually like the preinstalled Linux. It provides everything I need - and I consider myself a geek - and it has a terminal, which is great, because I don't necessarily need any fancy GUI systems, the shell is enough for most "geek stuff" for me.
So, in my opinion, the preinstalled Linux is fine for non-geeks. And that's the target audience. But I enjoy it also, and if I some day find it "retarded", I can always install some other Linux distribution and be happy with it. And so can any one geek, who don't like the default installation. So, I don't get your complaint actually at all.
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ubuntu-eee.com (Score:5, Informative)
Oh and yes, and another thing, the Linux GUIs offered on netbooks are designed for retards. That's also perhaps geeks don't buy them. When I have a minute, I'll install Debian on mine, but even if I had managed to find the Linux Eee, I'd have zapped the original distro.
Have you considered Ubuntu Eee [wikipedia.org], based on Ubuntu Netbook Remix?
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Re:XP outsells Linux, guess why (Score:4, Informative)
True, but you get a larger SSD with the Linux machines (20 GB vs 12 GB for the XP models).
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Not a stunt; easy to use (Score:5, Informative)
Disclaimer: I'm the product marketing manager for the Xandros desktop that runs on the Eee PC.
I can assure you that this is not an MS stunt. At Xandros we've worked hard with Asus to make the Eee PC easy to use by non-techies. The simplified interface is easy to navigate on a small screen, apps downloaded through the Eee Download capability "just work" in a few clicks without enduring long download times or frequent updates, and there's good interop with Windows. Kids especially find the Eee PC fun and intuitive to use.
Obviously there's a strong techie interest in the platform as well, so I'm interested in the discussion here. Got some constructive suggestions about how you'd like to use your netbook? I'd love to hear them. You can email me at jordan.smith(at)xandros.com.
Thanks!
Jordan
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XP outsells Linux because... (Score:5, Informative)
I searched the computer retailers of Melbourne for 3 weeks before I found one that had a Linux 901 in stock, and bought their last one.
Memo to the geniuses of retail: customers can't buy if you don't have stock.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:XP outsells Linux because... (Score:5, Interesting)
He wasn't alone.
There was a large number of people trying to find Linux 901's on Whirlpool. http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1011353 [whirlpool.net.au]
Many ended up doing what he did, and got the XP one even though it wasn't really what they wanted.
Part of the reason for lack of stock was thought to be that the Linux version was supposed to have a larger SSD (to make up for the cost of the XP license). But they were allegedly in short supply.
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Contrary to what? (Score:4, Insightful)
Contrary, huh? Out of stock could mean the supply was low. Who in their right mind would _overestimate_ sales of Linux clients?
Sitting on shelves could mean they shipped more than enough. Without knowing how much of each shipped, WTF is the point? Guaranteed, they shipped assloads more with XP than Linux. We just throw supply out the window and pretend demand for Linux is uber high here??
Look, Linux needs to take off on its own merits, not with silly twisted theories on Slashdot where things are cheerier than they really are. Linux & OSS are going to start getting some black eyes if you all keep pretending it's something it's not.
30% is not bad market share at all (Score:3, Insightful)
Considering that Linux has just about zero advertising, and that people who choose it are embarking on something new and different to them. No, 30% is not bad at all. It will only go up as Linux gets tweaked to run better on this kind of hardware.
Re:30% is not bad market share at all (Score:4, Insightful)
I think it's a case of companies not wanting to pay for support (with XP they probably go to MS for help) and they lack confidence to keep at it.
What do people do with netbooks that really need Windows? Gaming is pretty much out of the question and let's face it the system is too small to be a main system so how many apps do you really need on it and that can't be found on Linux?
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eee 1000 (Score:4, Interesting)
I would buy one with Linux installed if given the choice, but would immediately install ubuntu's netbook edition or eeebuntu or whatever seems to be the going version of the moment.
I prefer the smaller sized netbooks (Score:5, Informative)
It's about Europe, not just UK (Score:5, Funny)
Are Brits more open-minded than the rest of the world when it comes to choosing an OS?
Microsoft's Lock-In strategies have stopped working in Europe, thanks to European Commission's efforts to make Microsoft play by fair rules.
Linux versions are hard to get in some countries (Score:5, Informative)
Where I live the Linux versions of the eeepc 901 are impossible to get, Asus simply refuses to release them. They give no reasons, but it is well known that MS have been very active in negotiating with vendors like Asus in trying to curb Linux version sales. It is interesting to note in this regard how MS has backed down on their "maximum 80GB hdd" for using MS-XP, since Asus are selling 120GB XP version of their eeepc's.
Anyway, I find it impressive that Linux sales amounts to a whopping 30% of the eeepc's.
--
Regards
Re:Linux versions are hard to get in some countrie (Score:5, Insightful)
Here's what I think happened:
Several years ago:
Asus: Hey, MS - we are making 8-9" netbook PCs that are going to be small, hip and cheap; wanna give us a good rate on XP - say $X?
MS: Hmmphhh... dream on - you guys pay what everyone else pays - $Y! No exceptions! Oh, and by the way, we'll be phasing out the XP, so plan on running and paying for Vista - $Z!
Asus: OK then, we'll use Linux.
MS: We've heard that before, good luck!
Later:
MS: Hey Asus, your netbook thingies really took off - they have to run XP - we want you to phase out your Linux version.
Asus: Ummm, can't really do that, sorry.
MS: We are giving you (and everyone else) XP licensing deal for $X for netbooks! You'd better do it, or we'll screw with your other products - you know how that goes.
Asus: OK, master, you are the boss, will do.
MS: Good boy.
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So no more small PCs? (Score:5, Insightful)
I thought half the draw of the Eee PC wasn't just the price but the size. Why are they going closer and closer to the size of regular laptops and away from the 8" size?
If they had released a 7" model without the huge bezel around the scree I might have picked one up. Looks like I'll be looking to one of their competitors.
Re:So no more small PCs? (Score:4, Insightful)
Sadly, it is like cars.
A manufacturer brings out a small car. Next year, they increase the engine from 1200cc or 1300c to 1500cc. And they switch from 2-door or 3-door to 4-door or 5 door. And so on.
In a few years, they have to bring out a *new* smaller model, as their "small" model is now too big.
It is all because people want a "small" model that has "added bigness".
Come to think of it, the same thing happens with programming languages. We start with a simple, easy-to-use scripting language. Then people say, "But we need this or that feature that more sophisticated languages have". Before you know it, the simple easy-to-use language has grown into yet another complex, high-powered language which only a full time professional can use.
So someone invents a new simple-to-use language....
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Obligatory bad car analogy (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:cheap PC (Score:5, Interesting)
I don't work for free. I never will - I rather become an electrician than consider becoming a linux developer. My 2c worth! I worked very hard for this career - you don't like it, then sell your computer and watch TV.
Who says Linux devs work for free? Do you know what we pay for LabView on Linux? Or what I am willing to pay for Photoshop?
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Re:cheap PC (Score:4, Interesting)
> I don't work for free. I never will - I rather become an electrician than consider becoming a linux developer
I've got paid for developing software for Linux. There are software companies that write software just for Linux. Just because Linux is free doesn't mean that you could get money when writing software for it.
Also if you must write software for Windows, you can still do it with free cross platform libraries and get support for other platforms for free. Sometimes you can even save in development when choosing these libraries, because they are so good.
At work I use Windows because I'm asked to. At home I use Linux. I write software at work for the company, but at home I write it for the world.
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Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Qt is not free to develop with? funny because it being under gpl says differently. Sure if your trying to make a proprietary product then you'll run into problems, but you can develop your program at zero cost, then either use a GPL compatible license for your product (nothing says you cant sell it) or pay for a license.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
That is just about the polar opposite of my experience. XP is showing its age because shoe-horning it onto an eeepc 901 was a horrible task. The installer is just dumb and can't handle anything but a CD-drive, which I don't have.
I then used the incredible unetbootin [sourceforge.net] to try out a bunch of linux distros from USB sticks and even an SDcard, finally settling on intrepid. Unfortunately it didn't quite "just work" because of the wireless card. (Big surprise)
The netbook platform is unique I feel in not needing the
Re:XP is closer to "just works" for most (Score:5, Interesting)
Windows XP installs quickly,
1. Does it matter for Joe Sixpack how much time does XP take to install if Joe Sixpack doesn't do the install himself?
runs that software
2. If Joe Sixpack uses Internet Exporer because he doesn't know there is another browser, why should he care about using Firefox instead? Same could be said for the rest.
doesn't crash much, and with newer security measures is unlikely to get infected.
3. With the right drivers you mean. But Joe Sixpack didn't install Windows so he doesn't care about that does he? ;)
and with newer security measures is unlikely to get infected.
4. I would be surprised to learn about netbooks shipping with SP3. If they aren't then they are unlikely to get infected if 'getting infected' means the stock Norton antivirus tells you so.
For Linux to compete, it should aim at producing distributions that support as much hardware as XP, have similar friendly installations, and possibly -- dear god did I say it -- run XP software, because win32 is the biggest software base in the world and it's what users want.
5. Ubuntu 7.10 supported my computer's driver infinitely better than the stock Windows XP version. I had to download the drivers using Ubuntu and move them onto the Windows partition.
6. The setup is as friendly if not friendlier.
7. Wine anybody?
8. Have you actually tried Ubuntu 8.04?
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