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Canadian Firms Get Behind OpenMoko/FreeRunner
Posted by
timothy
on Sun Aug 24, 2008 02:29 PM
from the watching-the-tail-lights dept.
from the watching-the-tail-lights dept.
mario writes "Now that the OpenMoko platform has stabilized enough to provide the OM2008 image (supporting the three major toolkits), things are starting to heat up. Linuxdevices is reporting on the start of a port of Devicescape's connect application. Koolu (another Canadian company) is also doing development for its W.E. phone (a branded FreeRunner). Which leads me to ask: Where are the American companies?"
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Openmoko's Open Source Phone Goes Mass-Market 247 comments
nerdyH writes "Openmoko has begun shipping its Linux-based, open source Neo Freerunner phone to five newly announced distributors, in Germany, France, and India, says the company. The Neo Freerunner features an open hardware design, and a Linux-based operating system that users are free to modify. The project originally hoped to produce a mass-market offering last October. The $400 Freerunner will remain available direct, online, too. A 2.5G GPRS/GSM phone like the original iPhone, it boasts a 500MHz processor, WiFi, 3D accelerometers, a 4.3-inch VGA touchscreen, Bluetooth, and built-in GPS."
[+]
Hardware: First North American OpenMoko/FreeRunners Arrive 180 comments
holdenkarau writes "The North American OpenMoko FreeRunners are starting to arrive. It would appear that the OpenMoko still has problems with some 3G networks, including AT&T. Although, in my own personal completely unscientific test, 2 out of 3 AT&T SIM cards worked. Check out the unboxing of a complete FreeRunner (along with debug board) and my experience getting the FreeRunner up and running. Or a direct link to the pictures for those of you bored with text. If you feel brave enough to take the plunge, you can buy your own FreeRunner from the OpenMoko store."
[+]
Linux: Debian On the Openmoko Neo FreeRunner Phone 167 comments
BrianWCarver writes "It was inevitable. One can now run the entire Debian distribution (ARM port) on the Openmoko Neo Freerunner. We previously discussed the July 4th launch of this GNU/Linux-based smartphone, which is open down to its core, with the company providing CAD files and schematics for the phone. Openmoko released an update to their software stack earlier this month, called Om2008.8, which is still a work in progress. But now one can use these instructions on the Debian wiki to open up the possibility of using apt-get to access Debian's more than 20,000 applications on your phone, which, due to integration with freesmartphone.org efforts, can also actually be used as a phone. There were previous efforts to run Debian on the predecessor product to the Neo FreeRunner, the Neo 1973, but with the wider adoption of the Neo FreeRunner and the hard work of many Debian developers at the ongoing DebConf 8, carrying Debian in your pocket has just gotten a lot easier."
[+]
No More OpenMoko Phone 219 comments
TuxMobil writes "Bad news for FreeRunner fans: development of the first Open Source smartphone will be discontinued. (English translation via Google)
OpenMoko executive director Sean Moss-Pulz said at OpenExpo in Bern (Switzerland)
that the number of staffers will be reduced to be able to stay in business. OpenMoko
had high intentions: the offspring from Taiwanese electronic manufacturer First International Computer (FIC)
wanted to produce an Open Source smartphone. Not only with Open Source software pre-installed, but with
free drivers and open specifications of the hardware components. This would give programmers as well
as users complete freedom. Up to now the manufacturer has produced two models, the first has sold 3,000 units and
the second one 10,000. Both models were targeted primarily to developers. From the beginning,
OpenMoko had to fight with different problems. The smartphones came onto the market after a huge delay. Some phones
came with construction defects. Also, changes in the team slowed down the development. Software development
for the current smartphone will be continued but with fewer resources, Moss-Pultz said. He still hopes the
community will support the FreeRunner."
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"Where are the American companies?" (Score:5, Interesting)
Investing their money in Washington crafting laws and developing new business models.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:"Where are the American companies?" (Score:4, Funny)
Parent
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
Last time I checked the map Canada was a country on the American continent. In North America, right next to the USA, to be more precise... but what do I know.
Boring (Score:4, Funny)
Cellphones and America (Score:2, Interesting)
Hmm, from what I've noticed, most cell phone companies are not based in the US. Europe and Asia constitute most of them.
Anyyway, I'm really excited about this as much as I'm frustrated about the number of SDKs to pick up, Symbian, Windows Mobile, now iPhone SDK.. Google's Android and then this!
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
It should be noted that this has been around longer than the iPhone/SDK as well as Google Android. The OpenMoko project was announced [openmoko.org] January 20th, 2007.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
GNU Hurd was announced years before Linux, and look how far that project got.
In computing what counts is shipping / release date.
This is a very good thing (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:This is a very good thing (Score:4, Informative)
No camera.
Parent
Re:This is a very good thing (Score:5, Insightful)
I consider that a plus. If I want to take pictures of something, I'm gonna bring a good camera with me.
Parent
Re:This is a very good thing (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
Can openmoko support both models of phone, one with a cam, the other without?
Most likely
Will both models be offered
Unlikely, business decision will likely nix one
Your need of having the cam with you will most likely overrule the desire of those that want a cheaper phone that does whatever it does, 100%.
It's regrettable, and I'm already offtopic anyways, since the choice you're not being offered has nothing to do with openmoko.
Re: (Score:2)
Heh, well, for me none is better than the highest quality. Or anything in between. I have no particular need for a camera and no particular desire to pay for one (be it in $, g or mL) I won't use.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
... no particular desire to pay for one (be it in $, g or mL)...
you can pay for phones with blood now?
Re:This is a very good thing (Score:4, Informative)
The Neo1973's mini-USB port can be configured to act as a usb host instead of a usb device. This opens up a range of possibilities, such as USB cameras and usb input devices.
Thats for the Neo1973 but it should also be true for the FreeRunner.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Who is forcing you to use the camera? Nobody. If you don't like the camera, just don't use it. It's that simple.
Re: (Score:2)
Yes, but a camera costs money. Ditch the camera and make phones cheaper. I'd rather have have a phone good at calling and SMSing than a jack of all trades machine that fails at everything.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
There are plenty of phones to be had that can do all three. And do camera-less versions of a phone really cost less? I found one article on a camera-less Treo 680 that makes no mention of a price cut. Of course not; they're going to keep the cost difference for themselves. So you may as well have a camera handy for when something unexpected happens -- I know I've gotten some amusing shots with my phone's camera that I would have otherwise missed.
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
Being able to SMS doesn't add a lot to the price, having a useful camera does. ;)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
I must respectfully disagree.
Creating two separate product lines is quite a bit more expensive than one; that added expense will be passed on to the customer. Other manufacturers will create a single line, and not have extra expenses and thus be more competitive.
So, after doing the competitive analysis, most manufacturers will decide to make phones with cameras, which some people may use.
Me, I never use the popcorn button on
Re: (Score:2)
See my comment elsewhere in which I looked at camera-less equivalents of given phones that don't seem to cost less than their camera-equipped versions. Why would you pay the same to get less? That makes even less sense.
I have two cameras (a point and shoot and a full pro DSLR) but a lot of the photos on my phone, which has a pretty decent (for a phone) camera, were captured at times when I never thought I'd see something interesting that I'd want to shoot.
Re: (Score:2)
Is it just me, or is it really a fallacy?
The fact that camera-less versions of a phone do not cost less does not mean they do not cost less to make. It just means that someone along the chain decided to keep the difference in cost.
If it had a camera, FreeRunner would have cost more. Quite a bit more, in fact.
IIRC they even tried to find a suitably free/open camera hardware, but only got a really poor camera, so they decided against it. And it is a good choice: the phone would have been noticeably more exp
Re: (Score:2)
Yes, I realize that they don't cost the same to make. But when the cost is the same to the end user, what does it matter? One option is "you get more for less" and if there's no cost difference to the end user, why select that one?
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
True, focus often sucks. A tip: autofocus is sometimes based on contrast so look for high-contrast areas to place in your photo, if possible. Some AF algorithms also lock more easily onto vertical lines, like the bars of a fence. Also, there is a minimum focus distance with nearly all lenses -- perhaps you're too close? I've gotten lousy images due to that before.
Not saying phone cameras are perfect -- just useful in a pinch.
Re:This is a very good thing (Score:4, Insightful)
The first few releases of Linux sucked too. However, just like Linux, once people start using it for their own purposes, their improvements will make their way back for others to use.
OpenMoko right now is mediocre. OpenMoko in 5 years, after several companies sell products based on it, and dozens of hackers make those devices do new and novel things, and OpenMoko will rock.
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
That describes a lot of open-source in general...
Re: (Score:2)
We geeks are known for having short attention spans it doesn't take much to...oh look, shiny.
American companies (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
probably because they can lock them down more...
Android (Score:2, Interesting)
I think the american companies have put their efforts behind Google...
Working on other things than immature phones (Score:4, Informative)
The OpenMoko project has been around for a long time but it's been development only and unusable for the end user. US cellphone companies want to be able to sell something to end users now. They don't want an unfinished piece of junk that they don't know anything about -- they want their existing suppliers to give them USABLE phones.
Once this thing becomes polished and usable, at least as polished and usable as cell phones get, then we might see some interest.
No we won't. (Score:5, Insightful)
American carriers are not only completely uninterested in a platform that gives the end-user complete control over their phone, but actively shunning it. Their business model is to sell slick-looking, crippled devices that push as much functionality through their networks as possible such that they can charge the end-user as much as they can for things that should be free. Verizon and the V710 debacle a few years ago come directly to mind (disabling OBEX, etc.).
I'll be shocked if we ever see a viable OpenMoko device in the next ten years.
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
Do you mean period or from an existing carrier? If it's sold unlocked there's nothing the GSM carriers at least can do to block it from being used on their networks.
They're blocking it right now. (Score:4, Interesting)
Carriers are exerting pressure on baseband manufacturers to ensure that they do not open specifications required to get open-source software to work with advanced basebands that work with EDGE, EvDO, or HS*PA. So all you get is plain GPRS and voice, on the one baseband that was available to be used with the FreeRunner.
Don't expect this to change anytime soon. It won't. If necessary, the carriers will exert pressure on Congress to pass a law banning open source operating systems on cellular devices in the name of "security."
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
Then why is it you can buy unlocked phones right now that have 3G?
Shunning? You forget Andriod. (Score:4, Insightful)
American carriers are not only completely uninterested in a platform that gives the end-user complete control over their phone, but actively shunning it
Android answers the description you provide, and there seem to be a number of carriers embracing it.
They are driven to do so by the iPhone but that makes little difference in that things are moving that way, and carriers realize now that it will happen sooner rather than later.
Parent
Unlikely (Score:2)
An open-source OS does not mean the end-user can do what they want.
Even with a closed source OS (iPhone) users can do as they like (Jailbreak).
The ease of developing for an open source OS is even greater, since the official SDK grants you a view to the lowest levels of operation and makes it that much easier to change what you like.
Re: (Score:2)
and have the apple staff refuse to look at the device because its jailbroken, what fun.
thing is that the way android is designed, its much how osx is designed.
sure you have a open source kernel and base libs, but everything else above that is at least somewhat proprietary.
android has its own java variation for instance.
Re: (Score:2)
You do realize you're talking about an unreleased system that will be put on unreleased phones? It's awfully early to draw a conclusion about who will and won't support it, and besides, if you really want one you can buy and activate it yourself.
People don't buy unlocked phones because they don't KNOW about them because the phone makers don't do a very good job advertising them. If that changed and it wasn't the service providers running the ads (which are naturally for their own versions) then people might
A few Canadian thoughts... (Score:5, Insightful)
After looking at the Koolu.com website, I'd almost rather they not be referred to as Canadian... it makes us look bad...
So some Canadian firms think that an open-source handset is going to be worthwhile. Great, good for them. The likelihood is that even if they do get anywhere with it, the majority of their clients are going to be in the US anyway. The average person in Canada doesn't know or care about open-source handsets, and isn't going to care enough to learn.
It's kind of like RIM - they were the first to really get mobile, business e-mail out into the world, and now they're famous. Everyone who doesn't have an iPhone has a blackberry these days, and most of RIM's clients are in the US. Where were the American companies? What does it matter?
In this era of free trade and globalization, there's hardly any distinction between American companies and Canadian companies. I work for a Canadian company which is owned by an American company which is run by the Canadian company. We're traded on an American stock exchange, we all work in Canada, and we just bought an American company made up almost entirely of Brits and Irish. So what does that make us?
'Canadian company' these days only refers to locality - where people show up for work at every morning. Beyond that, it doesn't make a difference.
Re: (Score:2)
Subjects to the Queen?
You make no sense. (Score:3)
She exerts no power over us at all, why rebel against her? Figure out what you're talking about for fuck sakes.
The company is Canadian. (Score:2)
In this era of extranational interference, there's hardly any distinction between American companies and Canadian companies.
Just follow the money up the top, ignoring the "holier-than-thou" shareholder class (voting, not mutual fund). You will find that they are Canadian with a desire to end-run business law.
Where were the American companies? What does it matter?
Quality and jurisdictional accountability, perhaps. Think of that next time when a knockoff product breaks too easily. Think of it when you get mindless tech support and shoddy code.
It does make a difference.
Love the concept but too bad about the Glamo gpu (Score:3, Interesting)
This is mainly from the viewpoint of a graphics programmer (3d, gpu drivers, ...), so my comments will focus on that part. I know there are a lot good features on this devices.
The Glamo chip can only use textures of 512 x 512 so it's impossible to use hw acceleration to decompress full screen video (unless you stretch the texture to the entire screen).
The video bus bandwidth is 7m/s which gives a theoretical maximum of 12 fps without hw acceleration. That bus is also shared with the sd card reducing the bandwidth even further if you are accessing the sd card.
SMedia refuses to give out the documentation of their gpu and only employees of OpenMoko have access to that documentation. Implementing 3D for the glamo is low priority. It's obvious it's low priority but it's a shame there's a gpu in there but you can't use it or even improve the driver.
I am going to get modded down for this (Score:2)
I remember reading about the OpenMoko long before the iPhone, and the day the final spec where out I when and bought an Iphone why, no 3G or EDGE
Apple leave 3G out of the first gen iPhone and they get crucified, but this phone has no 3G or EDGE and it is OK because it is open source? WTF!
I would love an open phone. But you have to be the first one to the market with mobile's because of those 18 month contracts. Why do I have to wait two years for them to catch up with other company's who have stuff already
If AT&T/T-Mobile could ban OpenMoko, they woul (Score:2, Insightful)
If AT&T and T-Mobile could legally and technically ban use of OpenMoko phones on their network, they would do it.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
if they could legally ban unlocked phones on their network they would do it. In fact most of their retarded phone workers think this already when I call up for a new sim to add to my plan...
ME: I need a sim to add to my contract.
THEM: SIM why? has your old one stopped?
ME: NO I'm adding a new line to my contract and I need a sim.
THEM: Then you need a phone as well, we have several to choose from....
ME: NO, I need the sim I already have a phone.
THEM: You haveto have an AT&T phone to work on our network.
Dialing from the command line. (Score:5, Funny)
At last, a phone from Linux fanatics! You can dial from the command line. [togaware.com] Just type:
echo 0 >
echo 1 >
cu -l
AT+CFUN=1
AT+CPIN="<pin>"
AT+COPS
ATD<number>
You are now connected. See how easy it is!
Re: (Score:2)
Canadians (and Mexicans) are North Americans in the same way that that French, English, Italians, etc are Europeans. But Canadians are only Americans to the same extent that French, English, Italians, etc are Eurasians.
I've decided that the next time someone from a European country smugly points out that I am an "American" because I'm from "the Americas" or "the American continent" (which assumes that I am obscenely geographically ignorant