Sandia's Laptop Heatpipes Closer To Market

mckennabluedot.com writes "Laptops aren't truly portable until you can stand to sit with one on your lap for more than 30 minutes. Sandia National Labs has developed small copper 'wicks' to transport methanol--and waste heat--from one area of a computer to another, where it can be dispersed more efficiently, comfortably and compactly than with heat sinks. The technology is being licensed to an undisclosed startup." So this stuff (mentioned here previously) might soon make it to a lap near you.

Finally

[batboy78 (255178)]

I'm probably going to be sterile from having my new Powerbook on my laptop all day long. It gets unbelievably hot.

Re:Finally

[SaraSmith (602197)]

Well... I have read about a man burning his penis and scrotum fairly severely from a laptop computer (through clothes)

So sterile may not be all ya get there.

Wish I could remember where I read that so it didn't sound so urban legendy, even though it probably still would/is.

Re:Finally

[Skater (41976)]

Google turned this up:

This Laptop's Too Hot to Handle [wired.com].

Among other links. I didn't see confirmation of the story though...

--RJ

Re:Finally

[pnot (96038)]

I didn't see confirmation of the story though...

Just in case anyone's tempted to write it off as an urban myth, here [thelancet.com] is a link to the original report in The Lancet [thelancet.com], a very well-respected UK medical journal. (Free reg. reqd.)

Ouch.

Re:Finally

[iggymanz (596061)]

The story is here [news.com.au]

Though I don't know why anyone would put a laptop that close to their crotch. I kept mine close to my knees and to the left so the exhaust port (on my former company's T20) dumped heat far from me. No Rocky Mountain Oysters served on my train, thanks.

Let's call it LinGnux - Happy Birthday Richard, and thanks for the compiler & utilities that freed us.

Re:Finally

[wo1verin3 (473094)]

naw.. this woman calls us up (tech support for large vendor) and she goes:

"When i my laptop on the plane it makes me wet between my legs"

Took her a few seconds to realize what she said but had an entire floor of tech support guys cracking up =)

"Glowing Cyber Balls" considered harmful

[K-Man (4117)]

I want to make it clear to everyone here that any reference to the "glowing cyber balls" story, however indirect, is strictly forbidden in this forum.

Re:Finally

[dirkdidit (550955)]

Like you were really going to use that sperm anyway. Remember, you are a member of Slashdot.

iBook

[silvakow (91320)]

I don't mean to sound like "that guy", but my iBook really does not have any problems with heat. I can set it on my lap for a good long while and barely notice any heat. This is one of the reasons that apple has not moved up to the G4 yet, so my computer is quite slow, but at least I never think twice about setting it on my lap for a game of mid-class Starcraft.

non-waste heat?

[heldlikesound (132717)]

Is there such thing as computer heat that is not waste? Unless you are recycling the heat somehow, which seems unfeasable, it seems that all heat would be waste.

Re:non-waste heat?

[NonSequor (230139)]

Well I don't know about computer heat, but it seems to me that any heat produced by a space heater couldn't be considered waste heat. Couldn't any device achieve 100% energy efficiency so long as you redefine the device's task to include providing heat?

Re:non-waste heat?

[neptuneb1 (261497)]

The supercomputer lab I worked at for a while actually used the "waste" heat to heat the building in the winter. Sure, it was just vented during the summer, but for eight months of the year (MN has long winters) they don't have to pay for heating!

heat dispersing

[trmj (579410)]

I guy I know simply uses a chunk of wood (the size of the laptop) to seat his laptop in his lap. It not only gives it a more staple surface, but also allows him to sit comfortably without his legs overheating.

As for myself, I don't have a laptop. Anybody donating?

Re:heat dispersing

[xao gypsie (641755)]

It not only gives it a more staple surface...

by that did you mean that it gives a more maple surface?
i know, i hate puns too....
xao

You can keep them on your lap...

[Bugaboo (266024)]

If you don't always buy the latest desktop replacement from Dell or whoever. My Toshiba Satellite Pro 4330, while getting a little long in the tooth nowadays (playing DivX movies and whatnot; I bought it in early 2001) doesn't break the 'quite warm' barrier and is comfortable for several hours of continued use, even when doing CPU-heavy things.

So remember, not everyone's trying to shove a desktop into a laptop and burning your legs off because of it.

Just wondering ...

[shayborg (650364)]

If the heat isn't dispersed through the bottom, where exactly will it go? Are laptops going to feel cooler because the heat is dispersed better, or is most of the heat just going to be sent out of, say, the top of the laptop cover where it's less of a nuisance?

-- shayborg

Eureka

[carpe_noctem (457178)]

The technology is being licensed to an undisclosed startup.

So THAT's what Dick Cheney has been up to this entire time!

Exhaust Pipes?

[wideBlueSkies (618979)]

So now I can have exhaust pipes coming off my laptop? Cool.

Can they be made to look like the pipes on a Harley [harley-davidson.com]?

Mmmmm chrome....

Re:Exhaust Pipes?

[Montgomery Burns III (642155)]

Not only exhaust pipes, but racing stripes and

flame decals too.

On a semi-serious note, I don't mind the heat too much in the winter, but it can be a real bummer in the summer.

Re:Exhaust Pipes?

[ejaw5 (570071)]

add on a fat coffee-can tip to the pipe and slap on a Type-R sticker and you 486 laptop will be running like a P-4!!

Re:Exhaust Pipes?

[MrEd (60684)]

Overclockers will be putting 6" Type R pipes on the side too, right?

I get this feeling that the noise reduction isn't going to be as much as some people think...

Related Technology: CoolPad

[pheph (234655)]

Although I haven't received mine yet, I've read excellent reviews of the incredibly simple (and cheap) Laptop CoolPad [coolpad.com]. They offer Traveller [coolpad.com] and Podium [coolpad.com] (read: big and clunky) versions... Anyone had any experience with these?

Re:Related Technology: CoolPad

[wideBlueSkies (618979)]

Couldn't you just do the same thing by leaning your laptop on a thin O'reilly book? OK, so maybe you's have to go to the craft store and spend 69 cents on rubber feet to keep the laptop from sliding.

Beats paying $19.99. And you already HAVE the O'reilly book.

Flammable liquid in my lap?

[corebreech (469871)]

Thanks, but I'll pass on this one.

Medium-rare and well-done are adjectives I'd just as soon not see applied to my goodies.

Re:Flammable liquid in my lap?

[bugnuts (94678)]

The amount of "flammable liquid" probably is under a few ml.

Hope you're not driving home in a gasoline-burning vehicle. Reminds me of Archie Bunker, when presented with a meal of tongue exclaims, "I'm not eating anything that came out of a cow's mouth. Gimme some eggs."

Re:Flammable liquid in my lap?

[bugnuts (94678)]

The pipes would have to be tiny in order for capillary action to draw the liquid back through. As you can see in this article [sandia.gov], they are the size of fingerprint grooves.

Even with a name like bugnuts, I don't worry about carrying a lighter in my pocket :p

Methanol?

[nihilogos (87025)]

I'd like to see this option on Dell's site

* Upgrade to Gin or Vodka coolant $49.95

I can see the warnings already...

[dark-br (473115)]

If we can't trust society with a cup of hot McDonalds coffee how can we trust people with phase change methanol?

I can see the warnings stickered to future laptops: Do not use this laptop near an open flame. Smoking near this laptop is strictly prohibited!

Actually....

[Acidic_Diarrhea (641390)]

It appears that we can't trust society with information. I'm tired of everyone citing the infamous hot coffee case as the shining example of a frivolous lawsuit.

In the case that you're "citing" (I use quotes because you obviously don't know any of the facts.) the coffee was served at 180 F. This is quite a bit hotter than one expects to receive coffee at. For a fun experiment, try brewing some coffee and taking the temperature of it. Your experiment won't yield coffee at this temperature. Second of all, the McDonalds outlet had received over 700 complaints about their coffee being too hot. Other McDonalds have not and do not receive this many complaints about their coffee. It was partially because of these complaints that McDonalds was found negligent - they had plenty of information that the coffee was too hot but chose to ignore it because it was considered better for business to keep the coffee hot at all times so fewer fresh pots would have to be made. Furthermore, the woman in question (79 years old when the incident occured - your typical "victim" looking to get rich quick, right? Oh wait, she'd never filed a lawsuit before in her life.) received third degree burns on her groin, thighs, and buttocks. These burns required skin grafts and an extended stay in the hospital. The woman racked up medicals bill as a result of this. The award was also reduced from the original 2.6 million dollar settlement to 480,000 dollars.

Understanding law isn't quite as easy as just reading some headlines Mohammed.

but

[xao gypsie (641755)]

but that takes away from the good ol' days of snuggling by the laptop on a cold winter's night, surfing the internet wishing the laptop was a woman and the heat source was a real fire......*sigh*......im lonely...

xao

Re:but

[wideBlueSkies (618979)]

Yeah, and on those [b]really[/b] lonely nights you'd get a little thrill when the fan kicks in.

I know. I've been there.

Spontaneous combustion.

[index72 (591909)]

Whith all these heat sources and readily available combustible fuels around its only a matter of time before one of these computer heads is gonna get torched.

Computers shouldn't heat up.

[rice_burners_suck (243660)]

What I would like to see is a laptop that doesn't burn up in the first place. I have one of those Sony laptops where an internal fan comes on when it begins to overheat. The hotter the computer gets, the faster (and louder) this fan becomes. It is actually quite annoying.

Now I find it acceptable that a computer can heat up somewhat during computationally intensive functions, like performing a huge batch job with Photoshop or something, but what annoys me a lot about this fan thing is that it seems to come on at the darnedest times. For example, if some application crashes, the fan comes on, then goes faster, then goes even faster, and finally it's spinning at its maximum speed, which sounds like a bunch of banshees flying around when there are heavy winds. All of this while the computer remains totally unresponsive to any input.

This has annoyed me so much on many occasions that I often consider disassembling the computer and removing that stupid fan. Yeah, it'll overheat, but at least I don't have to listen to that shit.

My suggestion, as far as heat is concerned, is that laptops can be built utilizing processors that use little energy and stay cool. Yes, these are much slower than your Pentium CXXVCVXIIIXCIX, but if you put about 5 of them in there, it won't be so bad. In fact, it might even be a bit faster in some cases. I wish people would consider that. What annoys me the most about this is that the computer seems to heat up during computing-intensive

Re:Computers shouldn't heat up.

[EmbeddedJanitor (597831)]

The best part of using heat pipes is that you can seal the box better and vent the heat where you choose. Heat pipes are increadibly conductive (up to approx 3000x the conductivity of copper). Fans are a problem because the draw dust etc into the laptop. This can form an insulating layer which prevents good heat transfer.

I agree with your sentiments that laptops should not heat up. Basically this is mainly an x86 problem. With more efficient code and using cooler chips (ARM, MIPS,...) you have a far better

Re:Computers shouldn't heat up.

[evilviper (135110)]

My suggestion, as far as heat is concerned, is that laptops can be built utilizing processors that use little energy and stay cool. Yes, these are much slower than your Pentium CXXVCVXIIIXCIX

Actually, there is nothing stopping low power processors from being just as fast, if not faster, than the hi-heat x86 processors. The only problem is that the price goes up. No more 2GHz processor for $50. The current line of Alphas are good examples.

That's the great thing about using open source software. You are

*Glowing* Hot* Cyber* Balls!*

[teamhasnoi (554944)]

Here in Minnesota, we like hot laptops. If your G4 Powerbook is bothering you in your not-so-frosty climes, please send it to me.

You will have done a good deed, and have the satifaction that some Minnesota girl is removing some of her clothing while using your old hardware. After me, that is.

Hot and Bothered?

[Myriad (89793)]

Laptops aren't truly portable until you can stand to sit with one on your lap for more than 30 minutes.

Wait a sec... isn't getting all hot and bothered down there supposed to be a good thing?

What? It's not? Do what with a girl?.....ohhhhhhhhhhhhhh I get it! So you're saying I've had it all wrong all this time? Damn...

Blockwars [blockwars.com]: a realtime, head-to-head game similar to Tetris.

maybe YOUR laptop is too hot

[anonymous loser (58627)]

I have a Sharp MV12W [cnet.com] and have had no trouble sitting for many hours (usually all day in my current situation) with it on my lap, even wearing shorts.

That being said, my previous laptop (or craptop, as I like to think of it) was a Dell 8000 series. Not only did the thing weigh a metric ton, it also produced enough heat to fry eggs.

The only thing I sorta regret with my current laptop is the lack of screen real estate. However, given that the screen size on the Dell actually prohibited me from opening the thing up all the way on an airplane (unless I was in first class), and the travelling weight of my current laptop is less than half (nearly 1/3)of the Dell, it's a trade-off I'm more than willing to make.

Heh

[Anonvmous Coward (589068)]

Heatpipes? I wonder how many people are going to find this story while searching for .. uh.. adult stories.

Mmmmm

[NiftyNews (537829)]

Maybe someone will create a heat-sink mod that transfer the heat to a tiny griddle instead.

Mmmm....laptop steak.

apple's already done it...

[esoteric0 (105786)]

the lcd imac (and i think the Tibook aslo) already uses heat pipes. sandia is way behind.

If you're wondering who needs this

[arvindn (542080)]

Doctor, doctor, my laptop's burnt my penis! [silicon.com]

Heatpipes rock

[Trogre (513942)]

The heatpipe attached to my Athlon cpu works pretty well. The temperature drop after replacing my AMD fan/heatsink combo was between 5 and 10 degrees C.

More info here

[bugnuts (94678)]

more info [sandia.gov]

They have thought of redirecting the heat for "hand warmers" but one of the things heat pipes really buys you is lack of moving parts and fan requirements... in other words, you can use it for silent or even a waterproof computer.

Why waste the heat?

[BlueFall (141123)]

Why can't the heat be used to recharge the battery and give it a longer run time? Seems like this just throws away energy...

Re:Why waste the heat?

[karlm (158591)]

Energy must be thrown away in any system consuming energy at steady state. See second law of thermodynamics.

If you put a heat engine on the CPU, you reduce energy transfer versus a heatsink/heatpipe. You coul recover a small percentage of the power, but it's really not worth it.

Re:Let me get this straight...

[geogeek6_7 (566395)]

The bodies of the thousands of innocent civilians who died (and will die) in these unprecedented events could give a good god damn about obscure science fiction, your childish Lego models, your nerf toy guns and whining about the lack of a "fun" workplace, your Everquest/Diablo/D&D fixation, the latest Cowboy Bebop rerun, or any of the other ways you are "getting on with your life" (here's a hint: watching Cowboy Bebop in your jammies and eating a bowl of Shreddies is *not* "getting on with your life")

Re:Ignorant question?

[ejaw5 (570071)]

you mean not operating the laptop flat on your lap? interesting, to me using a laptop on your lap is sort of a balancing act. you got to have the base at the right position, and screen open not too far so it won't jump off your lap as soon as you take your hands off the keyboard. Then you have to also compensate for air openings on the side (or God forbid on the bottom), make sure your clothing don't block them.

Re:Ignorant question?

[NoData (9132)]

This might be an ignorant question, but what happenes if you tilt it.

Nothing, I think. These tubes will be less than the thickness of a human hair (according the article), so flow will be much more governed by capillary action and pressure gradients produced by heat differences.

Re:Ignorant question?

[gl4ss (559668)]

nothing, heatpipes are not dependand on gravity(thats why they got that wick inside, and thats what they claim).

on a sidenote however, i could just swear that this is just some companys hop in announcement to the market and nothing totally _new_ as many laptops ALREADY have these, and it's not about cooler running laptops either, it's just moving the heat to another place from the components.